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Aerospace Control Operator ( AC Op )

Cbbmtt

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Thanks for all the tips. I would want to try to get out West so I can be closer to my son and parents. I have no problem being posted to other locations, it's just a bit harder to come home for the holidays.

So how long are you actually in school and on the job training before you get posted?? The video says 2 months in Cornwall, the website says 4 months and you say 3. When would I have a secure location to take all my stuff out of storage and have the girlfriend move out to me?
 

Togakure

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You don't really do 'school' before it. You do an OJT job whichc may not even be related to the trade. Couple guys I know worked in the kitchen. You basically wait for your course, which runs maybe 3 times a year. After that, you're posted. That's when you could move people in to where you live. The course is 3 months, I did it in 2011. I don't believe it's changed since then.
 

Cbbmtt

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Thanks for the input. How long did you have to wait before the course started and do you know what times of year the courses start? I'm done basic or hope to be done basic in May.
 

Togakure

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My course was Sept to Dec, the one before that was May ti July or something like that. No idea what wait times are like now. Sorry buddy. PM me if you need more answers.
 

Jorkapp

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Cbbmtt said:
Thanks for all the tips. I would want to try to get out West so I can be closer to my son and parents. I have no problem being posted to other locations, it's just a bit harder to come home for the holidays.

So how long are you actually in school and on the job training before you get posted?? The video says 2 months in Cornwall, the website says 4 months and you say 3. When would I have a secure location to take all my stuff out of storage and have the girlfriend move out to me?

QL3 training is 61 Training Days, plus typically BAEQ (Basic Air Environment Qual) is done before starting course, so 66 training days, which works out to 13-14 weeks. I can PM you with 2014 course dates from CFSACO if you'd like.

As for wait times before course, it does vary. If you finish your BMQ in May, the next course wouldn't be until September, and after that, January. So, chances are you'll be waiting for a couple months before your QL3 course starts. There can be some wiggle room with where you do your pre-course OJT (I know one person who did it at a PRes unit, and two at CFRC's), so you -may- be able to live with or close to your family while you wait for your course. 

Once you finish QL3, you'll be given a posting which will allow you to move your dependants with you. FYI: Girlfriends don't count as dependants unless you've declared common-law, which requires one-year continuous co-habitation, or having a child together.
 

Cbbmtt

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Saw this post, can't believe we are in May. I've been posted to CFB COMOX until the QL3's start in either Sept/January. Wish I can find out when I will be doing those. 1st day doing something tomorrow, just don't know what. Graduated May 1st, got here May 2nd and now I'm just waiting to find out what I'll be doing.
 

Eye In The Sky

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Lots to do in Comox if you are into the outdoors, and lots of worse places you go have went to  8).

BMQ is done I take it...good stuff.
 

dimsum

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Eye In The Sky said:
Lots to do in Comox if you are into the outdoors, and lots of worse places you go have went to  8).

BMQ is done I take it...good stuff.

I'm not sure if you come from a big city, but Comox was an amazing posting even for someone who was born/raised in Toronto like myself. 

Ditch the couch and take up skiing/snowboarding/mountain biking/kayaking/running/sailing or generally anything outdoors; that area has everything and the climate is mild enough to ski in the morning and golf in the afternoon.  Comox/Courtenay also has one of the highest "good restaurants per capita" ratios I've seen in Canada, and one of the best sushi places (Sushi Kobo) I've been to anywhere.
 

Eye In The Sky

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I don't know what I'd say if I heard someone say they were "stuck" in Comox...you get 'stuck' in a place like Wainwright.  8)

If my next posting was out there...the only crappy thing would be deciding if we drove both cars out or railed one!
 

Cbbmtt

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Watching the snow birds and the f 18's fly today going around clearing in taking the sun in was just awesome. The next four months will be glorious.
 

Eye In The Sky

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Yup, hard to complain about Comox.  Maybe you'll luck out and get posted back there.  One of the AES Ops @ 407 was AC Op in Comox, on the PAR side.  Either trade is great IMO, but if you do still want to OT to AES Op later down the road, AC Op is a good trade to come from;  more than one former-AC Op went AES Op and did very well.
 

Cbbmtt

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So much to learn, going to take some time until I find out what side is up or down. AESOP is on my long term radar.
 

Newguy1

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Why is AC op consistently undermanned?

Why do people leave the trade? Related civy employment? Lot of deployments? Stressful?
 

Newguy1

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http://www.crs-csex.forces.gc.ca/reports-rapports/2012/187p0940-eng.aspx

Its TES is listed as critical, also some other posts alluded to that as well
 

Eye In The Sky

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I'd have to take a look at the current TES/PML to see where it's at now...that report is 2 years old.
 

DAA

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Eye In The Sky said:
I'd have to take a look at the current TES/PML to see where it's at now...that report is 2 years old.

I couldn't agree more.  I do believe the issue was addressed but you have to keep in mind the timing here.  A Nov 12 report, identifying an occupation manning deficiency, can take anywhere from 2-5 years to correct.

I'm not entirely certain but I do believe that AC Op training comes with it's fair share of roadblocks.  Training might be available at CFSACO on only a limited basis (ie; 1 maybe 2 courses a year),max course loads, obtaining the necessary security clearance for employment and or training is probably another and most importantly, enrolling them at the right time, so that it coincides with their basic occupational training could very well be another.

So it is technically possible to have an occupation at or close to PML but the TES could be well below the optimum.
 

Jorkapp

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AC Op was undermanned (red trade) for many consecutive years. We just recently crawled out of it, thanks in part to record low attrition rates and high recruiting over the last few years. By the numbers, from the latest Projected Status Report, as of the end of FY 13/14, AC Op has a PML of 563 vs a TES of 541 putting us at about 96% manning. This makes AC Op a green trade.

Not much of what we do as AC Ops is directly transferrable to the outside world. NAV Canada doesn't accept any of our ATC qualifications (same goes for AEC), and there isn't much to do with Air Defense outside a military environment, unless you can score a job with one of the defense contractors.

Most of the reasons we get for people leaving the trade are the same reasons other trades get. Usually its family - military life can take a toll on families, and eventually some just say no more and look for a good stable job without having to worry about their family suffering through another deployment or posting. Some people release because they want to change careers - I know one AEC who just recently retired because he accepted a job with CBSA. Just about all trades see these, so it's nothing unusual.
 

dimsum

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Guy Incognito said:
Not much of what we do as AC Ops is directly transferrable to the outside world. NAV Canada doesn't accept any of our ATC qualifications (same goes for AEC), and there isn't much to do with Air Defense outside a military environment, unless you can score a job with one of the defense contractors.

Interesting - I would have thought the NAV Canada would accept the quals, esp since some civilian airports like Comox are controlled by military folks.  Why is that the case (NAV Canada not accepting quals, not why Comox is controlled by AEC/AC OPs)?
 

Jorkapp

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Dimsum said:
Interesting - I would have thought the NAV Canada would accept the quals, esp since some civilian airports like Comox are controlled by military folks.  Why is that the case (NAV Canada not accepting quals, not why Comox is controlled by AEC/AC OPs)?
To be honest, I don't have an exact answer as to why NAV Canada doesn't accept military quals. I could be wrong, but I don't think NAV Canada accepts any outside quals. The best guess I can give is that since they have responsibility for managing the majority of Canadian airspace, they are allowed to determine what qualifications their controllers must have. Likely for liability reasons, they want their controllers trained by them to their standards, hence no transfer of outside quals.
 
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