Combatives for infantry?

[MAZDASPEED]

Hey I'm new to post here. I'm 15, 115-120 pounds, going to try to join the reserves when I'm 16 but i was wondering what kind of fighting do you learn when your in there? Do you do knife patterns or knife fighting?
another question- what if you already have previous experience with fighting like Muay Thai or Kung Fu? will that help you while your in ? thanks

 

[KevinB]

Not really any help...

If you join the reg force infantry you get a small segement of basic training with close quarter combat.

The fact that you will be wearing body armour, helmet etc. make martial arts in combat highly unrealistic.

We also try to shoot people rather than get near them if possible.

 

[Michael OLeary]

Hey I'm new to post here. I'm 15, 115-120 pounds, going to try to join the reserves when I'm 16 but i was wondering what kind of fighting do you learn when your in there? Do you do knife patterns or knife fighting?
another question- what if you already have previous experience with fighting like Muay Thai or Kung Fu? will that help you while your in ? thanks

Reserve Force infantry are not trained in unarmed combat skills on any of their formal courses.

There is no knife finghting training.

Previous experience in martial arts will not help you other than the (popularly perceived) associated attributes of self-discipline and ability to learn new skills, if you have been attentive to developing these aspects of your personality (and that will depend on you and the emphasis placed on these things by your instructors).

See the Infantry FAQ section titled Unarmed Combat for links to threads on related topics: http://army.ca/forums/threads/17067.0.html

 

[TaKe ThE PaIn]

You don't need any training or any past martial art experience to know that when you are close enough to someone (wich shouldn't happen) the best thing to do is just to stab him with you baillonet, so he don't get up after. I've done kung fu and boxe thai, and I can't tell you it change nothing.

 

[MG34]

I have yet to see a martial art that can be done when the user is in full fighting order,helmet,body armour,Tac vest,etc.The new CF system of unarmed combat is designed to be used with all this kit on,and is supposed to be quite effective much more than that old school crap they taught us with it's idiotic stances and kicks.

 

[MAZDASPEED]

what is the new system of unarmed combat for CF? Is there any way to learn advanced combatives or knife combat in the army later on?

 

[MG34]

I am not sure what it is called,the first instructor's course has just finished with training starting in my unit soon.As long as your unit has qualified instructors they can run it anytime.

 

[MAZDASPEED]

o ok thx, what about knife combatives though?

 

[MG34]

Knife defense is part of the course ,a small part as knife fights are a pretty rare occurance on the battlefield..No smart person brings a knife to a gun fight.

 

[Jarnhamar]

Knives are great MAZDASPEED and when you learn self defense against them it's pretty interesting (and can come in handy speaking from personal experience) but

a. i can't see the army teaching you how to use a knife on someone else (which is what i think your interested in?) and
b. if your always talking about knives, fighting with knives, learning ot to use a knife.. people are going to think your a little weird over it. (a search about knives on this forum will bring up some threads about people who are "good with knives")

If your really interested in learning about knife fighting take a martial art that includes it in the learning or order some books off ebay and practice with your buddies.

 

[MAZDASPEED]

ghost i see your point but people are also always talking about guns to and are obsessed about it.



whats there more to fear from a gun or a knife?

 

[Jarnhamar]

I'm more afraid of a soldier swinging knifes around all the time trying to throw them into things than i am a soldier with blanks in his rifle or shooting on a range 

I know what you mean though. When i was in martial arts we touched on knife self defense and knife fighting a little and it was pretty fun.  Theres a lot of people on here who are really into firearms and shooting. Soldiers use rifles for self defense and to perform their duties. Knives are looked at more as a tool, not for fighting with.
Half the time in the Canadian forces your not even allowed to carry a large knife. 
We've had people post some pretty asinine things about using knives so people who are jerks (like me) are a little negative about it

 

[Fusaki]

I am not sure what it is called,the first instructor's course has just finished with training starting in my unit soon.

Its possible that you're talking about the CQC (Close Quarters Combatives) System, which was taught on BIQ courses (In Meaford, anyways) starting late last year. I was on one of the first BIQs that was taught CQC. There is limited knife defence type stuff, but thats sort of irrelivant because we rarley practice that kind of stuff in Battallion so 90% of it is forgotten anyways. I also have to say I was a little disappointed there was no ground fighting covered at all on CQC. Since I've been in Pet I've been doing Martial Arts on my own time. I can't say I'd be able to do most of the stuff I'm taught here with a Tac Vest on, but it's good way to get out of the shacks once in awhile.

