• Thanks for stopping by. Logging in to a registered account will remove all generic ads. Please reach out with any questions or concerns.

Can someone answer these questions about the Naval Electronic Technician trades?

adam22 said:
I passed my aptitude test and interview yesterday. I am still waiting for my second medical and the physical which I will have no problem with. I was informed that I can go to civilian school for the diploma I need and the military will pay for it. We have a school in my hometown that is offering the program so there are a lot of benefits to doing it outside the military.

Obviously you have no idea at all of what you are talking about.  Yes, you will go to a civilian school, but it will most likely not be in your home town, unless you live in the town that the CF and school hold a contract.


adam22 said:
Pros:

1. I get to live in my hometown and see my friends/family.

The CF will house you where they school you.  You do not get to choose where you go to school.

adam22 said:
2. I could live with my parents and save $50,000+ if I do well with my money. (The military not only pays for all my school and books, but they also pay me my starting salary while I go to school for the two years).

The CF will house you and you will have inspections, etc.  You don't get to live with Mom.

adam22 said:
3. I get a civilian recognized diploma, where as I have to do some kind of challenge if I get my diploma through the navy.

I have no idea where you get this idea from.

adam22 said:
4. I get to go to a civilian school instead of a military one. (not a big deal to me, but still seems to be a bonus)

You will be housed by the CF and wear a CF uniform while in the school that they will send you to. 

adam22 said:
5. This is a big one. I was told that after I am done civilian school, (I do my basic training stuff during the summers) I get a boost in rank (to able seaman?), as well as a large boost in salary. This is what I am really wondering about, if anyone could clear this up, that would be great.

You get promotions after completing your complete Course and with "Time In Rank".  Later, you will be promoted if you are merited.

adam22 said:
Cons:

1. I have to wait a whole year to get into the civilian school and there is a small possibility I might not even get accepted.

Those are the breaks.  In the meantime, you will go on BMQ and SQ.

Now this really makes it sound like you are only after the MONEY:

adam22 said:
What I am really interested to know about is the boost in rank. I was told that after two years the boost in rank would give me a salary of $50,000. From what I have read on the Forces.ca website, it will take me a lot longer to get that rank and salary going the traditional way (through the military). If anyone has some advice I would like to hear it, I really do not know what route would be best to take. Thanks.

Doesn't sound promising to me.
 
George Wallace said:
Obviously you have no idea at all of what you are talking about.  Yes, you will go to a civilian school, but it will most likely not be in your home town, unless you live in the town that the CF and school hold a contract.

You're way out of your lane, George.  There are 13 colleges across Canada approved under the NCM-SEP program for Naval Electronics Technician trades.  In fact, one of the prerequisites for civilian applicants to the NCM-SEP program is unconditional acceptance to one of the approved institutions.

The CF will house you where they school you.  You do not get to choose where you go to school.

The CF will house you and you will have inspections, etc.  You don't get to live with Mom.

Only if he's attending the Marine Institute in Newfoundland, which is only one of the 13 approved institutions.  He can live where and with whom he likes at any of the other institutions.

[quote author=adam22]3. I get a civilian recognized diploma, where as I have to do some kind of challenge if I get my diploma through the navy.[/quote]

[quote author=George Wallace]I have no idea where you get this idea from.[/quote]

Because he's correct.  Graduates of NCM-SEP are given diplomas as Electronics Engineering Technicians from the institution.  Those that take QL3/QL5 training at CFNES Halifax have to make application to TechNova for certification as C.Tech, which is normally granted upon presentation of course transcripts and payment of the applicable fee.

You will be housed by the CF and wear a CF uniform while in the school that they will send you to.

Only at the Marine Institute in St.John's.  If they apply to another institution, they wear civvies for classes, and can live wherever they like.

You get promotions after completing your complete Course and with "Time In Rank".  Later, you will be promoted if you are merited.

Correct.

