2022 CPC Leadership Discussion: Et tu Redeux

[Good2Golf]

PP isn’t stupid, and equally, it is not unreasonable for us to expect at least a bit of principled conduct from someone who could be the next party leader. I and my wife have had personal interactions and lack of interactions from him personally during the last campaign that really put us off. Outright dishonest portrayal of his interaction with us and other constituents in our riding. He needs to build better if he expects to get our vote.

 

[suffolkowner]

With respect to the Bank of Canada and its governor, I think I posted this before

Government Directive​

Marginal note:Consultations

• 14 (1) The Minister and the Governor shall consult regularly on monetary policy and on its relation to general economic policy.
• Marginal note:Minister’s directive
  (2) If, notwithstanding the consultations provided for in subsection (1), there should emerge a difference of opinion between the Minister and the Bank concerning the monetary policy to be followed, the Minister may, after consultation with the Governor and with the approval of the Governor in Council, give to the Governor a written directive concerning monetary policy, in specific terms and applicable for a specified period, and the Bank shall comply with that directive.
• Marginal noteublication and report
  (3) A directive given under this section shall be published forthwith in the Canada Gazette and shall be laid before Parliament within fifteen days after the giving thereof, or, if Parliament is not then sitting, on any of the first fifteen days next thereafter that either House of Parliament is sitting.

 

[brihard]

When PP states he is going to fire/replace/remove/excommunicate the BoC governor, most people will understand that if elected PP will do something at sometime where the end result is a different BoC governor... and you folks will be like; "See!? He lied! He didn't fire him, he just somehow enabled a situation where he was replaced!". The inability to see through the weeds is why DND can't have nice things, even simple ones like a modern pistol.

You’re out to lunch. He has used both the words “replace” and “fire”. He has said “fire” over and over. His meaning is very clear. The BoC governor’s term runs for a year and a half beyond the next election, so he isn’t talking about simply not offering him another term.

Literally search “fire” on his Twitter and you get a ton of immediate relevant results, as seen below.

You cannot continue to pretend this isn’t what he means, and keep your integrity intact. He has repeatedly made a promise to do something a Prime Minister does not have the authority to do. Obviously you didn’t know better (though now you do), but he sure as hell does. So I ask you again: is he incompetent or lying?

 

[QV]

Oh boy... you're seeing red. I can't believe you put this much effort to argue semantics. And using your junior interview skills to solicit the result you are after: "is he incompetent or lying?". This is comedy. Thank you for the laugh.

PP wants the existing BoC governor replaced, I believe that will happen under a PP government. How it happens...nobody cares.

 

[Good2Golf]

PP wants the existing BoC governor replaced, I believe that will happen under a PP government. How it happens...nobody cares.

Exactly. Nobody cared how Trudeau replaced the Attorney General…so why worry about how PP as PM would replace the BoC Governor.

 

[brihard]

Oh boy... you're seeing red. I can't believe you put this much effort to argue semantics. And using your junior interview skills to solicit the result you are after: "is he incompetent or lying?". This is comedy. Thank you for the laugh.

PP wants the existing BoC governor replaced, I believe that will happen under a PP government. How it happens...nobody cares.

Not at all, I find this amusing. What effort? Screenshot ring the first six tweets for ‘fire’ from his Instagram took about 30 seconds, and posting them maybe another ten.

He either doesn’t know what he’s doing, or heMs wilfully dishonest. You have been given all the information needed to see that. If you refuse to commit to one or the other, that’s fine, and utterly predictable.

The facts aren’t on your side so you’re trying to go after me instead. Just take the L, my man.

 

[Good2Golf]

…or move to Carleton riding to vote for him personally in the next election.

 

[brihard]

…or move to Carleton riding to vote for him personally in the next election.

View attachment 72459

That’s the fun part of this; I actually get to vote against the guy. I have no illusions, he’ll likely take the riding easily, but I can walk the talk.

 

[Good2Golf]

That’s the fun part of this; I actually get to vote against the guy. I have no illusions, he’ll likely take the riding easily, but I can walk the talk.

As can I; heck he jogs by my house often and I walk past his.

Others…some chatter from afar.

Deeds speak.

 

[Remius]

As can I; heck he jogs by my house often and I walk past his.

Others…some chatter from afar.

Deeds speak.

Same here. While he doesn’t jog by my house I’ve seen how he campaigns door to door. It’s kind of funny how he sends in his minions first. If the response is positive he jumps out of the bushes to talk, if negative he skips. I’ve spoken to him twice in person. He presents well enough one on one. I’ll give him that. But like some have mentioned, it will take some doing to get me to vote for him.

 

[Good2Golf]

Same here. While he doesn’t jog by my house I’ve seen how he campaigns door to door. It’s kind of funny how he sends in his minions first. If the response is positive he jumps out of the bushes to talk, if negative he skips. I’ve spoken to him twice in person. He presents well enough one on one. I’ll give him that. But like some have mentioned, it will take some doing to get me to vote for him.

