A Deeply Fractured World

[Czech_pivo]

We don't know that. All we know is they chose Trump over the alternative. They may have despised Trump's flaws and ignorance, but despised Biden's infirmity and dishonesty and Harris's incompetence and blathering more. No-one else gets to substitute his definition of "focus enough" for theirs just because he preferred the other outcome. That's just whining.

Whining about a government for which we get to cast a vote is paid for. Whining about someone else's is not.

Except I do get to whine because I did vote.

 

[Remius]

Sure. Regrets that my comments got your nose so out of joint.

Not at all. I appreciate the opportunity to highlight the hypocrisy.

 

[Brad Sallows]

Except I do get to whine because I did vote.

Carry on then.

 

[Halifax Tar]

Except I do get to whine because I did vote.

As much I as I wish it was other wise, voter or not, we all get to whine about politics...

 

[Brad Sallows]

Not at all. I appreciate the opportunity to highlight the hypocrisy.

About anything that matters? My main point is the reminder - which I've made repeatedly here - that no-one can meaningfully attribute reasons to another's vote without a direct inquiry to the voter. "They voted for this" is vacuous, especially when done without explicitly acknowledging that every election is a choice between finite alternatives and that people reasonably can disagree on the alternatives depending on what their most important (often single) issues are. Moreover, "they voted for this" is mere blackguarding, whether intended or not. I am willing to pig-wrestle a bit, but those concerned with tone should neither comment so, or support such comments.

My secondary point is just a rehash of an old saw: if you didn't vote, you shouldn't complain. If you did vote, complain away. I mostly don't know who is and is not a dual Canadian-US citizen here, and my default is to assume Canadian only. If I'm wrong about a person, I'm wrong; the general point stands.

 

[ytz]

This isn't new for the world. It just hasn't been a thing since 1914.

And like it not, the biggest most powerful kids on the playground set the terms.

Their definition of the most powerful here is what is laughable.

Russia has an economy the size of Italy. Japan has no nukes and constitutional prohibitions against expeditionary ops. India has GDP per capita on par with Africa which substantially limits their geopolitical ambitions, since they have to massively prioritize development. If you want to argue they are considering regional powers or large populations they left out Brazil and South Korea. And like I said, leaving out two P5 members who are nuclear powers, G7 economies and have expeditionary militaries is particularly ridiculous. But fits their Russian inspired worldview of all Europe just being subordinate. It's so amateur. A well read high school student or ChatGPT could have done better.

 

[Altair]

Salty

I was talking about western democracies and then you source...not western democracies.

Nothing salty about it, the USA is just behind the curve or on the wrong side of history more often than not. We should do everything possible to move away from them.

 

[Altair]

Their definition of the most powerful here is what is laughable.

Russia has an economy the size of Italy. Japan has no nukes and constitutional prohibitions against expeditionary ops. India has GDP per capita on par with Africa which substantially limits their geopolitical ambitions, since they have to massively prioritize development. If you want to argue they are considering regional powers or large populations they left out Brazil and South Korea. And like I said, leaving out two P5 members who are nuclear powers, G7 economies and have expeditionary militaries is particularly ridiculous. But fits their Russian inspired worldview of all Europe just being subordinate. It's so amateur. A well read high school student or ChatGPT could have done better.

Russia is powerful the same way a suicide bomber or Chihuahua is.

The willingness to commit suicide in order to achieve their goal in attacking another is not something to scoff at.

Should they be on the list? No. And if they are on the list because of nukes then add Pakistan.

The list is hot garbage. The interesting part is they felt confident enough to release that hot garbage.

 

[ytz]

The interesting part is they felt confident enough to release that hot garbage.

They didn't. Somebody leaked this detail from their high side version.

 

[Altair]

They didn't. Somebody leaked this detail from their high side version.

I'm not sure if that makes it better or worse.

 

[QV]

I'm not sure if that makes it better or worse.

Neither. It makes it questionable if it's even true. And if you haven't learned by now, the political enemies of those in power often "leak" false attributes.

 

[Kirkhill]

So.....

Trump's World

Trumpland + China + Russia
India and Japan along for the ride.

Problem

Too many other actors like Canada, the UK, the EU and the CPTPP group

....

Carney is flying all over the place
One of his stops was to the UAE,
Unusual for a Canadian PM but not so unusual for an investment banker.
Starmer is also racking up the miles.

....

"Sir Chris Bryant, the Trade Secretary, does understand – I hope – because he was in Melbourne last month launching the inaugural trade dialogue between the EU and the 12-strong bloc known as the CPTPP – or Comprehensive and Progressive Agreement for Trans-Pacific Partnership (please change the name, comrades) – which happens to include the United Kingdom.

"He was sitting around the table with Maroš Šefčovič, the EU’s trade chief, not as a Brexit supplicant in a cross-Channel spat but as a global equal, cajoling the EU into slimming down its petty and anachronistic impediments to trade.

"The EU and the CPTPP together make up 32pc of global GDP and 34pc of trade. The figures will blow through 40pc because Indonesia, the Philippines, the United Arab Emirates and several Latin American states have applied to join the CPTPP. It today includes Japan, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, Vietnam, Malaysia, Singapore, Mexico, Peru, Chile and Brunei."


