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BobSlob said:
Thank you
Domestic Terrorism/Public Attacks on CAF Personnel
- Thread starter Humphrey Bogart
- Start date
Thank you
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DAA said:
Bingo, if he cut someone else, this would have been an incident. The two were in uniform, and we have people up in arms and ready to hit Daesh with everything we got!
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What happened to respecting on going investigations and speculation?
To protect this site, the DS and mentors have always agreed with the rule of law
and a presumption of innocence. Yes, there are examples when initial indications
clearly lead many to think guilt and our perceptions were proven wrong.
This individual was sent to hospital. That is a fact that is reported in public.
Nothing reports to how or why he is there. It may be due to injury, mental or observation.
We do NOT know. It is not reported. I ask, why are we spending 4 pages speculating when
if this was another case the DS would be all over it? Consider this before chiming in.
I'm glad our brothers are recovering and able to return to their loved ones.
I rarely sign off as a mentor.
kratz
-mentor-
To protect this site, the DS and mentors have always agreed with the rule of law
and a presumption of innocence. Yes, there are examples when initial indications
clearly lead many to think guilt and our perceptions were proven wrong.
This individual was sent to hospital. That is a fact that is reported in public.
Nothing reports to how or why he is there. It may be due to injury, mental or observation.
We do NOT know. It is not reported. I ask, why are we spending 4 pages speculating when
if this was another case the DS would be all over it? Consider this before chiming in.
I'm glad our brothers are recovering and able to return to their loved ones.
I rarely sign off as a mentor.
kratz
-mentor-
- Reaction score
- 2,532
- Points
- 1,260
OK, folks, since this is heating up a bit quicker than expected, how about a briefish pause to let people take a breath, let the investigators do their job, and let the media catch up with what they deem fit to share.
Back at 'er, in a bit ...
Milnet.ca Staff
Back at 'er, in a bit ...
Milnet.ca Staff
OldSolduer
Army.ca Relic
- Reaction score
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- 1,140
Just to add:
I think the stabber was mentally ill, highly impulsive and prone to suggestion, that is to say he might have got this idea in his head because he "heard a voice" that told him to do this.
As far as I know, most suicide bombers are those of limited mental capacity and if I may say so "the elevator doesn't go to the top floor".
Just my opinion.
I think the stabber was mentally ill, highly impulsive and prone to suggestion, that is to say he might have got this idea in his head because he "heard a voice" that told him to do this.
As far as I know, most suicide bombers are those of limited mental capacity and if I may say so "the elevator doesn't go to the top floor".
Just my opinion.
- Reaction score
- 304
- Points
- 880
It's an incident - fact, not opinion. It was a targeted attack - in the same vein as what happened in St Jean and the National War Memorial - or were those non-incidents? It just so happens that this nut-case decided a knife was his weapon of choice, vice a vehicle or a crappy lever-action rifle.
Stabbings do happen all the time - acts of emotion, theft, etc --- rarely do they involve the perp invoking Allah's name and the associative violence associated with it - random violence on prominent targets is Terrorism - whether you like it or not. My comments are not based on some misguided superiority on being from the Big Smoke either - I don't really think where you are from allows to you form an opinion that is more valid than those from small town Canada. I'm from that 6 million person cess pool myself - I just decided that growing up involved leaving home and getting out and about and seeing the rest of the country.
Stabbings do happen all the time - acts of emotion, theft, etc --- rarely do they involve the perp invoking Allah's name and the associative violence associated with it - random violence on prominent targets is Terrorism - whether you like it or not. My comments are not based on some misguided superiority on being from the Big Smoke either - I don't really think where you are from allows to you form an opinion that is more valid than those from small town Canada. I'm from that 6 million person cess pool myself - I just decided that growing up involved leaving home and getting out and about and seeing the rest of the country.
I'm sure the CO of that CFRC is or has filled out a significant incident report.
