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Chinese Military,Political and Social Superthread

It is long past time that we realized that China has de facto declared war on the west. At the moment it is primarily economic and social in nature but it is never-the-less war. They have infiltrated our government as is evident from the news, taken control of our resources and stolen our property. (as above) There really isn't much difference in their behaviour and that of the scottish border raiders centuries ago. One stole cattle and burnt farms the other stole intellectual properties and financially burnt businesses. My vote will go to the first party that verbally acknowledges this fact and vows to do something about it.
Over the least 10 to 20 years there have been countless instances of China’s attempts to control and subvert our political system, our economy and our military. If it had been only, say, several, then I wouldn’t probably have paid too much attention to it. But this has been going on and on. I’m mad at the Liberals under Trudeau, Chretien, et al. I’m angry at the Harper Conservatives. I’m also angry at those major corporations who were complicit in the takeover of our economy.

I’m not a believer in revolution. I do, however, believe strongly in the ballot box. Our political system is far from perfect but considering the options I’ll continue to suffer through not always having my preferred candidate or candidates elected and making the exact decisions I want them to make. I do think it’s important to let our politicians know what I think and I quite often have written letters or sent emails (supposedly handwritten letters are more effective) to my local Conservative MP, the Prime Minister, Ministers Freeland, Anand and others. I feel that the pen is truly mightier than the sword. If only more Canadians expressed themselves that way then we would be in much better shape as a nation.
 
You can be sure the "Eminent Canadian" recommended by Trudeau as the Special Rapporteur will tick all the bases. Any criticism of her will be labeled Misogynistic, racist, homophobic and all the other woke labels.
 
Terry Glavin, in NP. Trudeau's Relationship With China Far Uglier Than Any Links Trump Had With Russia. Lists off some of the things that have happened that people might find objectionable.

Article will be paywalled, unless you still have some "free" views this month (or whatever the timeline for reset is).

I guess that the headline alone is going to set some teeth on edge.
That’s a good analogy. The links between Russia and the Trump campaign were seedy, but doesn’t come close to the seediness happening here for years.
 
I do like my timelines....

Draft - without attribution

A couple of other points for inclusion in the time line

11 March 1996

John Howard PM of Australia

February 6, 2006

Stephen Harper PM of Canada

April 29, 2007

Justin Trudeau Liberal Party of Canada candidate for Papineau

3 December 2007

John Howard deposed as PM of Australia

3 December 2007

Kevin Rudd PM of Australia

January 20, 2009

George W. Bush replaced as President of the United States

January 20, 2009

Barack Obama President of the United States

11 May 2010

Cameron - Clegg Co-Dominium as PM of the United Kingdom

24 June 2010

Kevin Rudd deposed as PM of Australia

24 June 2010

Julia Gillard PM of Australia



14 March 2013

Xi Jinping President of China

April 14, 2013

Justin Trudeau elected leader of the Liberal Party of Canada

27 June 2013

Julia Gillard deposed as PM of Australia

27 June 2013

Kevin Rudd PM of Australia

18 September 2013

Kevin Rudd deposed as PM of Australia

18 September 2013

Tony Abbott PM of Australia



18–23 February 2014

Maidan Revolution or the Ukrainian Revolution

September 2014

UK Joint Expeditionary Force (JEF)



8 May 2015

Cameron sole PM of the United Kingdom

15 September 2015

Tony Abbott deposed as PM of Australia

15 September 2015

Malcolm Turnbull PM of Australia

November 4, 2015

Stephen Harper deposed as PM of Canada

November 4, 2015

Justin Trudeau assumes office as PM of Canada



June 23 2016

Brexit referendum vote




13 July 2016

Cameron quits as PM of the United Kingdom

13 July 2016
Theresa May PM of the United Kingdom

January 20, 2017

Barack Obama replaced as President of the United States

January 20, 2017

Donald Trump President of the United States

26 October 2017

Jacinda Ardern PM of New Zealand

24 August 2018

Malcolm Turnbull deposed as PM of Australia

24 August 2018

Scott Morrison PM of Australia



20 May 2019

Zelensky President of Ukraine

24 July 2019

Theresa May deposed as PM of the United Kingdom

24 July 2019

Boris Johnson PM of the United Kingdom



31 January 2020

United Kingdom leaves the EU



January 20, 2021

Donald Trump replaced as President of the United States

January 20, 2021

Joe Biden President of the United States

23 May 2022

Scott Morrison deposed as PM of Australia

23 May 2022

Anthony Albanese PM of Australia

6 September 2022

Boris Johnson deposed as PM of the United Kingdom

6 September 2022

Liz Truss declared PM of the United Kingdom

25 October 2022

Liz Truss deposed as PM of the United Kingdom

25 October 2022

Rishi Sunak declared PM of the United Kingdom

25 January 2023

Jacinda Ardern steps down as PM of New Zealand


An awful lot of flux in the Five Eyes.
 

