Canadians losing knowledge of military history

[AJFitzpatrick]

My experience in being taught Canadian History in the '80s taught  me very little with regards to Canadian military history. I was interested, I read it on my own,
It is not surprising that there is ignorance. One wonders if Alexander the Great would gain a few percentage points as a Canadian war hero if the choice was offered.

 

[ex-Sup]

My experience in being taught Canadian History in the '80s taught  me very little with regards to Canadian military history.

I think this once again comes back to my point about who the teacher is. Not every teacher is prepared or willing to emphasize that aspect of our history. What students should know is specifically laid out in the curriculum and some teachers will do the bare minimum.
http://www.curriculum.org/csc/library/profiles/10/html/CHC2DC.htm

Why? Maybe they don't have the background; most of my background is in international/military history. I feel quite comfortable teaching this material. As a former reservist, I feel that the military aspects of our history are just as important as the economics, politics, etc. If your background is elsewhere, then you will not be as comfortable dealing with this material. The teacher might be some left-wing, peacenik type that shuns the whole conflict idea (even though conflict is one of the most prevalent topics in human history).

Some of it might just be apathy. Some students don't care about anything (if it doesn't involve booze/smoking/drugs/sex/et al then it isn't exciting). Some of them want to be entertained. Heard a great one from a colleague this week. Student asked him if they could do something "fun" (some come in and ask to do nothing...everyday). His response to the student was to go to their part-time job and ask the manager if he could do something "fun" at work (McDonald's btw). I thought it was funny...maybe it' s just teacher humour.

Anyway, my $0.02 worth.

 

[ex-Sup]

The survey by the Dominion Institute found that only 42 per cent of Canadians received a passing grade on a simple test of First World War knowledge.

I'd like to find the actual survey itself and try it...I wonder how my students would measure up. Question is, do I really want to know?

 

[Nieghorn]

I echo ex-Sup's sentiments.  I'm a history teacher with a strong interest in the military aspect, though not working at the moment. 

I'm not really sure what text books were like in the 60s-80s, but I have Ontario texts from the 30s and 40s.  If you look at the content of those, and the content of the ones now, you'll see that today's texts are very watered down.  I have a new one where WWII is covered in six pages, which has much larger print than the old books and are filled with images, charts, inserts, etc.

It's largely up to the teacher to bring anything 'extra' to the table.  A good dept. head helps, who can assist those not up to snuff on those subjects - as my history teacher in school was, and as I'm sure ex-Sup is! 

Curriculum restraints are also an issue.  There's a lot of info that has to be crammed into that one (it's still one mandatory course that covers the 20th C, right?) course.  It'd be nice if kids were required to take more.

 

[ex-Sup]

It's largely up to the teacher to bring anything 'extra' to the table.  A good dept. head helps, who can assist those not up to snuff on those subjects - as my history teacher in school was, and as I'm sure ex-Sup is! 

Thanks for the plug Nieghorn! 

The only thing I can add to this my own personal experience. As a dept head, I'm just another teacher who makes a bit more $$$, does piles of extra work and has no authority (yes, I know how dumb this sounds). I can only "suggest" and "recommend" materials and techniques to other teachers. I have no real control over what they do in their classrooms. It is on the individual teacher to make sure they are following the curriculum.

the content of the ones now, you'll see that today's texts are very watered down.  I have a new one where WWII is covered in six pages, which has much larger print than the old books and are filled with images, charts, inserts, etc.

Gotta make it look good; aesthetics over content. 

it's still one mandatory course that covers the 20th C, right?

Yup...1914 to present (I never get past the '70's...besides, nothing exciting happened in the 80's except bad clothes and bad hair!)

 

[peaches]

On Friday night I caught a story on CBC The National about a High School history teacher in I think Port Perry On.  He wanted to take his student to Vimy Ridge.  It idea grew into a national movement and the plan is know to take around 4000 Canadian High School students (one fro each solider that died on Vimy) to France to see it, and touch it.  Each student involved (from schools across Canada) has been given the name of a solider that died on Vimy, they have to learn all they can about him, then go to Vimy to visit the place he served and died in.  The teacher is looking for donation's and sponsors.

