A Tangent On Working Hours and Stuff Split from "All things Novel Coronavirus"

[stellarpanther]

With all the shortages of PPE, I doubt the CAF mbr's will have the appropriate equipment when the workers don't.  I've heard a lot of PSW are refusing certain tasks, the CAF mbr's should be required to subject themselves to the same risks with the PPE either.  It's not right.

I just don't think it's the job of the CAF to working in Nursing homes.  I doubt the province will be paying for this and they are probably looking at it as free labour.

 

[stellarpanther]

Fortunately, the MND and CDS have experts with indepth knoweldge of the PPE stocks held by the CAF to draw on when they are making decisions, rather than some random dude on the internet pulling conjecture out of thin air.

You can believe what you want but there is a lot of mbr's who believe especially in the MCpl and below level that doesn't think leadership has our backs.  I'm sure this isn't new but I do think it's widespread and getting worse and I'm sure others on here have heard that before.  I'm not saying they agree with it but I'm sure they've heard it before.

 

[Jarnhamar]

You can believe what you want but there is a lot of mbr's who believe especially in the MCpl and below level that doesn't think leadership has our backs.  I'm sure this isn't new but I do think it's widespread and getting worse and I'm sure others on here have heard that before.  I'm not saying they agree with it but I'm sure they've heard it before.

Honest question. Are these members of your unit or troops on reddit?

 

[Remius]

You can believe what you want but there is a lot of mbr's who believe especially in the MCpl and below level that doesn't think leadership has our backs.  I'm sure this isn't new but I do think it's widespread and getting worse and I'm sure others on here have heard that before.  I'm not saying they agree with it but I'm sure they've heard it before.

So province asks for military assistance.  Gvt says yes and instructs military to make it happen.  What is leadership supposed to do? Say no? How do you know if that conversation didn’t already happen and now leadership is loyally executing their orders?

How do they not have our backs exactly? 

 

[NavyShooter]

You can believe what you want but there is a lot of mbr's who believe especially in the MCpl and below level that doesn't think leadership has our backs. 

[quote author=stellarpanther]
I've only talked to a few people on FB and hopefully they are wrong but people have express concern
[/quote]
So, forgive me for doubting your sources...but in your first post quoted above you state that there is "....A LOT OF MBR'S..."
A few posts later you say "I've only talked to a few people on FB..."
So, your initial statement's validity is now drawn into question based on your own following statement.
I think you undermined your own argument - or so it would seem to me.
I appreciate you wanting to be seen to be an expert here - there are a lot of competent folks here that it's great to rub shoulders wish (so to speak) but if your core of expertise is drawn from Facebook, well, I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest finding more reputable sources.
NS

 

[stellarpanther]

So, forgive me for doubting your sources...but in your first post quoted above you state that there is "....A LOT OF MBR'S..."
A few posts later you say "I've only talked to a few people on FB..."
So, your initial statement's validity is now drawn into question based on your own following statement.
I think you undermined your own argument - or so it would seem to me.
I appreciate you wanting to be seen to be an expert here - there are a lot of competent folks here that it's great to rub shoulders wish (so to speak) but if your core of expertise is drawn from Facebook, well, I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest finding more reputable sources.
NS

I'm not interested in who believes me or not, I have nothing to prove on here and repeating something I've heard from a few people doesn't require any level of expertise.  I should have been more clear though, I'm not referring to a random FB group, I'm talking about people in the CAF that I spoke with through FB.

On another topic, why am I being warned and watched now?  I said nothing wrong other than give opinions and express on here what I was told by a few others who may or may not even get sent to nursing homes.

 

[MilEME09]

I'm not interested in who believes me or not, I have nothing to prove on here and repeating something I've heard from a few people doesn't require any level of expertise.  I should have been more clear though, I'm not referring to a random FB group, I'm talking about people in the CAF that I spoke with through FB.

On another topic, why am I being warned and watched now?  I said nothing wrong other than give opinions and express on here what I was told by a few others who may or may not even get sent to nursing homes.

If you are serving, remember that making public comments that discredit the CAF and/or it's leadership is a offense. Please keep that in mind when stating an opinion of those you know on a public forum.

 

[NavyShooter]

I'm not interested in who believes me or not, I have nothing to prove on here and repeating something I've heard from a few people doesn't require any level of expertise.  I should have been more clear though, I'm not referring to a random FB group, I'm talking about people in the CAF that I spoke with through FB.

OK....so it's not a lot, it's a few. 

Thanks for clarifying that.