Yesterday.

I continue to believe the mother of all alliances is slowly forming against the USA/West with China as Commander in Chief.
You are 110% correct. I just hope India ultimately doesn’t join the Alliance from Hell. They’re not exactly friends with China (having had several skirmishes/wars with them in the past) but they have shown quite a bit of loyalty to Russia. I would hope that India wouldn’t be that stupid as to join their alliance. But such an alliance, Humphrey, would be more formidable than the Axis Alliance of WW2. Mind you, we would have Japan, Australia, possibly the Philippines, the U.S. (yes, Canada, too) and most of western Europe, although not sure if Germany has the balls any more despite being in NATO. I think France would ultimately take part in NATO. Note: being in NATO doesn’t ensure that a nation will necessarily participate or at least participate whole heartedly. I’m sure that the eastern European members of NATO would participate with all their might.
 
I’m not a believer in revolution. I do, however, believe strongly in the ballot box. Our political system is far from perfect but considering the options I’ll continue to suffer through not always having my preferred candidate or candidates elected and making the exact decisions I want them to make. I do think it’s important to let our politicians know what I think and I quite often have written letters or sent emails (supposedly handwritten letters are more effective) to my local Conservative MP, the Prime Minister, Ministers Freeland, Anand and others. I feel that the pen is truly mightier than the sword. If only more Canadians expressed themselves that way then we would be in much better shape as a nation.

As I was building my last timeline I found that the letter R was stuck. That forced me to use deposed to note the end of a PMs time in office.

It seems to me that may the best description of the system yet. You can become PM by House Vote, Caucus Vote, Party Vote or Appointment. The job ends when deposed by General Election.
 
Some very reputable economists posit that you need new people, outsiders, to provide the innovation that does add value. In other words adding value is, very largely, a result of increased immigration.

Counterpoint?


Migration makes the world grow rich, but can it build stable nations?​

The United States has prospered as the archetypal melting pot. But it is now facing the problems of a society without deep roots
JANET DALEY11 March 2023 • 6:37pm
Janet Daley


An immigrant family on the dock at Ellis Island, N.Y., just having passed the rigid examination for entry into the land of promise looking hopefully at New York's skyline while awaiting the government ferry to carry them on to the land of the free.

Between 1892 and 1954, millions of immigrants arriving to the US were processed through Ellis Island CREDIT: Bettmann
Human history is a story of the migration of peoples. The movement of populations has almost certainly been a primary force for social progress even when it was motivated by desperate circumstances like famine, or cruel intentions like conquest. Tribes or nations that remain static and isolated do not evolve: they lose the dynamism that seems to be essential for a successful, resilient culture. Taking in newcomers is not simply a humane gesture, it is essential to the health of a nation. But however obvious this fact is, it contains a paradoxical tension. Societies – even sophisticated, modern ones – are made up of communities that maintain their identity by a belief in shared values and attitudes. That homogeneity – the like-mindedness that binds people with a common purpose – is threatened by the arrival of large numbers of incomers who may have quite different social assumptions and expectations.
So there is a dilemma: the very thing most likely to encourage progress and vitality in the life of a nation, particularly one with an ageing population, causes fear and resentment which – on the face of it – are not unreasonable. It is no good castigating either of these groups – the incomers or the established communities. Some of the migrants may well be opportunists rather than victims. The angry local people may be bigots, or they might just be afraid of losing their cohesion and sense of identity. Both of these impulses need to be addressed honestly. The desire to improve your chances in life, which motivates the economic migrant, and the longing to protect the recognisable character of your community are both absolutely legitimate. I expect few reasonable people would argue with that. So usually it comes down to numbers and the ability of the host society to cope with the impact of those numbers. This is often depicted as a contest between cosmopolitanism – life without tribal or national ties in which anyone has a right to live anywhere – and what is often described as “nativism”, which binds those born into a place with a blood bond that is easily inflamed into hatred of the outsider.
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The second of these has an infamous history, which can be glibly summoned up (by, say, sports presenters) to poison any discussion of the consequences of sudden increases in mass migration. Genuine instances of it still do occur – in Donald Trump’s rhetoric for example – and need to be called out. But oddly, right before our eyes, there is a notable case study of the problems created by the first. The United States was founded on a commitment to the cosmopolitan ideal: on the principle that you can create a viable nation by admitting anyone from anywhere (in truth, it was not that unconditional), providing that they accept the conditions of the Constitution, which is regarded as a legal contract with the people. It was an unprecedented experiment, at least in scale, founded on 18th-century optimism – the belief that rationality could replace inherited cultural idolatry. And it worked – didn’t it? Certainly the American economy was a modern miracle, which was obviously connected to the fact that so many of its incomers were economic migrants who had the extraordinary determination that allowed them to risk everything on a journey to a place they had never seen.
A place, incidentally, that offered nothing in the way of government support if you couldn’t cope. The ruthless conditions that greeted those who arrived at Ellis Island in the last century, as my grandparents did, was that they must have no physical or mental disability that might cause them to become “a charge upon the state”. You arrived and you took your chances. And that is one of the critical differences between the great migrations of the past and the present ones, which have become so contentious. The desirable destinations now – the developed democracies – are welfare states in which it would be unthinkable to allow huge numbers of people to be left starving and homeless. So accepting migrants costs the state a lot of money, which has to be collected from the resident population. At least for the duration of their early period of settlement, these people certainly are a “charge upon the state” which changes the equation. Permitting them to become net contributors to the country – in every sense – has to be the top priority of those who campaign for their right to stay.
So is the United States truly a cosmopolitan success? Is it living the dream of a land of opportunity for all those disparate peoples who have settled there? Or does it have, at its centre, a core of existential anxiety that comes from rootlessness: a sense of not belonging anywhere, which permeates even private relationships and preoccupations? I remember being quite startled when I first encountered the European expectation of inherited communal ties. Friends in Italy or Ireland would explain that their families could trace their origins in a region – or even a village – back 10 generations. The parochialism and complacency of this did not appeal to me – and yet it made me deeply aware of what was missing in American life.
Patriotism was intended to take the place of folk memory in establishing national identity. Every school day began with a pledge of allegiance to the flag because being a proud American should be enough to make you feel at home. This theme crops up repeatedly in American popular culture. Superman – whose original motto was “Truth, justice and the American way” – is a refugee from a dying old world who reinvents himself out of devotion to the new one. But the superhero is a loner who must live without personal ties. What does that say about the nature of the American condition? Do the periodic fits of hysteria and neurotic self-obsession, which envelop American life, spring from an absence of any real understanding of what it means to feel at home? Perhaps what we need is not a whole world of people who belong nowhere, but stable societies that can offer a sense of belonging without losing their sense of who they are.
 