 

[Mike Baker]

On Friday night I caught a story on CBC The National about a High School history teacher in I think Port Perry On.  He wanted to take his student to Vimy Ridge.  It idea grew into a national movement and the plan is know to take around 4000 Canadian High School students (one fro each solider that died on Vimy) to France to see it, and touch it.  Each student involved (from schools across Canada) has been given the name of a solider that died on Vimy, they have to learn all they can about him, then go to Vimy to visit the place he served and died in.  The teacher is looking for donation's and sponsors.

Now that i would love to do. Isn't it great being in highschool?  ;D

 

[Colin Parkinson]

Saw that clip also, noticed that it was mainly girls taking part. apparently he was not getting a lot of support from other schools, guess it's not PC enough!!

 

[a78jumper]

Then  there was the ad for a well known tour company in the Globe and Mail hyping (I kid you not) a Battlefield Tour of "Vimmy" Ridge. In all fairness they got the text spelled correctly, BUT..........!!!!!!!!!

 

[TCBF]

"That's because many of the WW2 vets were still around in the 1970's and there was a deep appreciation for the miltary. Somehow, things took a turn for the worse."

- The generation that won WW2 is the same generation that ran our country into the 1980s.  If they de-constructed the rememberance of their own accomplishments, they must have had their reasons.

Tom

 

[RangerRay]

I remember in high school, I had to teach the history teacher history!  Great guy, but I was appalled at his lack of knowledge, and more appalled at the crappy and inaccurate text books that we had to use!

 

[Drummy]

Hi,

Guess I was lucky in the schooling department. When I was in High School in the mid 50s, my math teacher had been in the RCAF (Nav), and spent time in Colditz. My History teacher was infantry, and wounded twice. The Music teacher has been a Royal Marine Commando, and survived the St Nazaire raid(sp).  All three of them used to tell us stories of things that had happened (unofficially/as not on the curriculum), and why it was important to remember.

I managed to pass grade 9 (Ont) but flunked out of grade 10 twice, and that was when I decided to join the Army. Those teachers said that there were worse things to do, and thoroughly approved.

All the best  Drummy

 

[rick7475]

Just to support the other teachers here, I am also an ex-reservist with an interest in military history. It all depends on the teacher. I have a Spitfire model hanging in my classroom and for DEAR (drop everything and read) times I have a good selection of books on military history topics (not just WW1, WW2, but W of 1812, 7 Years War, etc). There are a few other odds and ends in the classroom that always bring up questions about Canadian military history which I answer for anxious ears with many stories and anecdotes.

Language Arts reading and writing assignments can have various topics. For example, we did a shared reading week on the the Berlin Wall that included aspects of WW2 the kids loved. There are interdisciplinary projects, current event themes, social studies themes that can all be very flexible with the topic according to the teacher's interest. But it does depend on the teacher, and not a lot of teachers have the background in military history. This is not necessarily the fault of the teacher (the majority of teachers in Elementary school are women, sometimes 10 to 1, who usually don't show an interest in this area), but even the universities, particularly the history programs, have few courses in Canadian military history, if any at all (unless you are at RMC . In university Canadian history courses are often survey courses with specialization in certain areas through essays and seminars chosen by the student. Again, if you have an interest in the military, you may choose a specialization. And then how many of these students in university that choose a Canadian Military history specialization become teachers?

And how many high school or elementary students are interested in military history given the choice? I recall a weekend field trip we took to Ottawa a few years ago when I was in high school. The War Museum (the old one) was on the list of things to see. But a majority of the students on the trip (almost all the girls) voted to change the plans to include a trip to several of the large malls instead. The teacher, who was a good history teacher, went with the majority, unfortunately.

Now, however, with Afghanistan and the number of casualties there may be more interest.