The Telegraph

Ambrose Evans-Pritchard
A customs union would be worthless in the post-European age
The EU is in systemic crisis and incapable of delivering rational policy

Ambrose Evans-Pritchard
International Business Editor, Singapore
Ambrose Evans-Pritchard
11 December 2025 3:10pm GMT


....

Sir Chris Bryant is Starmer's Trade Secretary.

Britain, famously, is outside the EU. But it has relations with the EU.
It also has relations with Australia, Canada and New Zealand.
It continues to demonstrate its interest beyond Suez sailing RN vessels in Pacific waters
It recently gained admission to the CPTPP
It joined Australia, New Zealand and Canad in the club along with Malaysia, Singapore and Brunei as well as Vietnam, Mexico, Peru and Chile.
And, of course, Japan.
Applicants to the club include the UAE, Indonesia, the Phillipines as well as Ecuador, Costa Rica and Colombia. And Uruguay.
South Korea is reconsidering joining.

As the article notes, collectively they represent more than 40% of global GDP and global trade.


US share of GDP - 25%
US share of trade - 10%

China's share of GDP - 18%
China's share of trade - 13%

India's share of GDP - 5%
India's share of trade - 2%

Russia's share of GDP - 3%
Russia's share of trade - 1%

For interest's sake

Canada's share of GDP - 2%
Canada's share of trade - 1%

.....

If the rest of the OECD can get their act together, and learn to tolerate each other, then perhaps Trump's Authoritarian Compact can be managed by the congregation. All they need is a Moderator.

 

[ytz]

Neither. It makes it questionable if it's even true. And if you haven't learned by now, the political enemies of those in power often "leak" false attributes.

You can read the article I linked to above. And it's completely consistent with Trump and Hegseth talking about a "G2" and their business deal errrr peace agreement with Russia. There's also been zero denials about any of this from the Administration.

 

[Good2Golf]

Classified version of the US NSS says 5 countries should run the world. US, China, Russia, India and Japan.

…article…

They've basically defaulted to some version of the Russian and Chinese worldview. Excluding two nuclear powers is wild. Like I said, they've lost their marbles.

And like I said, leaving out two P5 members who are nuclear powers, G7 economies and have expeditionary militaries is particularly ridiculous.

America for the most part considers UK a vassal nuclear state.

 

[Brad Sallows]

So.....

Trump's World

Trumpland + China + Russia
India and Japan along for the ride.

Problem

Too many other actors like Canada, the UK, the EU and the CPTPP group

Sure has a talent for things that get up peoples' (countries') noses and prompt them to move out of their comfort zones to reassert themselves.

 

[QV]

You can read the article I linked to above. And it's completely consistent with Trump and Hegseth talking about a "G2" and their business deal errrr peace agreement with Russia. There's also been zero denials about any of this from the Administration.

Pretty strong denial right in the article:


After this story was published, the White House denied the existence of any version of the National Security Strategy other than the one published online.

“No alternative, private, or classified version exists,” spokeswoman Anna Kelly told Defense One. “President Trump is transparent and put his signature on one NSS that clearly instructs the U.S. government to execute on his defined principles and priorities.”

Kelly then added that “any other so-called ‘versions’ are leaked by people distant from the President who, like this ‘reporter,’ have no idea what they are talking about.’ ”

 

[The Bread Guy]

Neither. It makes it questionable if it's even true. And if you haven't learned by now, the political enemies of those in power often "leak" false attributes.

Like the guys who leaked CSIS info about Chinese interference to the Globe & Mail et.al., for example? Yeah, just can't trust those leaky types these days ...

 

[Czech_pivo]

Pretty strong denial right in the article:


After this story was published, the White House denied the existence of any version of the National Security Strategy other than the one published online.

“No alternative, private, or classified version exists,” spokeswoman Anna Kelly told Defense One. “President Trump is transparent and put his signature on one NSS that clearly instructs the U.S. government to execute on his defined principles and priorities.”

Kelly then added that “any other so-called ‘versions’ are leaked by people distant from the President who, like this ‘reporter,’ have no idea what they are talking about.’ ”

Bets on how long this holds up?

 

[The Bread Guy]

Classified version of the US NSS says 5 countries should run the world. US, China, Russia, India and Japan.

‘Make Europe Great Again’ and more from a longer version of the National Security Strategy

A fuller version reviewed by Defense One outlines the Trump administration’s plans for shedding old relationships and creating new ones.

www.defenseone.com

They've basically defaulted to some version of the Russian and Chinese worldview. Excluding two nuclear powers is wild. Like I said, they've lost their marbles.

Along the same lines ....

Donald Trump makes shocking offer... wants to form a C5 group with India, China and... will the G7 cease to exist?

President Donald Trump has opposed removing Russia from the G-8. Russia was expelled from the G-8 in 2014 after the invasion of Ukraine's Crimea.

www.india.com

US weighs ‘Core 5’ that could align traditional adversaries, diverging from G7

The idea envisions a new five-nation bloc including the US, China, Russia, India and Japan, raising questions over Europe’s role and transatlantic ties

bdnews24.com

https://www.politico.com/newsletters/national-security-daily/2025/12/10/how-a-new-russia-china-us-network-could-work-00685342