Al-Jazeera TV broadcasts video of captured U.S. troops

[Pikache]

http://www.canada.com/national/features/iraq/story.html?id=DA7477BF-1809-4DF6-A258-3CE34D5796EF

Associated Press

DOHA, Qatar (AP) -- The Arab satellite station Al-Jazeera aired footage from Iraqi television Sunday of interviews with what the station identified as captured U.S. prisoners, and also showed bodies in uniform in an Iraqi morgue that it said were Americans.

There was no confirmation that the prisoners were U.S. soldiers, or if they were, what unit they were attached to. The U.S. Central Command had no comment.

Four bodies could be seen lying on the floor of the room.

The station said the prisoners were captured around Nasiriyah, on the Euphrates River.

At least five prisoners, speaking American-accented English, were interviewed. Two were bandaged. Those interviewed included one woman.

Two of the prisoners identified their unit only as the 507th Maintenance.

One of the men, sitting up, was being interviewed by an unseen person holding a microphone labelled "Iraqi TV.‘‘ The soldier spoke in English and at one point said: "I‘m sorry. I don‘t understand you.‘‘

The narrator provided an Arabic translation, but it was possible to hear some of the comments in English.

"I come to shoot only if I am shot at,‘‘ said one prisoner, who said he was from Kansas. Asked why he was fighting Iraqis, he replied: "They don‘t bother me; I don‘t bother them.‘‘

Another prisoner, who said he was from Texas, said only: "I follow orders.‘‘

A voice off-camera asked "how many officers‘‘ were in his unit.

"I don‘t know, sir,‘‘ the soldier replied.

One of the prisoners was shown lying on his back on a bed, with apparent wounds to both arms and hands and marks on his forehead. He had a bandage on one hand and what appeared to be dried blood on his shirt, arms and face.

Al-Jazeera later showed additional footage of what appeared to be a fuel or water carrier parked alongside a highway and a body in uniform with full gear and still wearing a helmet lying behind the carrier.

The U.S. army‘s 507th Maintenance Company is based in Fort Bliss, Tex. The unit is part of the army‘s 11th Air Defence Artillery Brigade, which includes Patriot missile batteries.

On CBS television, Secretary of Defence Donald Rumsfeld said that if those are indeed coalition soldiers being shown on the Al-Jazeera TV footage, "those pictures are a violation of the Geneva Conventions.‘‘

Iraqi Vice-President Taha Yassin Ramadan had said earlier Sunday that Iraq was holding U.S. prisoners of war and that it planned to show them on television.

"Within hours, you will watch American prisoners on TV screens and you will see films of burnt tanks at Souk al-Shyoukh,‘‘ he told a news conference. The town is about 32 kilometres southeast of Nasiriyah, a major crossing point over the Euphrates which Central Command has said was taken by U.S. forces.

Ramadan, the most senior Iraqi official to appear in public since war broke out, said Iraqi troops engaged coalition forces at Nasiriyah on Saturday night. He said footage of "destroyed vehicles‘‘ would be shown to the press later on Sunday.

Ramadan also denied claims that Iraqi President Saddam Hussein may have been injured in the attacks that began four days ago.

"I think for the past four days you have the president on television. You have seen the president more than once,‘‘ he said.

© Copyright 2003 Associated Press

 

[logistik]

I‘ve seen the pictures. It ****ing pissed me right off.

 

[Pugil]

Why those people are so afraid of those pictures? Those are the people wo wanted that war so badly. During the Fist Gulf war, we had seen picture of thousands of Iraqis burnt to death on the highway of death, most people werent shocked to see it on tv. Why should they now? Are they afraid to see the true face of war?

 

[RoyalHighlander]

i know of a site that has that video, very grafic and very disturbing.. I dont know if I should post the link to it, as it also has links to porn and what not. Ill let the mod decide or you can PM me and ill tell you

 

[RoyalHighlander]

http://www.cursor.org/aljazeera.htm

 

[greeves]

It was interesting to see that on CNN this morning, the Iraqi troops captured at that hospital in Nasirya had their faces blurred by the tv editors...Is Ted Turner worried about being accused of war crimes??

