AOR Replacement & the Joint Support Ship (Merged Threads)

[dapaterson]

Almost as if sustainment is a critical capability that operators of all types tend to ignore until they can't.

 

[SeaKingTacco]

At least it's not just us...

https://twitter.com/x/status/1747025493738537141

Nobody has enough AORs anymore.

I have (only half jokingly) suggested that if we had a Navy of 15 AORs and 2 destroyers, we would be of more value to NATO and the USN, than the other way around….

 

[Halifax Tar]

Almost as if sustainment is a critical capability that operators of all types tend to ignore until they can't.

Crazy how that is eh ?

 

[Halifax Tar]

Nobody has enough AORs anymore.

I have (only half jokingly) suggested that if we had a Navy of 15 AORs and 2 destroyers, we would be of more value to NATO and the USN, than the other way around….

That's an interesting opinion. I can see how and why.

 

[shiska]

That's an interesting opinion. I can see how and why.

The Canadian public might even be supportive of the idea. It plays into the myth that the nice Canadians aren't warfghter's they're peacekeepers.

 

[Colin Parkinson]

Nobody has enough AORs anymore.

I have (only half jokingly) suggested that if we had a Navy of 15 AORs and 2 destroyers, we would be of more value to NATO and the USN, than the other way around….

Then the Japanese show up with an "AOR" That can launch aircraft and fire VLS missiles.

 

[quadrapiper]

Then the Japanese show up with an "AOR" That can launch aircraft and fire VLS missiles.

Battle Tanker finding its fullest conceptual expression.

 

[dapaterson]

We should offer Asterix's services should opportunities present itself until the new RFA ships and/or the new Protecteur are operational.

If the RCN had Obelix as well they'd still be short in support for themselves.

 

[FSTO]

If the RCN had Obelix as well they'd still be short in support for themselves.

Didn’t an admiral get in a wee bit of trouble pushing for that capability retention? (s)

 

[Navy_Pete]

Then the Japanese show up with an "AOR" That can launch aircraft and fire VLS missiles.

Not sure why I'm surprised, but the Japanese take fuel husbandry to new levels. The diesel fuel was almost clear, and the JP5 actually sparkled like magic.

It seems like an almost unfair standard to compare any other fuel sample against for the clear and bright test (which seems kind of dumb until you see a bad sample with water, particulate etc in it).

 

[Maxman1]

Not sure why I'm surprised, but the Japanese take fuel husbandry to new levels. The diesel fuel was almost clear, and the JP5 actually sparkled like magic.

It seems like an almost unfair standard to compare any other fuel sample against for the clear and bright test (which seems kind of dumb until you see a bad sample with water, particulate etc in it).

Meanwhile, on the USS Nimitz.

 

[Grimey]

Meanwhile, on the USS Nimitz.

Machinist Mate Bloggins submits primary cooling loop water as his monthly pee sample.

 

[Navy_Pete]

Meanwhile, on the USS Nimitz.

Wow, that's a flashback to the samples coming off the 280 stripping system on the water compensated tanks, which was the oily water interface bit that usually had some MBGs. That was daily (twice a day?) routine for the upper deck stoker, along with a whole lot of other fuel husbandry steps so the actual fuel to the engines was pretty clean. Which is funny as they would have burned dirtier fuel anyway but they didn't last for 40+ years by accident.

 

[Grimey]

Wow, that's a flashback to the samples coming off the 280 stripping system on the water compensated tanks, which was the oily water interface bit that usually had some MBGs. That was daily (twice a day?) routine for the upper deck stoker, along with a whole lot of other fuel husbandry steps so the actual fuel to the engines was pretty clean. Which is funny as they would have burned dirtier fuel anyway but they didn't last for 40+ years by accident.

If you could dump fuel of suspect quality into an FT4, spin it and add a spark....it'd start. Fuel atomization/air assist was a nice to have.
570KF's on the other hand..........

 

[Grimey]

And since @Navy_Pete has alluded to the fun of water compensated tanks and fuel husbandry, despite the sterling efforts of our UDER, sometimes your gas was only as good as it's source, which during APOLLO was:

1. RN/RFA ( we reckoned they had a side hustle with the Sultan to get the good stuff).
2. Les Grenouille.
3. USN/USNS
.
.
.
.
. !@#$ing PRO (Grapefruit juice with rubber hose particulate).

 

[Navy_Pete]

And since @Navy_Pete has alluded to the fun of water compensated tanks and fuel husbandry, despite the sterling efforts of our UDER, sometimes your gas was only as good as it's source, which during APOLLO was:

1. RN/RFA ( we reckoned they had a side hustle with the Sultan to get the good stuff).
2. Les Grenouille.
3. USN/USNS
.
.
.
.
. !@#$ing PRO (Grapefruit juice with rubber hose particulate).

I would add IRO after a month of PDL and no fuel husbandry offloading the water comp tanks to the bottom of that list. To add insult to injury the flow rate was so slow it wasn't detectable, and took 2 or 3 days alongside.

Worst fueling ever, and that includes an 18 hour one in St. Johns at the opposite side from the fuel jetty watching the single truck do a loop around to refill.

The sample was salty MBGs with some nasty dirty fuel bubbles.

 

[Grimey]

I would add IRO after a month of PDL and no fuel husbandry offloading the water comp tanks to the bottom of that list. To add insult to injury the flow rate was so slow it wasn't detectable, and took 2 or 3 days alongside.

Worst fueling ever, and that includes an 18 hour one in St. Johns at the opposite side from the fuel jetty watching the single truck do a loop around to refill.

The sample was salty MBGs with some nasty dirty fuel bubbles.

Nice. The golden rule of post-TRUMP 280s should have been: NEVER FUEL ALOGNSIDE (and if you have to, make sure it's a place where a small bribe/earner is enough to turn a blind eye to dumping your comp water in their harbour. It worked in Guam )

 

[Navy_Pete]

Nice. The golden rule of post-TRUMP 280s should have been: NEVER FUEL ALOGNSIDE (and if you have to, make sure it's a place where a small bribe/earner is enough to turn a blind eye to dumping your comp water in their harbour. It worked in Guam )

Yeah, going over the side in the bosn chair to hook up a water discharge hose was sketchy, especially when it was between the ship and the jetty. It was usually available in Norfolk but none of us realized their water comp tanks had bladders, and none of them realized our were chain tanks with a direct fuel/water interface. I have no idea if they were expecting sea water and where angry when it was oily water with some growth.


Do vaguely remember someone in Norfolk getting annoyed at us post fueling when it was discussed, but I was just a lowly subbie so wasn't my problem.

Because I was a smartass, I hung a bucket on the 8" discharge hose for 'environmental stewardship'. I jokingly included that in an email sent that to a friend asking about enviro precautions on 280 alongside fuelings without asking why, and was forwarded into a chain that eventually made it's way to an Admiral in charge of JIATF south, who apparently starts reading emails at the bottom.... Lesson learned; ask 'What for'!

 

[MilEME09]

What are we upto in fly away cost per ship? 1.2 billion? for a non combat ship of an existing design. Meanwhile south korea is pitching submarines at $900 million each...... almost as if we aren't getting value for our money locally.

 

[NavyShooter]

Remember - jobs program with ships being a somewhat useful byproduct.