 

[Suck_it_up_buttercup]

Hey Everyone...I sent this yesterday to CTV.ca when I saw the poll on State Funerals for the last Surviving Vet of WWI

I am writing in regards to your recent poll on whether or not to hold a state
funeral to honor the last surviving solider of World War One.  These three
surviving men are equally important to the history and legacy of our country as
are all of our Veterans.  They are now representatives of all who fought for
our country during that time. 

Why single out the Veteran who survives the longest, honoring his memory in
such a way to almost disrespect or disregard the honor of all the other
soldiers who have passed?  I believe that once all three of these heroes have
passed away, a Ceremony in Honor of the Memory of all those who fought in the
First World War should be held.

The best way to honour these men is to educate our children.  Parents should
not rely on the ever changing education system in this country to teach our
children about the History of the great men and women who have made the
ultimate sacrifice.  As the poll on the War History of Canada earlier in the
week proved, we can all stand to learn something about Canada's past and
present conflicts.  If we don't Remember and have the knowledge to teach our
future generations who will? 

Let us never forget the sacrifices of our Canadian War Heroes.

 

[Nieghorn]

ex-Sup, if I ever end up doing that Gr. 10 course again, I'm tossing some Boer War in there! 

Regarding the make up of a department, I guess it can't be full of us military history nerds (as interesting as those discussion groups would be!).  I'd need to lean on someone who can explain to me basic economics, and another colleague to keep me awake when talking about politics. 

I do enjoy social history, though, and think it's kind of fun to hit kids with examples of what young people were into in different time periods.  When I was in teacher's college, my instructor told me about her friend who based his entire course on a series of biographies.  Largely tossed the text out and created a whole year based on the lives of several real people, and looking at what life was like, and the important events, in their time.  I'd like to tackle something like that if I get back into it full time.

... I'm off to New Zealand for a year in 2007.  8)

 

[ClaytonD]

I am an avid studier of Canadian Military history (Esp. in World War II). The other day in history class my teacher asked something about WWI. And when I mentioned the Schlieffen Plan. She said, "I'm not interested in the military tactic stuff. I'm more interested in the Political aspect."

To be frank it pissed me off. Why not both aspects? She's a history teacher and she should be teaching everything she knows about history. And if she doesn't KNOW the military aspect she should LEARN.

 

[MarkOttawa]

ClaytonD: "Keep the right wing strong!"
http://www.worldwar1.com/tlwplans.htm

Mark
Ottawa

 

[MP101]

It is sad, so many people are stupid and ignorant about their history. In my high school, there is only 3 people and myself that know alot about the boer war, wwI, wwII and other wars like vietnam and korea.

I was watching a newscast on TV and they were doing a live survey about WWI and they asked the question: Where was one of the most known battles of WWI? (And they gave a hint, THAT IT ENDED IN "RIDGE") and some people still did not get it. If it was up to me, i could describe it.

 

[ex-Sup]

but even the universities, particularly the history programs, have few courses in Canadian military history, if any at all (unless you are at RMC .

It is getting better. I just finished a pile (6 to be exact) of university classes at both Lakehead and Laurier. At Laurier, I took two classes online; History of WWII & Canadian Army in NW Europe 44-45. The WWII course was very general, but the Cdn Army was great. It was taught by Mike Bechthold who is an author and director of the Laurier Centre for Military Studies. There were a few things however that were over my head...maybe they would make more sense if I had a better background in tactics. The LU course was taught by an officer from my reserve days...Capt Dave Ratz. It was good to catch up with him; he's now CO of A Coy, LSSR. Anyway, this is my long-winded way of saying there's more out there.

 

[ex-Sup]

ex-Sup, if I ever end up doing that Gr. 10 course again, I'm tossing some Boer War in there! 

Nieghorn,

Hate to throw cold water on your idea...they changed the curriculum. The course (as of last year) is Canadian History since 1914. I always do a few days of review, but there's no time to do anything in any detail.
http://www.edu.gov.on.ca/eng/curriculum/secondary/canworld910curr.pdf