Funny you mention that Remius, that’s part of his rubbing us the wrong way. During one round of campaigning, we were at our next door neighbours’, and he came up the driveway huffing and puffing (for show) the actually says, “Whew! You caught me running like an immigrant!”

Our neighbours and we were stunned! None of us said anything, we were still trying to process just how he thought saying that was a good idea. I think he at least figured that was a bit of a gaff, because he just handed us a couple of pamphlets, and excused himself and puffed away down the street to the next house.

He has some work to do being more genuine and honest.

That’s why I take issue with his near casual looseness with the truth.

 

[Halifax Tar]

The crazy part about all this is the Cons are polling ahead for.... the first time since JT took the reigns ?

Welcome to 338Canada

338canada.com

 

[SeaKingTacco]

I think it has more to do with Trudeau fatigue, than any real love of the CPC.

 

[The Bread Guy]

Funny you mention that Remius, that’s part of his rubbing us the wrong way. During one round of campaigning, we were at our next door neighbours’, and he came up the driveway huffing and puffing (for show) the actually says, “Whew! You caught me running like an immigrant!” ....

It's things like that that leave an impression on voters one-on-one - for better or worse - for sure.

His latest on YT

Brings up loads of legit zingers, but my one beef: while he rags on the PM for long line-ups for passports, he's saying it wasn't the PM standing in line for them. Yeah, I know it's "rhetoric", but would PP stand in line for his own passport if/when he becomes PM? Other than that, more well-executed message craft.

 

[Good2Golf]

While he has many legit points, I don't like being treated as if I'm not able to identify BS points as well - get rid of the bumpf* and ensure solid delivery of the legit points, so he doesn't ever have to regret or explain away a BS rhetorical point. And he definitely needs to filter his 'jazzing with the common person' lexicon. Our other neighbours (Kosovar refugees who arrived in Canada in 1999 with just the clothes on their backs, now an MD and s/w Engineer) were probably the most horrified at his words, and rightly so.

*Edit: for spelling

 

[RangerRay]

While he has many legit points, I don't like being treated as if I'm not able to identify BS points as well - get rid of the bumps and ensure solid delivery of the legit points, so he doesn't ever have to regret or explain away a BS rhetorical point. And he definitely needs to filter his 'jazzing with the common person' lexicon. Our other neighbours (Kosovar refugees who arrived in Canada in 1999 with just the clothes on their backs, now an MD and s/w Engineer) were probably the most horrified at his words, and rightly so.

I thought he sounded like the nerd in high school trying too hard to use the “hip” lingo and be funny.

I weep for the party and this country.

 

[Remius]

Opinion: Where would Poilievre take the Conservatives? Not to the far right, but the far out

His campaign – a grab bag of grievances and resentments, plus a few shiny objects – is aimed squarely at attracting support from extremists

www.theglobeandmail.com

Sums up some of my concerns with PP.

 

[RangerRay]

I was attracted to conservatism because they were supposed to be the steely-eyed, cold rationalists who would make decisions based on reason an reality. Now, the right is just as emotional and extreme as the left. They are exploiting peoples’ feelings rather than appealing to intellect, and saying to hell with character. It makes me physically ill thinking about it.

 

[TacticalTea]

Opinion: Where would Poilievre take the Conservatives? Not to the far right, but the far out

His campaign – a grab bag of grievances and resentments, plus a few shiny objects – is aimed squarely at attracting support from extremists

www.theglobeandmail.com

Sums up some of my concerns with PP.

Pisses me off that the people of this country seem to keep missing every opportunity to take the right direction, at every god damn turn. There are some far better, more credible options than PP in this race.

It seems France has some good ideas wrt to how elections should be run. AFAIK, all candidates run in the same election, no party-specific primaries. That seems to allow parties to put forward individuals that better represent the country as a whole, and not just the particular party's base. (that's not to say their system is perfect)

 

[IKnowNothing]

I was attracted to conservatism because they were supposed to be the steely-eyed, cold rationalists who would make decisions based on reason an reality. Now, the right is just as emotional and extreme as the left. They are exploiting peoples’ feelings rather than appealing to intellect, and saying to hell with character. It makes me physically ill thinking about it.

Key example: inflation

Misdirection re: the real problems to stoke and direct anger at political enemies, often with messaging that is straight up contradictory.

No mention of US refinery shortages caused by closures brought about by COVID cratering demand in early 2020 spiking refining margins.
No mention of the plastic resin shortages that lead to a 50+% spike in raw input prices through the summer of 2021.
No shame self contradiction regarding fuel being an inelastic good and requirement to life but fuel driven inflation is somehow caused by income supports.

It's all "their" fault. There are no problems in need of complicated solutions. There are no problems that in the short run a simply out of our control. Just hop on the anger train and it will all be better.