It's called democracy.
I heard a comment recently that really struck me, essentially it was; Democratic societies are slow to awaken to a threat, but once they do, the public supports the effort entirely, and they prevail.

WWII America, Canada, and the UK are the perfect example. Prior to the war "coming home" people weren't in favour of war. Once the war struck home, everyone helped how they could, and we won.

China, Russia, etc., have to spend as much effort keeping the home front secure as they do the front lines. Democratic societies don't have that same problem, because by the time the fight is on, the public is on-side.
 
Counterpoint?


Migration makes the world grow rich, but can it build stable nations?​

The United States has prospered as the archetypal melting pot. But it is now facing the problems of a society without deep roots
JANET DALEY11 March 2023 • 6:37pm
Janet Daley


An immigrant family on the dock at Ellis Island, N.Y., just having passed the rigid examination for entry into the land of promise looking hopefully at New York's skyline while awaiting the government ferry to carry them on to the land of the free.'s skyline while awaiting the government ferry to carry them on to the land of the free.

Between 1892 and 1954, millions of immigrants arriving to the US were processed through Ellis Island CREDIT: Bettmann
Human history is a story of the migration of peoples. The movement of populations has almost certainly been a primary force for social progress even when it was motivated by desperate circumstances like famine, or cruel intentions like conquest. Tribes or nations that remain static and isolated do not evolve: they lose the dynamism that seems to be essential for a successful, resilient culture. Taking in newcomers is not simply a humane gesture, it is essential to the health of a nation. But however obvious this fact is, it contains a paradoxical tension. Societies – even sophisticated, modern ones – are made up of communities that maintain their identity by a belief in shared values and attitudes. That homogeneity – the like-mindedness that binds people with a common purpose – is threatened by the arrival of large numbers of incomers who may have quite different social assumptions and expectations.
So there is a dilemma: the very thing most likely to encourage progress and vitality in the life of a nation, particularly one with an ageing population, causes fear and resentment which – on the face of it – are not unreasonable. It is no good castigating either of these groups – the incomers or the established communities. Some of the migrants may well be opportunists rather than victims. The angry local people may be bigots, or they might just be afraid of losing their cohesion and sense of identity. Both of these impulses need to be addressed honestly. The desire to improve your chances in life, which motivates the economic migrant, and the longing to protect the recognisable character of your community are both absolutely legitimate. I expect few reasonable people would argue with that. So usually it comes down to numbers and the ability of the host society to cope with the impact of those numbers. This is often depicted as a contest between cosmopolitanism – life without tribal or national ties in which anyone has a right to live anywhere – and what is often described as “nativism”, which binds those born into a place with a blood bond that is easily inflamed into hatred of the outsider.
Advertisement

