2018 Ontario General Election

[FJAG]

Are you kidding? The PC party could run a cardboard Fig11 target and make no policy announcements and still win an election based solely on the history of failure and fiscal mismanagement from the Liberal Party of Ontario. You'll only need to look to the upcoming testimony of Kathleen Wynne at the bribery trial of her former chief of staff to get all the negative press in the world; 6 months before the election.

I thought that about the last election. Boy, was I wrong.  :facepalm:

:cheers:

 

[PuckChaser]

I don't think the Liberals were polling in the low teens, with many regional polls showing they may be in danger of not having official party status.

Patrick Brown isn't the best leader, but he's good enough and just needs to run a clean campaign focused solely on Liberal mismanagement and corruption.

 

[observor 69]

So how'd that anyone but Trump campaign work for Hilary. 

 

[Lumber]

So how'd that anyone but Trump campaign work for Hilary. 

She lost HARD to the "Anyone But Hilary" campaign.

I know on here I've more or less been a supported of the MSM, and I still am, but I definitely acknowledge how powerful they can be at obscuring the true reality of the political climate, and I discovered this quite surprsingly when I was last in the USA.

In Canada, we are mostly or less limited to progressive, liberal media, and they have a different spin than more conservative sources (obviously). Leading up to the election last year, there was no other message in Canada other than "Trump is chaos and depravity incarnate".

On the other hand, I was on vacation in the US during the election and the week leading up to it. Despite being in a blue-liberal state, we got the opportunity to see actual Trump campaign commercials, and boy was it eye opening.

These commercials were actually really well done, and while they didn't make me think any better of Trump, they certainly made me see why the "Anyone but Hilary" campaign was so strong; it was very compelling.

 

[Shrek1985]

Are you kidding? The PC party could run a cardboard Fig11 target and make no policy announcements and still win an election based solely on the history of failure and fiscal mismanagement from the Liberal Party of Ontario. You'll only need to look to the upcoming testimony of Kathleen Wynne at the bribery trial of her former chief of staff to get all the negative press in the world; 6 months before the election.

Your assertion is reasonable and logical; too bad Ontario Voters are not.

Just the promise of a $15/hour minimum wage has bought a lot of immovable support.

But can you counter any of my points, besides to say that I am wrong?

 

[The Bread Guy]

Are you kidding? The PC party could run a cardboard Fig11 target and make no policy announcements and still win an election based solely on the history of failure and fiscal mismanagement from the Liberal Party of Ontario.

A few folks said words to that effect last time, but it didn't work out that way.

I'd love to hear from anyone closer to the Ontario party on this:  CBC/MSM hype notwithstanding, are things really this bad between Brown & the party/party members?
Is Ontario PC Leader Patrick Brown truly in 'a war' with his own party? -- Disgruntled conservatives unhappy with Brown's leadership are worried it could cost them election ..."

 

[PuckChaser]

Tim Hudak was a victim of the MSM and big public sector unions distorting his plan to reduce the massive amount of PS jobs by attrition. You can't fight back when un-checked union spending and MSM bias is telling everyone he's going to just fire 100,000 people the day he takes office.

Wynne is polling at 18%. Brown needs to run a leader's race with no huge policy announcements and continually hammer the Liberals mismanagement of hydro, Ornge, bribery scandal, gas plants to just name a few to win. Polling suggests Wynne is even in danger of losing safe Toronto laurentian elite ridings. You'll start seeing rats leaving the sinking ship of the Ontario Liberal party in the next 6 months as MPPs decide they're not going to run for re-election to save the ego drop of losing handily. So they'll have lots of rookie candidates, a massive history of misspent public dollars, and a despised leader in Wynne. Its like a perfect storm of election failure in the making for the Liberals.

 

[The Bread Guy]

Tim Hudak was a victim of the MSM and big public sector unions distorting his plan to reduce the massive amount of PS jobs by attrition ...

So you're guessing "the history of failure and fiscal mismanagement" is going to have more of an effect against the Liberals than this did?  For now -- and it's still a loooong time before ballots are cast in June -- Wynne is still the one I'd bet my loonie on.

Wynne is polling at 18%. Brown needs to run a leader's race with no huge policy announcements and continually hammer the Liberals mismanagement of hydro, Ornge, bribery scandal, gas plants to just name a few to win.

We'll see ...

 

[CountDC]

Left Ontario in 2012 thinking it couldn't get any worse, in 2016 I came back and realized I was wrong.

Brown needs am image expert to help him out.  I see him on the TV and go into defence mode.  There is just something about him that makes me not trust him at all.  In fact if I was forced to vote for one of them Wynne would get it even though I can't stand her.  At least I already know what I am getting with her while he just plane scares me.  She is the bully that picks on you, he comes across as the "friend" that is going to help you and then stabs you in the back.