It's an incident. Sure. How significant that is is another matter but consider this.
Canadian Forces personel have been attacked and killed simply because they were in a known location for CAF members and for simply being in uniform in the last 18 months or so in three different parts of the country. It really does not matter if it was a knife, a car or a rifle. The act is symbolic whether one wants to accept that or not.
An insignificant act does not attract national attention. This one has because there are legitimate concerns. And while I agree this may be isolated, we've now had three isolated incidents in a short time period. People are talking about it so yeah, while John is making it seem like Toronto is awash in knife fights and is no big deal, context makes this an issue.
On the flip side there is no shortage of people hoping and likely praying this is more than what it might be. Facebook is awash with people assuming this was teh act of syrian refugee just chomping at the bit to get at Trudeau to justify their irrational fears and anger.
The good thing at least, this time is that the perp is alive and we might actually get some insight into his motivations.
It's an incident. Sure. How significant that is is another matter but consider this.
Canadian Forces personel have been attacked and killed simply because they were in a known location for CAF members and for simply being in uniform in the last 18 months or so in three different parts of the country. It really does not matter if it was a knife, a car or a rifle. The act is symbolic whether one wants to accept that or not.
An insignificant act does not attract national attention. This one has because there are legitimate concerns. And while I agree this may be isolated, we've now had three isolated incidents in a short time period. People are talking about it so yeah, while John is making it seem like Toronto is awash in knife fights and is no big deal, context makes this an issue.
On the flip side there is no shortage of people hoping and likely praying this is more than what it might be. Facebook is awash with people assuming this was teh act of syrian refugee just chomping at the bit to get at Trudeau to justify their irrational fears and anger.
The good thing at least, this time is that the perp is alive and we might actually get some insight into his motivations.
- Reaction score
- 2,532
- Points
- 1,260
We'll keep 'er locked for juuuuuuuuuust a bit longer, but here's some updates:
Edited to add statement from the Chief of Defence Staff ...
- "Police: Man Charged in Toronto Stabbing Cites Allah" (Associated Press)
- "Canada says military stabbing appears to be isolated incident" (Reuters)
- "Canadian man says 'Allah' told him to stab two in Toronto" (Deutsche Welle)
- "Toronto attacker said 'Allah' told him to stab soldiers" (Agence France-Presse)
- "Military to continue wearing uniforms in public following stabbing, says general " (Globe & Mail)
- "Forces stabbing suspect 'very scared,' lawyer says" (Toronto Sun)
Edited to add statement from the Chief of Defence Staff ...
... and the Minister of Defence, via Twitter:
- Reaction score
- 2,532
- Points
- 1,260
OK, let's see if we can keep this civil, and reasonably fact-ish, shall we?
Thanks, in advance, for your help.
Milnet.ca Staff
Thanks, in advance, for your help.
Milnet.ca Staff
- Reaction score
- 2,532
- Points
- 1,260
A few more bits of info through the continued lock ...
today Friday.
- "Stabbing suspect once had restricted airport security clearance" (globnalnews.ca) - "Ayanle Hassan Ali, accused in military centre stabbing, once worked at Pearson airport" (CBC.ca)
- "Ayanle Hassan Ali, accused of stabbing soldiers, described as 'nice' but troubled" (CBC.ca)
- "The suspect who allegedly cited Allah during a double stabbing at a Toronto military recruitment center was a calm and religious person, according to one friend, who said Ayanle Hassan Ali struggled to cope with an ill mother, and would only leave home to get groceries or go to a mosque ..." (VICE News)
- Reaction score
- 2,532
- Points
- 1,260
A few more tidbits:
Still no word on the court appearance today My mistake: he's back in court tomorrow (Friday) ...