The second of these has an infamous history, which can be glibly summoned up (by, say, sports presenters) to poison any discussion of the consequences of sudden increases in mass migration. Genuine instances of it still do occur – in Donald Trump’s rhetoric for example – and need to be called out. But oddly, right before our eyes, there is a notable case study of the problems created by the first. The United States was founded on a commitment to the cosmopolitan ideal: on the principle that you can create a viable nation by admitting anyone from anywhere (in truth, it was not that unconditional), providing that they accept the conditions of the Constitution, which is regarded as a legal contract with the people. It was an unprecedented experiment, at least in scale, founded on 18th-century optimism – the belief that rationality could replace inherited cultural idolatry. And it worked – didn’t it? Certainly the American economy was a modern miracle, which was obviously connected to the fact that so many of its incomers were economic migrants who had the extraordinary determination that allowed them to risk everything on a journey to a place they had never seen.
A place, incidentally, that offered nothing in the way of government support if you couldn’t cope. The ruthless conditions that greeted those who arrived at Ellis Island in the last century, as my grandparents did, was that they must have no physical or mental disability that might cause them to become “a charge upon the state”. You arrived and you took your chances. And that is one of the critical differences between the great migrations of the past and the present ones, which have become so contentious. The desirable destinations now – the developed democracies – are welfare states in which it would be unthinkable to allow huge numbers of people to be left starving and homeless. So accepting migrants costs the state a lot of money, which has to be collected from the resident population. At least for the duration of their early period of settlement, these people certainly are a “charge upon the state” which changes the equation. Permitting them to become net contributors to the country – in every sense – has to be the top priority of those who campaign for their right to stay.
So is the United States truly a cosmopolitan success? Is it living the dream of a land of opportunity for all those disparate peoples who have settled there? Or does it have, at its centre, a core of existential anxiety that comes from rootlessness: a sense of not belonging anywhere, which permeates even private relationships and preoccupations? I remember being quite startled when I first encountered the European expectation of inherited communal ties. Friends in Italy or Ireland would explain that their families could trace their origins in a region – or even a village – back 10 generations. The parochialism and complacency of this did not appeal to me – and yet it made me deeply aware of what was missing in American life.
Patriotism was intended to take the place of folk memory in establishing national identity. Every school day began with a pledge of allegiance to the flag because being a proud American should be enough to make you feel at home. This theme crops up repeatedly in American popular culture. Superman – whose original motto was “Truth, justice and the American way” – is a refugee from a dying old world who reinvents himself out of devotion to the new one. But the superhero is a loner who must live without personal ties. What does that say about the nature of the American condition? Do the periodic fits of hysteria and neurotic self-obsession, which envelop American life, spring from an absence of any real understanding of what it means to feel at home? Perhaps what we need is not a whole world of people who belong nowhere, but stable societies that can offer a sense of belonging without losing their sense of who they are.
i was born in the U.S. many many moons ago. Except my maternal grandfather who came from Greece, all my other ancestors were from the British Isles. But it was that grandfather who was particularly proud to consider himself to be an American and and was quite passionate about it. The fact that he was Greek was of lesser value to him although he was quite proud of having come from there. In other words he quite happily put himself in the melting pot.

Compare that with Canada. Here we have multiculturalism, not a melting pot. As much as I love Canada, I think multiculturalism divides Canadians more than it unites them. A moment ago I spoke about my grandfather being Greek. Several decades ago a friend of mine was flying from Toronto to Athens. On that plane, sitting next to him, was a young guy also from Toronto and was, in fact, born there. My friend asked him if he was going to Greece on vacation and the young man replied “No, I’ve been drafted and am going to serve MY country.” My friend then asked, “But, we don’t have a draft in Canada, didn’t you say you’re Canadian?” The guy then said, “We’ll, you know what I mean.”

Unfortunately, I DO know what he meant. He considered himself Greek first and Canadian second. Although some may consider that example to be anecdotal, I’ve seen all too many similar instances of multiculturalism not really working for the betterment of Canada. I think multiculturalism is a disaster and not to be in favour of it is something a lot of the liberal politicians would classify as racist to diminish the importance of what I’m saying. I’m not arguing against having other races coming to Canada…but I hate like hell seeing them almost encourage new immigrants to proudly hold on to their original heritage to the extent that they do not identify as Canadians. I think the only reason Pearson and Trudeau pushed multiculturalism on Canadians is just to find a raison d’être to differentiate Canada from the U.S. As a result, my opinion is that Canada is worse off as a result because there are so many other and better reasons for differentiating Canada from the U.S.

So when push comes to shove with China, I hate to think how many new Canadians will end up really supporting this country.
 
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