[quote author=adam22]
Cons:

1. I have to wait a whole year to get into the civilian school and there is a small possibility I might not even get accepted.[/quote]
[quote author=George Wallace]Those are the breaks.  In the meantime, you will go on BMQ and SQ.[/quote]

He won't go on BMQ until he's unconditionally accepted into one of the approved schools, and that'll be prior to commencement of first year studies.  And sailors don't do SQ  ;D

[quote author=George Wallace]
Now this really makes it sound like you are only after the MONEY:[/quote]
[quote author=adam22]
What I am really interested to know about is the boost in rank. I was told that after two years the boost in rank would give me a salary of $50,000. From what I have read on the Forces.ca website, it will take me a lot longer to get that rank and salary going the traditional way (through the military). If anyone has some advice I would like to hear it, I really do not know what route would be best to take. Thanks.[/quote]
[quote author=George Wallace]
Doesn't sound promising to me.
[/quote]

Why's that?  It's a simple statement of fact, and the CF freely uses it as a selling point for the NCM-SEP program - faster advancement to Leading Seaman than those who follow the Apprentice/Journeyman path at CFNES.  Sounds like an ambitious fella to me.
 
284_226

Thanks very much for some clarification.  If you intend on trying to make a fool of me next time, at least have the decency to read what I have said or accept the fact that you are making a fool of yourself in the process by not doing so.

284_226 said:
You're way out of your lane, George.  There are 13 colleges across Canada approved under the NCM-SEP program for Naval Electronics Technician trades.  In fact, one of the prerequisites for civilian applicants to the NCM-SEP program is unconditional acceptance to one of the approved institutions.

Did I not lead off with this statement (one that you were so kind to quote, but apparently to not to read):

Yes, you will go to a civilian school, but it will most likely not be in your home town, unless you live in the town that the CF and school hold a contract.

As you pointed out, there are 13 schools he could go to, but there are no guarantees that one of those 13 is the one near his Mom's house.   Nor are there any guarantees that the CF would send him to it either. 

I hope that you are correct on all the rest of your 'facts' too.  ;D
 
George Wallace said:
284_226

Thanks very much for some clarification.  If you intend on trying to make a fool of me next time, at least have the decency to read what I have said or accept the fact that you are making a fool of yourself in the process by not doing so.

I wasn't trying to make you look like a fool, nor did I make myself appear as one.  You stated:

Yes, you will go to a civilian school, but it will most likely not be in your home town, unless you live in the town that the CF and school hold a contract.

Fairly consistent use of the singular, if you ask me.  Perhaps it could have been better worded like "Yes, you will go to one of a number of civilian schools, but it will most likely not be in your home town, unless you live in one of the towns that the CF and school hold a contract".  My guess (and it was a guess) is that you were under the mistaken impression that the Marine Institute is the only school that has a program for training technicians in the CF.  If my guess was wrong, you have my apologies.

I hope that you are correct on all the rest of your 'facts' too.  ;D

Aren't I usually?  ;D
 
Thanks for the feedback, just to clarify, all the information I posted was given to me by my recruiter. The college in my hometown was recommended by the recruiter. He made it a point to tell me that it is the only school in the province that has the program, so I assume they do have a contract with the CF.

The only reason I pointed out the boost of rank and salary was because the recruiter made it a point to tell me of that advantage, and it seems like a pretty big one to me. Im not after the money either (I would not have gotten my Uni degree in philosophy if I was  ;) ), I just want to be sure I know all the angles before I join.

It is still not clear to me about the rank, are you positive I have to have time in rank? What I was told is that as soon as I receive my diploma from the civilian college I get the boost (after having done basic and sailor school as well). Does it sound plausible at all?

I know as well that the programs are a bit different depending on if I were to go to Halifax or a civilian college. The recruiter said I would not be working on specific military equipment as opposed to if I were in Halifax where I would be. Do you see this as a big concern or disadvantage?
 
adam22 said:
Thanks for the feedback, just to clarify, all the information I posted was given to me by my recruiter. The college in my hometown was recommended by the recruiter. He made it a point to tell me that it is the only school in the province that has the program, so I assume they do have a contract with the CF.