- "Imams call attack on Canadian Forces 'disturbing' " -- The head of a council of Canadian imams has condemned an attack on soldiers at a recruitment centre in Toronto. Dr. Mohammad Iqbal Al-Nadvi called the violence, which saw two soldiers injured and a third threatened, “disturbing.” ... “It was shocking for us,” Al-Nadvi, of the Canadian Council of Imams, said. “He put the responsibility on religious reasons. It’s a disturbing notion.” Al-Nadvi said the council found the attack particularly upsetting because it has connections to, and supports, the Canadian Forces. Three Muslim chaplains are part of an interfaith community network that works with the Forces. “When we go there, we see how we can make the Forces a good and friendly environment for Muslims,” he said. Al-Nadvi said Muslims share the concerns of their fellow Canadians about the security of their country. “We are not living in isolation,” he said. “We are part of the national fabric. It’s also important we make our point very clearly ... (Toronto Sun)
- "The National Council of Canadian Muslims (NCCM), a prominent civil liberties and advocacy organization, condemns (Monday's) attack on two members of the Canadian Forces in Toronto ..." (NCCM info-machine news release)
- Reaction score
- 290
- Points
- 980
http://www.metronews.ca/news/toronto/2016/03/16/changes-seen-in-ayanle-hassan-ali.html
‘Dramatic’ changes seen in alleged military attacker Ayanle Hassan Ali
Ali is said to have taken his mother Maryam’s diagnosis of mental illness in 2001 particularly hard. His mother was a big part of his life, said a source.
The Canadian Press
The lawyer for a man charged with stabbing and wounding two soldiers at a Toronto military recruitment centre says his client seems 'very scared' and 'very unhappy.' Ayanle Hassan Ali made a brief court appearance on Tuesday.
By: Torstar News Service Published on Wed Mar 16 2016
Ayanle Hassan Ali was a “very charismatic, very caring person,” but in 2011 a relative began to notice “dramatic” changes.
“He wasn’t as social, wasn’t as charismatic,” said his mother’s cousin, Mariam Adam, whom Ali called “Auntie.”
“He started to talk about crazy conspiracies, talking about the working class, the rich, the Illuminati, atheists, Jesus.”
Adam, who now lives in the United States, told Torstar News Service that Ali had been staying with her in Edmonton, after having put his engineering studies at the University of Calgary on hold.
Not long after she noticed the changes in his behaviour, Adam said Ali’s mother asked that he come back to stay with her in Toronto. She hasn’t been able to speak to him since.
Born in 1988 in Montreal to Somali immigrant parents, Ali is the only boy in a family of four, Adam said, which includes an older sister who went to Oxford University and now works as an optometrist in London.
The family moved to Toronto when Ali was two years old, and Adam said he graduated high school here.
“He was very smart for his age, kind of like an old soul,” she said. “We’d watch cartoons and he’d want to watch the Discovery Channel.”
She said Ali took his mother Maryam’s diagnosis of mental illness in 2001 particularly hard. His mother was a big part of Ali’s life, she said, taking him to soccer practice and encouraging him in school.
About a year after the diagnosis, Adam said Ali’s father left the family.
“I don’t blame him, though,” she said, adding that life had become very difficult and Maryam had wanted him out of the house.
Mental illness is a taboo in practically any culture, but Abdifatah Warsame, a Somali community leader, said it can be especially tough in the Somali community, where some see the mentally ill as being possessed.
He said he once ran into Maryam at a Rexdale burger restaurant where she pushed him and told him to duck, mentioning shots fired and the KGB.
“That shows that mental illness is a taboo,” he said. “We stigmatize the person. But we’re learning. Because it’s wrong.”
After graduating with honours in high school, Ali took some time off before applying and being accepted at the University of Calgary, Adam said. But he left in his third year, saying he wanted to work to help take care of his family, so he moved in with her in Edmonton.
He took a security course, but worked just one day on an oilpatch in Alberta because he didn’t like it, Adam said. It was while she was staying at home for a few months that she began to notice the changes in him.
“I started to think: Is he starting to become like his mother?”