NS

 

[SeaKingTacco]

I'm not interested in who believes me or not, I have nothing to prove on here and repeating something I've heard from a few people doesn't require any level of expertise.  I should have been more clear though, I'm not referring to a random FB group, I'm talking about people in the CAF that I spoke with through FB.

On another topic, why am I being warned and watched now?  I said nothing wrong other than give opinions and express on here what I was told by a few others who may or may not even get sent to nursing homes.

you can ask a moderator directly by PM if you have not been told specifically why you have a warning.

As a side note, as others have already indicated to you, there is literally no subject on Army.ca upon which you have posted where you have not found some reason to complain or to assume the worst about the entire CAF chain of command. I am not a mod, just a reader and I find your constant (and often ill-informed) rants to be tiresome.

 

[kratz]

[quote author=stellarpanther]
On another topic, why am I being warned and watched now?  I said nothing wrong other than give opinions and express on here what I was told by a few others who may or may not even get sent to nursing homes.
[/quote]

In this situation, the staff have not issued you a warning, instead it's multiple members of the site.

When MilPoints are awarded, an option for 5% warning is available.
Once a minimum percentage is achieved, the Warning / Watched flag is automatically generated.

As it's been pointed out earlier, a Warning is not bad, if you learn from it.
Apparently, in this case, many members disagree with your assertions recently.

 

[stellarpanther]

you can ask a moderator directly by PM if you have not been told specifically why you have a warning.

As a side note, as others have already indicated to you, there is literally no subject on Army.ca upon which you have posted where you have not found some reason to complain or to assume the worst about the entire CAF chain of command. I am not a mod, just a reader and I find your constant (and often ill-informed) rants to be tiresome.

That's fine if you are becoming tiresome of my posts, don't read them. I'm also not so sure they are ill-informed.  Throughout my career, I've had people question me and others in my trade about policies that they interpret differently than the fact.  Just because someone may be of a high rank doesn't mean they are right.  If I had a dollar for every time a Sr. NCO or Officer argued about a certain policy at work and was later proven to be wrong I'd be rich.  Some of them won't even believe it when you show them in black and white.  I and most mbr's in my trade get people arguing what they think the policy should be rather than what it is so I don't except that my opinions are often ill-informed.  Often what I see here is others don't necessarily agree with my opinion which is fine.

 

[daftandbarmy]

That's fine if you are becoming tiresome of my posts, don't read them. I'm also not so sure they are ill-informed.  Throughout my career, I've had people question me and others in my trade about policies that they interpret differently than the fact.  Just because someone may be of a high rank doesn't mean they are right.  If I had a dollar for every time a Sr. NCO or Officer argued about a certain policy at work and was later proven to be wrong I'd be rich.  Some of them won't even believe it when you show them in black and white.  I and most mbr's in my trade get people arguing what they think the policy should be rather than what it is so I don't except that my opinions are often ill-informed.  Often what I see here is others don't necessarily agree with my opinion which is fine.

I've been sorted out by some people on this site who are a lower rank than me, and paid attention (I think?). Leadership doesn't necessarily align with pay grades

 

[stellarpanther]

If you are serving, remember that making public comments that discredit the CAF and/or it's leadership is a offense. Please keep that in mind when stating an opinion of those you know on a public forum.

Thank you for that reminder, I do catch myself getting carried away sometimes.  After looking at my earlier posts, I didn't use very good wording in posts but I didn't mean to come across as trashing the CAF and it's leadership. The CDS most likely wouldn't remember me considering he interacts with so many people but I've spoken to Gen Vance one on one for about 10 minutes one time when he was at CJOC waiting for his driver.  I have a lot of respect for him and think he's one of the best CDS we've had.  Not many generals or other senior officers for that matter ask Jr. ranks what their opinions are of certain topics, IMO, he's one of the few CDS's who actually is trying to make life better for the troops at all levels.

 

[Jarnhamar]

That's fine if you are becoming tiresome of my posts, don't read them. I'm also not so sure they are ill-informed.  Throughout my career, I've had people question me and others in my trade about policies that they interpret differently than the fact.  Just because someone may be of a high rank doesn't mean they are right.  If I had a dollar for every time a Sr. NCO or Officer argued about a certain policy at work and was later proven to be wrong I'd be rich.  Some of them won't even believe it when you show them in black and white.  I and most mbr's in my trade get people arguing what they think the policy should be rather than what it is so I don't except that my opinions are often ill-informed.  Often what I see here is others don't necessarily agree with my opinion which is fine.