The only reason I pointed out the boost of rank and salary was because the recruiter made it a point to tell me of that advantage, and it seems like a pretty big one to me. Im not after the money either (I would not have gotten my Uni degree in philosophy if I was  ;) ), I just want to be sure I know all the angles before I join.

That makes perfect sense.  They've been dangling carrots in the form of cash for a long time now to doctors, dentists, engineers, and skilled trades.  Cash is a pretty lucrative recruiting tool  ;D

It is still not clear to me about the rank, are you positive I have to have time in rank? What I was told is that as soon as I receive my diploma from the civilian college I get the boost (after having done basic and sailor school as well). Does it sound plausible at all?

It's not just plausible, that's the way it is.  You're enrolled with enough time to complete basic prior to the commencement of the school year in September, then you do year one.  During the summer break between year one and year two, you take NETP.  You do year two at school, and then upon graduation you're promoted to Acting Leading Seaman, in the standard pay group.  Upon completion of equipment training and OJT on ship, you're promoted to Substantive Leading Seaman, and transferred to the Specialist 1 pay group.  The pay rates can be found here - http://www.forces.gc.ca/dgcb/dppd/engraph/Apr2006CF_payrates_e.pdf

I know as well that the programs are a bit different depending on if I were to go to Halifax or a civilian college. The recruiter said I would not be working on specific military equipment as opposed to if I were in Halifax where I would be. Do you see this as a big concern or disadvantage?

The academic training you'll have behind you after your Apprentice and Journeyman courses at CFNES will pretty much be on par with what a civvie tech will have at the technician level.  CFNES tries to tie in their academic training as it is applied to naval equipment whenever possible, but you won't be completely in left field if you attend a civvy college.  The equipment maintenance training you take after academic training is designed to introduce you to the equipment as if you'd never seen it before and have no clue what it does.
 
284_226 has the essence of the answers, and I cannot add to them substantially, so I won't.  I've not been in the recruiting loop much, so I'm not able to comment there.

What I will say is that you should get IN WRITING the "promises" of early promotion, and the pre-requisites for that from the people you're dealing with.

Stories can change when you leave the recruiting center, and depending on who you're dealing with, they may not have all of their facts 100% square-on.  So, get things in writing.  Read the fine print.  Sign when you're satisfied that you understand what you're getting into, what performance requirements will be placed on you, and what benefits you can expect from the program you're signing up for.

I know years ago when I joined, I was told I'd be an operator for 3-5 years, after doing a short (3 month) operator course.  By the time I finished basic and got to Halifax, that changed into the new apprentice program, and I was on the Pilot course in 1993, which lasted over 16 months for my QL3 level.  So much for going to sea and seeing the world, eh?

Anyhow.  If you have any problems with the information you're getting from your recruiting center, ask the recruiter to talk to the MOC (or is it MOSID now?) advisor on the east or west coast (whichever you're closest to) and the recruiter should be able to put you in touch with a real person, in the trade you're looking at joining, at a senior level, who should KNOW and be able to advise you on what you're getting yourself into. 

So.

Over to you, good luck, and we'll hopefully see you in the fleet!

NavyShooter

 
NavyShooter said:
I know years ago when I joined, I was told I'd be an operator for 3-5 years, after doing a short (3 month) operator course.  By the time I finished basic and got to Halifax, that changed into the new apprentice program, and I was on the Pilot course in 1993, which lasted over 16 months for my QL3 level.  So much for going to sea and seeing the world, eh?

Lucky bugger!  At least they told you that you'd be an operator for 3-5 years.  When I joined in '85 as a 284 NET(C), they mentioned nothing of it.  Eight of us showed up in Esquimalt for our TQ3 course, and the lead instructor showed us into the classroom on the first day of course.  On the desks were Morse keys and old manual typewriters.  Puzzled, we asked what we were going to need them for - at which point he welcomed us to the NRadOp 274 QL3 course 8601  :eek:    Didah didahdit!
 
As a minor addendum, so far, there's been at lest 3, possibly as many as 5 guys that have joined the Navy as NET's based (at least partly) on some of the discussions I've had with them.  I just found out tuesday that in fact, one of them is a distant cousin of my wife's...about 13 times removed or something like that.

