CF-18 Drops AIM-7 on Golf Course.

[Scoobie Newbie]

Oh I know why he snuck them in.

 

[nULL]

Canada should find a niche role in fighting a war and fund that, not try and be an all-encompassing fighter that does everything half assed.

Nope.  We do that, were just setting ourselves up to be further marginalized when the call comes out.  How would we niche roll anyways?  Buy more blue baseball hats and ten round magazines?  People seem to have this BIG misconception that Peacekeeping, which lies on the low end of the spectrum of conflict, is something different than an all out war.  I sat in a quiet area in Bosnia for 6 months, and we still had flak vests, helmets, support weapons, LAV's and helicopter support.  Look at some of the hardwear General Mackenzie brought to UNPROFOR, which was a UN mission; TUA's, mortars, 50 cals, etc.  Unless you want a purely observer status for the Canadian Forces you must understand that operations across the spectrum of conflict demand the exact same thing, well trained and equipped soldiers that can sustain themselves in the field.

Perhaps I wasn't specific enough with "niche role." When you look at the forces equipment wise, it always seems like the equipment is rarely top notch. The griffin is underpowered, the Canuck-Stryker variant is a poor replacement for a tank etc.  To say it simply/stupidly (not difficult for me ) why not say scrap the tactical sealift capability and focus on making the capabilites we do have tip-top?

I mean, jesus, it's not like what the conservatives are promising this time around is going to turn us into a superpower able to fight a war anywhere on earth. If it only cost an extra 600 million to shut off the conservatives stream of votes from the military sector, i'm pretty sure paul martin would do it.

I think your confused.  There is a difference between becoming a superpower (which we can't) and a fully capable force which can be properly fielded and sustained abroad to support Canadian interests.  Isn't it odd that the Aussie's can deploy a battlegroup to East Timor or Iraq, and yet we have to hitch a ride with them or the Americans, eat their food, use their ammo, blah blah blah.  Kind of embarrassing if you ask me.  I would say the short term goal (which hopefully the Conservatives can deliver) would be for Canada to live up to its White Paper obligations and be capable of independently deploying a Brigade Group overseas.  Yes, it costs money, but to say we don't need it is silly.

Then why wouldn't the Liberals do it, if it would keep the military happy and get more votes? It's got to cost more.

Instead it would cost billions from other areas of government spending that Canadians might actually care about.

Well, I don't really care about a two billion dollar Gun registry.  I don't really care about paying 26% of my income to social programs so others can be unproductive and live off the public purse.  I don't really care to funnel more money into a health care system that is fundamentally unsound (Even though the conservatives have also planned to do that, much to my chagrin). 

Canadians who do vote for these things have their head in the sand and need to take a closer look at the issues.

You're in the minority. I bet if you asked most Canadians which they'd rather have, a gun registry or a well funded military, they're take the registry.

Call me cynical, but the conservatives are probably going to get a minority government because the canadian public is sick of liberal corruption and incompetence than some deep-seated urge to give their soldiers tanks and strategic airlifts

Call me cynical, but all your vaunted NDP has promised to do is hike military pay; we are the second highest payed soldiers in the world, there is other concerns for me, thank you (Hey, enjoy your high pay and military union, because you're going to be sitting in the UN Headquarters in New York for the rest of your life!).  Sounds as nutty and unrealistic as the rest of their ideas.  Hey, lets raise corporate taxes and taxes on the upper class so they can pay even more than the 70% they already pay!  Let's drive out Canada's prosperity!  Hey, well I'm at it, I'm going to pedal my bike down to Washington and tell the Americans to change the Second Amendment of their Constitution!  Vote for Jack Layton!

If the NDP ever got elected in Canada I would seriously consider moving.

Who said I was voting for the NDP? I may like them, but they have no chance of forming a government, and the Liberals have pissed away way too much money. The conservatives deserve at least a minority government but i'm keeping a close eye on them  ;D

so that they can go to Iraq and get blown up all by themselves.

That's just ignorant; I don't even need to reply buttercup, but you should seriously reconsider joining the Infantry, both for your sake and the sake of the Corps.

yeah, in retrospect that was a pretty dumb thing to say. apologies. I blame it on the little ndp guy in my heart.

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

With regards to the griffin, there is a new power plant coming online in the near future.

 

[Infanteer]

Perhaps I wasn't specific enough with "niche role." When you look at the forces equipment wise, it always seems like the equipment is rarely top notch. The griffin is underpowered, the Canuck-Stryker variant is a poor replacement for a tank etc.   To say it simply/stupidly (not difficult for me ) why not say scrap the tactical sealift capability and focus on making the capabilites we do have tip-top?

You can't pick and choose your capabilites and refine what you do best.   Ok, we save a few bucks and eliminate armour.   We will wear it (and Canadians will come home in boxes) when our jeep-equipped troops get rushed by T-72s.

Then why wouldn't the Liberals do it, if it would keep the military happy and get more votes? It's got to cost more.

The Liberal government of the day seems to be good on reneging on its duties and promises, so I guess that's why they've ignored it.   Otherwise, I would also level a finger at that monstrosity of a bureaucracy the DND has created.

You're in the minority. I bet if you asked most Canadians which they'd rather have, a gun registry or a well funded military, they're take the registry.

And that is why I am inclined to dismiss the average opinion; like I said, they've got their head in the sand.   People will gab about alot of things they feel they know about, and yet when it comes to the core of the issues, they know jackshit.   The best example is the knee-jerk reaction of Canadian citizens who feel any attempt to reform the health care system will result in an "Americanized" system (Which is also a big, misunderstood myth).

Who said I was voting for the NDP? I may like them, but they have no chance of forming a government, and the Liberals have pissed away way too much money. The conservatives deserve at least a minority government but i'm keeping a close eye on them.

I came to the conclusion that your past support of the party put you in their camp; can you blame me?

 

[Zoomie]

With regards to the griffin, there is a new power plant coming online in the near future.

Really?  If you are referring to the Y-model of the Bell 412, the CF is not on-board for those modifications.  $$$$

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

Not sure what model it was but my source is in INT so who knows.

 

[Limpy]

This just reminds me of that STUPID Liberal commercial about Stephen Harper "He would have sent our troops into Iraq; Spent millions on defense budget...", perhaps it would be a good thing if the primeminister started paying more attention to its troops. If they cut more funding, we'll be finding bombs in our backyard... :

Maybe they should have found some bombs in the yard of Paul Martins residence. They might have smartened up a bit and increased defense spending. ;D