For some reason people who like knives alot tend to suck at everything. I can't imagine that every knife enthusiast is like that, but the few of them that were at Meaford with me all got recoursed. ~shrugs~

 

[combat_medic]

The Seafoths have recently been running a basic unarmed combat course for anyone interested. Our Ops WO is unarmed combat instructor qualified, and has been kind enough to run it and share his skills. The skills themselves are very little like any martial art I've seen. As was mentioned, it's meant to be done with webbing/tac vest, body armour and a helmet on, so the moves are a lot more restricted. When you have about 40 pounds of gear on your torso, kicking someone above the waist is pretty useless, and you're more likely to land flat on your arse. There are no "points" and very little in terms of rules. In most martial arts, certain moves, hits and parts of the body are off limits, but this doesn't really apply to the military; as you're likely about to be killed and nobody's going to deduct a point from you if you kick a guy in the groin.

As for regular martial arts, they will certainly teach you strength, agility and flexibility, and will prepare you for what you will learn, but will not be the same style. It's a great fitness program, and will get you in shape, but be prepared to learn something different in the army.

 

[Spooks]

CQC (atleast in LFWA) is being taken out of the BIQ system since students need to take the whole course again in Battallion. I was too short and too spread out along the course to be of any benefit as most students were forgetting back fighting stances in the three weeks between the test and starting throws and so forth. Knife defence is fun, but if you wish to be a real keener on the knife thing I'd invest in the martial art of Kali (Filipino Knife Fighting) We had a student who had taken it for 10 years prior to the military and he had a lot of fun.

The biggest problem with taking a martial art prior to taking CQC or atleast a BIQ CQC class (since you have a few less liberties to voice opinions at that stage) is that what you already know will seem to clash with what they teac you. We also had a Muay Thai kickboxer who competed professionally on national and world levels prior to joining who found all the classes of kicking and punching to be very "useless and stupid". He didn't take into consideration that, as was stated before, you're punching with gear on and his methods needed dexterity to pull off. On the plus-side, he did already know the dynamic of a punch and a kick and boy did it hurt somedays to be smacked around by him, even if he was only at 20% strength.

-Spooks

 

[Jarnhamar]

I just started Aikido and it's pretty fun. A big application i can see soldiers using it for is defense against weapons (Knives, stucks, rocks) and putting and holding down people who try and hit you. Also teaches how to defend against numberous attackers. It looks like it will be easy to use even with equipment on.  If anyone is into it feel free to PM me over it.

 

[Crazy_Eyes]

Ok, some of you may call BS on this one because of my age but I am a black belt in a martial arts system, that incorporates Kickboxing, Ju jitsu, boxing and weapons, along with the defences for them. If you are in a full load out, vest helmet etc. Kicking wont make much of a difference, because it'll be too slow to be effective. Learn ground fighting and boxing, those will be your best bet. I know in ground fighting there are various very effective chokes and locks....having performed them and haved them used on me. Aikido is also good because it's a counter balance martial art, maybe ghost can elaborate more? as for knife fighting I've only been trained on the defences, not the offence.

  My 2 cents 

 

[winchable]

Sorry to dredge up old posts:

I have yet to see a martial art that can be done when the user is in full fighting order

If you're looking for something like this I would suggest finding a good traditional Japanese Jiu Jitsu school, not Brazilian, but Japanese. The classic Japanese Jiu Jitsu was designed so Samurai could toss each other about wearing full armour.

 

[Crazy_Eyes]

Che,

  I'm only familiar with Brazilian Ju Jitsu, please elaborate more on this Japanese style?? Thanx

 

[Jarnhamar]

I am a black belt in a martial arts system, that incorporates Kickboxing, Ju jitsu, boxing and weapons, along with the defences for them.

Which martial art is that? 
When i was in taekwondo there were 12 year old black belts.  As long as you can perform the moves/patterns set out in whats deemed required for the belt, you can get your black belt.

Aikido is a purely self-defense art.  You react to someone attacking you. The aim is to defend yourself against an attack without inflicting harm on the attacker.  I'm told quite a few police forces use this because it deals a lot with restraining and imobilizing someone and not punching through their guts

Aikido was drawn up from a bunch of different martial arts including Spear fighting, stick fighting, fencing, sumo wrestling, kempo karate, ju-jitsu, aki-jitsu and ninjitsu to name a few.
I thought it was a bit of a pussy martial arts because you don't hit someone (taekwondo was pretty agressive and painful i loved it) but when you see someone get attacked by 4 guys at once and he puts them all down in the blink of an eye it changes your opinion. The fact that he has so much control he doesn't even have to hurt them to put them down is something else.

i'll stop rambling though