Another of the guys was down in Halifax on a TD while awaiting training up in Kingston.  (They had too many PAT's up there, so they sent him here.)  He worked with/for me for a bit, and started asking questions about the Navy, I took him on a tour of a ship, then sat down and talked with him about my trade for two hours one morning (slow day in the shop).  He came in the next morning with a request for the boss to allow him to re-muster into my trade! 

The boss didn't give me any more PAT's for a while after that :)

Interestingly, that guy just got his message to my unit, so he's going to be working for me again, this time as a 5's qualified LS.

NS
 
Now, I realize this thread is way old but I thought this could be a good addition. I'm currently enrolled in the NCMSEP program, I go to a civilian college for Electronics Engineering and when I'm finished there are all kinds of little benefits then I'm shipped off to some kind of advanced 3's modified 5's... I think they call it integration something or other. Anyway, from what I've heard I'm glad I'm not at the school in Halifax for this but even civilian the subject matter is brutal.

 
NE-OS said:
Now, I realize this thread is way old but I thought this could be a good addition. I'm currently enrolled in the NCMSEP program, I go to a civilian college for Electronics Engineering and when I'm finished there are all kinds of little benefits then I'm shipped off to some kind of advanced 3's modified 5's... I think they call it integration something or other. Anyway, from what I've heard I'm glad I'm not at the school in Halifax for this but even civilian the subject matter is brutal.

Do you have a question regarding your training?  What school are you currently enrolled in?
 
Currently at RRC in Winnipeg. I'm just wondering what happens after for the NCMSEP students.
 
On completion of SEP training you will be posted to CFNES which is in Halifax, there you will completed the NCM SEP NE/NW Tech delta package (academics) on completion of you will be granted QL5 academics and proceed on you QL3 Applications training (equipment phase). When all that is done you will get the NETP (naval environment training program, if lacking)(they should try to get your NETP done during one of your breaks.) Then off to sea to complete QL4 OJTs (On the Job Training) as well as other training prepare you for watches in HMC Ships... I think your joining at an exciting time as our Ships are about to under go modernization as well as the new ship programs coming on line (JSS, tanker replacement, Artic Patrol vessel, to name a few)
Cheers
Mike
 
Thank you very much! I'm pretty excited for what happens after my program here, I really want to end up posted in Halifax and I would LOVE to get on the Arctic boats. The nice pay boost is nice too ;)

 
How is the program? Are you able to talk to advisors about other concerns relating to the Navy? Has any other students expressed an interest in the SEP program?
Cheers Mike
 
I've been telling people they should get into it, there is one that may. There are two of us in my year and then one finishing his last semester. The program is a little tough and I'm on an Air Base so a little landlocked. Unless I want to sail the Red, haha.
 
  I like the new changes to the entry plans for the NETs. It should, I hope, help alleviate some of the current issues. I hope that more people decide to stay with the NET trade for awhile.  We need more people. I would rather be working with others that enjoy the trade and want to be in it. There are too many that are just in the trade for sake of a trade. I'm not saying that they aren't competant. As a Comm tech, I do not limit myself to just comm gear,if one of the other groups is short I will offer to help. If my PO or Master will allow me to go work with someone else than I have gained something from the experience. 

I was looking at the Felex plans. Things look promising. More stuff to learn about. Bring it on....
I know that some of the other trades don't really understand us. As a tech I look forward to faults, maintenance (minus the filter cleaning).
 
Donaill said:
 As a Comm tech, I do not limit myself to just comm gear,if one of the other groups is short I will offer to help. If my PO or Master will allow me to go work with someone else than I have gained something from the experience. 

I was looking at the Felex plans. Things look promising. More stuff to learn about. Bring it on....
I know that some of the other trades don't really understand us. As a tech I look forward to faults, maintenance (minus the filter cleaning).

As an MS CommTech, I commend you on your attitude about the out sourced jobs.  We need more techs with attitudes like yours. :)
 
Back
Top