 

[SpinDoc]

Hey, that was my idea! (The blurring out faces bit)
I mentioned it in the "UK Plane Shot down by Patriot" string.

I think the Red Cross is right, media should just cut out the habit of showing PWs altogether.

 

[jrhume]

SpinDoc, I saw your suggestion in the other thread. I assume you‘re getting big fat payments from Ted for using your idea? LOL

You‘re right about POWs. Media shots should be from a distance, allowing the reporting of such captures but not showing faces. Any pictures of POWs and such should come from the Red Cross.

Jim

 

[greeves]

I knew someone had mentioned it...just couldn‘t remember where! Are you sure you‘re not Ted Turner?

 

[Jarnhamar]

I think it was the flinch factor.
One station didn‘t show pictures of dea dsoldiers (at first) so then the rest of the stations flinched and no one showed anything.

I seem to remember during the gulf war seeing pictures and fottage of that highway of death. Twisted vehicles, bodies everywhere.

 

[Pugil]

US accusations of Iraqis not adhering to the Geneva conventions is a brutal hypocrisy, remembering their treatment of Afghani prisoners in Guantanamo and the latest pictures of Iraqi POW with their hands bound behind. I have a word for them...WHINNERS

You wanted that war, now you have it so suck it up!!!

 

[Jarnhamar]

IRAQ isn‘t following the rules of engagement. To me that means they are not an army, rather a group of criminals and terrorists with no rights.

Their screwing themselves over. Shooting at allied soldiers then hiding behind a white flag? Thats stupid. If i was there i wouldnt think twice about shooting someone with a white flag after that. Next time they run out of ammo and decide they want a hot meal and some water and throw up the white flag i hope they are shot in the stomach.

Correct me if im wrong history buffs but wasn‘t one of the reasons during ww2 on the russian front the germans hardly took prisoners or accepted surrending russian soldiers because often as the germans advanced the russians would surrender (or hide in their trench) thenw hent he germans fought past them they would pop up and shoot at the germans in the back?

 

[PTE Gruending]

Ghost, this is true; Russian soldiers would surrender, and then ambush the Germans who were advancing, which led to take no prisoners orders. Of course this had good effects and bad ones; On one hand the Russian soldiers new that they would be shot if they surrendered, thus they fought harder. On the other hand the POW‘s that the Germans were to have captured would have created a logistical drain.

I hope that the Coalition exploits these cowardly acts for use in propoganda, as it is totally wrong, and a violation of the Geneva Convention.

 

[Marauder]

US accusations of Iraqis not adhering to the Geneva conventions is a brutal hypocrisy, remembering their treatment of Afghani prisoners in Guantanamo and the latest pictures of Iraqi POW with their hands bound behind.

Hey ****ie, if you were paying attention to your P-Dub drills, you should know you‘re *SUPPOSED* to bind their hands behind them. Makes it a bit harder for them to pull some dumb **** after they‘ve been subdued, dontcha think? Give your head a shake.

I have a word for them...WHINNERS
You wanted that war, now you have it so suck it up!!!

What the **** is your malfunction, jackass? Those troops over there include Canadian brothers, some who used to serve as reservists before the Regs said "Nope" and they went to the USMC to serve as warriors there instead. You want them brutalized, too, if they get captured or wounded? Those guys are troops doing the job they chose to do, no different from the Patricias who went to Afghanistan. If you disagree with Dubya and his posse, that‘s one thing. But reveling in seeing troops, guys who volunteered to do the right thing, like me and other soldiers like me, get wasted or worse, tortured and mutilated for the whole stinking mudball of a planet to see? Now I see why you support Hussein so much... you both seem to enjoy the thought of torturing and humiliating ordinary joes and janes. I don‘t know why so many Frenchmen have this inferiority thing going on with the States, but you just can‘t seem to get right, you sick ****.

Adiust you‘re headspace and timing, numbnuts, cause right now you are past being simply all fukt up.

 

[logistik]

Feckin right on Maruder. Well said.