SP you've pointed out you have an issue with the CoC, combat arms, reservists and dinosaurs. I can only recommend if you have a grievance with your former units or CoC to bring it up with them and try not to bring those grievances here.

People in your trade are awesome and can be real life savers. They also make some pretty awe-inspiring mistakes. No one is perfect.

 

[daftandbarmy]

oops, wrong thread...

 

[stellarpanther]

"Multi-Hatting Versus Specialization: There must be the avoidance of seeing military personnel as hyper-competent and multi-purpose agents which can do any task set before them, thus being used as a backstop for any and all challenging situations"

This quote explains better what I was trying to trying to say yesterday when I said we aren't janitors.  Clearly a bad choice of words on my part.

 

[stellarpanther]

SP you've pointed out you have an issue with the CoC, combat arms, reservists and dinosaurs. I can only recommend if you have a grievance with your former units or CoC to bring it up with them and try not to bring those grievances here.

People in your trade are awesome and can be real life savers. They also make some pretty awe-inspiring mistakes. No one is perfect.

I have no issues with anything you mentioned.  I do believe most reservists don't understand much about how life is or how things are done in the Reg F but that doesn't mean I have a problem with them.  The same can be said of some mbr's of combat arms units especially when they have a certain way of doing things. Places like Ottawa, Borden or Comox for example are done entirely different.  I'm not saying one is right and the other is wrong, just that they are often completely different.  As an example, I normally work from 0730-1530, if we are seen working past our regular hours, we are told "you don't get paid extra for staying go home, it can wait until tomorrow." That's common in a lot of places in my trade, not so much from what I've heard in places like Pet or Edmonton but a lot of places it is.  On the rare occasions that I do need to stay later because of something I started that went longer than anticipated and needs to be finished, I would be told to come in later the next day or leave earlier, normally I would just write it on the board.  From what I've heard that doesn't happen in a combat arms unit.  Doesn't mean I'm criticizing them, I'm not at all.  My guess is that if I just got assigned to work for an Infantry WO and told him that I just worked 30 minutes longer than my shift and coming in 30 minutes late because of that, he would loose his shit on me.  I'm I wrong?

 

[dangerboy]

  My guess is that if I just got assigned to work for an Infantry WO and told him that I just worked 30 minutes longer than my shift and coming in 30 minutes late because of that, he would loose his shit on me.  I'm I wrong?

I don't think loose their shit, I would think more confused.

 

[Jarnhamar]

[quote author=stellarpanther] My guess is that if I just got assigned to work for an Infantry WO and told him that I just worked 30 minutes longer than my shift and coming in 30 minutes late because of that, he would loose his shit on me.  I'm I wrong?
[/quote]

You're stereo-typing. I can't speak for everyone.  I would tell you thanks for staying late to finish the task, it looks good on your work ethic. I would then remind you that you don't decide your working hours and tell you that sometimes you may need to work extended hours but you'll see that it'll be taken into consideration and you given early days or other benefits to compensate.

I think what's working against you here is that you have an 8-4 office job mentality (as noted by you) and the military doesn't always operate that way. Infantry platoon warrants/platoon 2ICs, especially when running courses or training, don't always work 8-4. I was working on platoon admin until almost 10 pm last night, I didn't ask for the morning off.


I think some of your observations may be right, CAF members MAY have to work without PPE.

CAF members were wading in shit infested water without PPE last year.
CAF members can be ordered to take their gas mask off after a gas attack to check if the agent is gone.
CAF members can be ordered to charge into machinegun fire and take out a trench.

We're really a unique employer and it's because of that that when shit hits the fan the provincial and federal government run to us for help.

 

[daftandbarmy]

You're stereo-typing. I can't speak for everyone.  I would tell you thanks for staying late to finish the task, it looks good on your work ethic. I would then remind you that you don't decide your working hours and tell you that sometimes you may need to work extended hours but you'll see that it'll be taken into consideration and you given early days or other benefits to compensate.

I think what's working against you here is that you have an 8-4 office job mentality (as noted by you) and the military doesn't always operate that way. Infantry platoon warrants/platoon 2ICs, especially when running courses or training, don't always work 8-4. I was working on platoon admin until almost 10 pm last night, I didn't ask for the morning off.


I think some of your observations may be right, CAF members MAY have to work without PPE.

CAF members were wading in crap infested water without PPE last year.
CAF members can be ordered to take their gas mask off after a gas attack to check if the agent is gone.
CAF members can be ordered to charge into machinegun fire and take out a trench.

We're really a unique employer and it's because of that that when crap hits the fan the provincial and federal government run to us for help.

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