Adam came for a visit last year, but she said Maryam, who lived in an apartment with Ali and his youngest sister, would only talk to her through the door, and she wasn’t able to speak to Ali.
Adam said she wishes Ali had received the treatment she feels he desperately needs.
“He was never taken to a psychiatrist, never evaluated,” she claims. “No one took it upon themselves to help him.”
‘Dramatic’ changes seen in alleged military attacker Ayanle Hassan Ali
Ali is said to have taken his mother Maryam’s diagnosis of mental illness in 2001 particularly hard. His mother was a big part of his life, said a source.
The Canadian Press
The lawyer for a man charged with stabbing and wounding two soldiers at a Toronto military recruitment centre says his client seems 'very scared' and 'very unhappy.' Ayanle Hassan Ali made a brief court appearance on Tuesday.
By: Torstar News Service Published on Wed Mar 16 2016
Ayanle Hassan Ali was a “very charismatic, very caring person,” but in 2011 a relative began to notice “dramatic” changes.
“He wasn’t as social, wasn’t as charismatic,” said his mother’s cousin, Mariam Adam, whom Ali called “Auntie.”
“He started to talk about crazy conspiracies, talking about the working class, the rich, the Illuminati, atheists, Jesus.”
Adam, who now lives in the United States, told Torstar News Service that Ali had been staying with her in Edmonton, after having put his engineering studies at the University of Calgary on hold.
Not long after she noticed the changes in his behaviour, Adam said Ali’s mother asked that he come back to stay with her in Toronto. She hasn’t been able to speak to him since.
Born in 1988 in Montreal to Somali immigrant parents, Ali is the only boy in a family of four, Adam said, which includes an older sister who went to Oxford University and now works as an optometrist in London.
The family moved to Toronto when Ali was two years old, and Adam said he graduated high school here.
“He was very smart for his age, kind of like an old soul,” she said. “We’d watch cartoons and he’d want to watch the Discovery Channel.”
She said Ali took his mother Maryam’s diagnosis of mental illness in 2001 particularly hard. His mother was a big part of Ali’s life, she said, taking him to soccer practice and encouraging him in school.
About a year after the diagnosis, Adam said Ali’s father left the family.
“I don’t blame him, though,” she said, adding that life had become very difficult and Maryam had wanted him out of the house.
Mental illness is a taboo in practically any culture, but Abdifatah Warsame, a Somali community leader, said it can be especially tough in the Somali community, where some see the mentally ill as being possessed.
He said he once ran into Maryam at a Rexdale burger restaurant where she pushed him and told him to duck, mentioning shots fired and the KGB.
“That shows that mental illness is a taboo,” he said. “We stigmatize the person. But we’re learning. Because it’s wrong.”
After graduating with honours in high school, Ali took some time off before applying and being accepted at the University of Calgary, Adam said. But he left in his third year, saying he wanted to work to help take care of his family, so he moved in with her in Edmonton.
He took a security course, but worked just one day on an oilpatch in Alberta because he didn’t like it, Adam said. It was while she was staying at home for a few months that she began to notice the changes in him.
“I started to think: Is he starting to become like his mother?”
Adam came for a visit last year, but she said Maryam, who lived in an apartment with Ali and his youngest sister, would only talk to her through the door, and she wasn’t able to speak to Ali.
Adam said she wishes Ali had received the treatment she feels he desperately needs.
“He was never taken to a psychiatrist, never evaluated,” she claims. “No one took it upon themselves to help him.”
- Reaction score
- 2,532
- Points
- 1,260
- Reaction score
- 2,532
- Points
- 1,260
- Reaction score
- 2,532
- Points
- 1,260
- Reaction score
- 2,532
- Points
- 1,260
- Reaction score
- 2,532
- Points
- 1,260
- Reaction score
- 2,532
- Points
- 1,260
- Reaction score
- 2,532
- Points
- 1,260
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