 

[Pugil]

________________________________________
What the **** is your malfunction, jackass? Those troops over there include Canadian brothers, some who used to serve as reservists before the Regs said "Nope" and they went to the USMC to serve as warriors there instead. You want them brutalized, too, if they get captured or wounded?
_______________________________________

Whats your problem marauder? You want to make this personnal? I never say that I want bad things to happen to coalition troops. When I saw pictures of american pows on tv, I felt pity for them. I have nothing against soldiers that fight in Iraq. All im saying was to the comment MADE by Rumsfeld, he says that Iraq is violating Geneva convention (which is true) and asked American tv not to show those images. But how many images of dead and POW Iraqis (which is also a violation of geneva convention) have you seen so far? He didnt complaint about that, thats why im tired of this selective argument.

DONT f*@king attack me in a public forum with offensive words and especially against my CULTURAL HERITAGE before you understand what im am saying.

 

[muskrat89]

Pugil - as far as I‘m concerned, you‘re the biggest whiner on this board.

Edited to remove all of my ranting. Pugil has mastered the art of punching my buttons. I forgot to count to 10, before I typed

Pugil - since you‘re so easily offended and want people to stop, my wife and daughter are American, and I find your Anti-American rhetoric offensive. Please cease and desist

 

[muskrat89]

Now, back to the task at hand. Granted, I don‘t have a copy of the Geneva convention in front of me, but here is my understanding of the difference. The convention doesn‘t say you‘re not allowed to take pictures of POWs, it says (or implies) you‘re not allowed to parade them around in public (humiliate) them. The US was protesting forced interviews of wounded POWs on live TV, and the subsequent "tight" shots of dead soldiers. "Routine" shots of POWs, even American, probably wouldn‘t have ruffled too many feathers. I‘m not saying I agree, or disagree - I‘m saying that is the argument that the US is making.

 

[Michael Dorosh]

muskrat, you are exactly right. The convention is obviously open to wide interpretation.

It‘s not like the US government is doing the televising though. TV in the US is not "state run", so how can the US government be faulted for what CNN (a global news network) is showing?

Iraqi TV, on the other hand - isn‘t it "state run"?

 

[SpinDoc]

I would imagine Iraqi stations would be state-run, or at the very least state-controlled.

I think the beef is that Al-Jazeera ISN‘T Iraqi-state run. It‘s not even an Iraqi station... it‘s based in Qatar. It‘s sort of like the Arab world‘s own CNN, a "for Arabs by Arabs" sort of thing.

Muskrat89: As for the Geneva Convention, the initial intent of the article was probably "parading around the streets where people can throw things at you", but the wording of it is: "...must at all times be protected, particularly against acts of violence or intimidation and against insults and public curiosity", nothing specific about parading or displaying their faces on film or TV... but it could definitely be argued that a mass media audience is "public curiosity". I don‘t think the Geneva Convention prohibits asking interview questions -- Article 17 just states that PWs not be compelled to give any information other than their name, age, rank and service number, etc... the soldier is not bound to answer anything more and that the interviewer cannot use violence to elicit an answer. An article I read somewhere made references that Western journalists DID interview and show Iraqi PW on TV, although I don‘t have a source on it, so I can‘t say whether or not any such interviews with Iraqi PWs actually occur. What I AM sure is that TV crews did film multiple Iraqi prisoners being subdued on the ground with their faces shown (half of it) from roughly 5-10m away.

My opinion (right or wrong) is that throwing the book at someone is perfectly okay, but if one is going to do it to someone else, then one should also be prepared to "throw" the book at people on your (presumably) own side -- state-controlled or not. The Geneva Convention isn‘t there to protect a belligerent‘s propaganda tools, be it the "good guys‘" or the "bad guys‘" -- it‘s there to protect the individual soldier, civilian, or detainee. A member here mentioned that CNN is beginning to blur out PW‘s faces... Blurring the faces of the soldiers is probably a step in the right direction if the Convention is interpreted a certain way... I think I read somewhere that the people who are supposed to interpret it -- I think I read it was the Red Cross or some other Swiss-based org -- did say that both sides should cut it out.