 

[The Bread Guy]

... There is just something about him that makes me not trust him at all...

Never met the man in person, but I get more of a "lack of charisma" vibe than a "can't trust him" one.

 

[Shrek1985]

I'll be voting for Brown, but I hate him and I hate what he's done to the party. As a CPC member, I loath what he's doing. At the prov level, it's basically not a conservative party anymore; it's the liberals with as few scruples and no track record.

Better than the NDP? Certainly. But not much different from the Liberals in policy or outlook anymore. Just *maybe* better.

if they get in, I see them failing hard and setting us up for another 20 years of Liberal rule.

 

[Edward Campbell]

I'll be voting for Brown, but I hate him and I hate what he's done to the party. As a CPC member, I loath what he's doing. At the prov level, it's basically not a conservative party anymore; it's the liberals with as few scruples and no track record.

Better than the NDP? Certainly. But not much different from the Liberals in policy or outlook anymore. Just *maybe* better.

if they get in, I see them failing hard and setting us up for another 20 years of Liberal rule.

And that is, basically, what Ontarians have said they wanted, election after election after election, ever since Bill Davis in the 1970s ~ when he swung Ontario, fairly sharply away from Leslie Frost and John Robarts and aligned the province with Pierre Trudeau's big spending, culture of entitlement vision. Mike Harris was, of course, the exception, called in to prove the rule, after Peterson/Rae took things too far. I suspect Patrick Brown will try to steer a moderate course but will be forced to tackle spending and will be unpopular for it.

 

[Shrek1985]

And that is, basically, what Ontarians have said they wanted, election after election after election, ever since Bill Davis in the 1970s ~ when he swung Ontario, fairly sharply away from Leslie Frost and John Robarts and aligned the province with Pierre Trudeau's big spending, culture of entitlement vision. Mike Harris was, of course, the exception, called in to prove the rule, after Peterson/Rae took things too far. I suspect Patrick Brown will try to steer a moderate course but will be forced to tackle spending and will be unpopular for it.

It is not what Ontarians want, it is maybe a suicide pact the rest of us have tacitly agreed to with Toronto and that's the best I can say about it.

I don't believe there is one answer to politics; that the Liberals are on a mission from the UN to make us not just post-nation, but post-political, that we have a Natural-Ruling Party.

But, if you really believe that, E.R. Campbell; that our country is just on the way to the same sad state of affairs most places in Europe have where elections are arguments between competing socialists, then we're done. We've just handed in another proof to the theory that Democracy only lasts so long as people don't realize that they can just vote themselves money for nothing.

What I see and hear when I talk to people is that many are tired of this same old nonsense and want real, revolutionary change, but we a) lack a candidate and party to vote for and b) it doesn't matter what most of the province/nation wants; Toronto picks our leaders and the rest of us can go hang.

Mark my words; Brown will lose and lose badly; the liberals will get another majority or minority and the NDP will be the opposition; they deserve that as they have been doing a better job at it than the CPC for years now. The CPC at all levels needs to be gutted if it is to survive. If not it will be replaced. CPC members especially are disgusted with Brown and Scheer.

 

[mariomike]

It is not what Ontarians want, it is maybe a suicide pact the rest of us have tacitly agreed to with Toronto and that's the best I can say about it.

Toronto picks our leaders and the rest of us can go hang.

Maybe let Toronto go its own way? ( Province of Toronto? Where's the door.  )

Metro Toronto Chairman Godfrey brought it up back in the 1970's in front of a Royal Commission.

"Political observers say the change is unlikely to happen, given it would require the approval of Parliament and seven of the provinces, with at least 50 per cent of the population."
Toronto Star March 16, 2010

#TORexit

 

[ModlrMike]

I suspect Patrick Brown will try to steer a moderate course but will be forced to tackle spending and will be unpopular for it.

Case in point: Manitoba. Pallister is getting beaten up pretty hard at having to manage 17 years of NDP excess.

 

[Rifleman62]

Case in point: Manitoba. Pallister is getting beaten up pretty hard at having to manage 17 years of NDP excess.

That's what happens when you are a Have Not Province and get equalization payments to spend and spend.

http://nationalpost.com/news/politics/have-not-provinces-getting-too-much-equalization-money-brad-wall-says

 

[Shrek1985]

Case in point: Manitoba. Pallister is getting beaten up pretty hard at having to manage 17 years of NDP excess.

Well that's another problem and one only recently illuminated to me;

Conservative government as a chance to "Service the engine" run down by leftists.

 

[McG]

Maybe let Toronto go its own way? ( Province of Toronto? Where's the door.  )

That idea has its own thread (well, inclusive of other city-provinces such as Vancouver, Montreal, and a National Capital District).

https://army.ca/forums/threads/124115.0.html