FWSAR (CC130H, Buffalo, C27J, V22): Status & Possibilities

[Loachman]

Oh my goodness Loachman, don't say such things!

Not just because it is a huge waste of taxpayer dollars, but because it sounds sooooooooo damn plausible....

Loachman's Law: The level of support and funding applied towards an idea is directly proportional to its stupidity.

 

[MilEME09]

Just read an article stating that the official announcement for the contract will be made thursday and is expected to announce  the airbus C-295 as the winner.

 

[YZT580]

If memory serves me, the C295 is based upon the C235 which had its maiden flight in early 80's. So we are buying a legacy SAR equipment to assist in the location of our legacy combat aircraft.  Might just as well have let Viking build us new Buffalos.  At least we would have the satisfaction of being "made in Canada".  As for other customers of the aircraft, none of them using the current version require the range that we do. It should be interesting though to see where they visualize placing them.  Perhaps CYYB or even Yellowknife.

 

[MilEME09]

If memory serves me, the C295 is based upon the C235 which had its maiden flight in early 80's. So we are buying a legacy SAR equipment to assist in the location of our legacy combat aircraft.  Might just as well have let Viking build us new Buffalos.  At least we would have the satisfaction of being "made in Canada".  As for other customers of the aircraft, none of them using the current version require the range that we do. It should be interesting though to see where they visualize placing them.  Perhaps CYYB or even Yellowknife.

Well the C-295 first flew in 1997, and introduced into service in 2001. my guess is we would get the C-295W which is the latest version, with improved engines, atleast thats what i can find online.

 

[RaceAddict]

The aircraft will do fine - it's used in places like Chile, Spain, and Finland.

Chile: 743,812 km²
Finland: 338,424 km²
Spain: 505,990 km²

Canada: 9,985,000 million km²

Not sure how their use corresponds to ours... :-\

 

[jmt18325]

Would you prefer a Russian aircraft?  They have the right amount of area.

Chile is cold and mountainous.

Finland is cold.

Spain is an ally that spends a similar amount of money.

 

[dimsum]

Chile: 743,812 km²
Finland: 338,424 km²
Spain: 505,990 km²

Canada: 9,985,000 million km²

Not sure how their use corresponds to ours... :-\

To be fair, neither contender has the legs of the Herc, so straight numbers is a bit of a moot point unless the Spartan is significantly better in that regard.

 

[PuckChaser]

Spartan has a reported range that's 500km more than C295.

 

[MilEME09]

According to what I read the C-295 won on cost over the C-27

 

[jmt18325]

If memory serves me, the C295 is based upon the C235 which had its maiden flight in early 80's. So we are buying a legacy SAR equipment to assist in the location of our legacy combat aircraft.  Might just as well have let Viking build us new Buffalos.  At least we would have the satisfaction of being "made in Canada".  As for other customers of the aircraft, none of them using the current version require the range that we do. It should be interesting though to see where they visualize placing them.  Perhaps CYYB or even Yellowknife.

Well, the C-27j was developed from the G.222, which was developed during the 60s.

The C-295 flew only two years before the C-27j.  It's just as modern.  It's simply less expensive, slower, and shorter legged.  We'll know more tomorrow.

 

[kev994]

The shots of the press conference room show a model of a 295w, so if there was any doubt...

 

[RaceAddict]

The teleconference number requests your full name and affiliation.... so, yeah... I'm not willing to fudge that. I guess they only want actual media types... not "media" types.  ;D

 

[jmt18325]

The Liberals refused to close Winnipeg, and bought 4 planes for each of the 4 bases.

 

[kev994]

CBC live streamed it. The only real announcement that we didn't know already was that airbus agreed to industrial offsets equal to the full value of the contract. They already use P&W Canada engines so it's a pretty easy promise to keep.

 

[The Bread Guy]

The teleconference number requests your full name and affiliation.... so, yeah... I'm not willing to fudge that. I guess they only want actual media types... not "media" types.  ;D

Too many people dialing in & saying, "Joseph Bloggins, Army.ca", I guess  ;D

 

[RaceAddict]

My take on the press conference:

They all spent more time talking about how well they did in holding an open, fair and transparent competition and all the subsequent business benefits to Canadian companies than they did talking about the actual airplane, it's capabilities, and how it will be used in the SAR role.

So, business as usual.

 

[Cdn Blackshirt]

CBC live streamed it. The only real announcement that we didn't know already was that airbus agreed to industrial offsets equal to the full value of the contract. They already use P&W Canada engines so it's a pretty easy promise to keep.

Ignoring all other issues, I am happy about this part of the deal.  The economy needs all the help it can get.

 

[The Bread Guy]

This, from the Airbus info-machine, for the record ...

Canada's Department of National Defence orders 16 aircraft

TRENTON, ON, Dec. 8, 2016 /CNW/ - Today, the Government of Canada announced that it had selected the Airbus C295W aircraft for its Fixed-Wing Search and Rescue Program.

As part of the FWSAR program, the Royal Canadian Air Force (RCAF) will receive 16 C295Ws modified for Search and Rescue (SAR).

The contract will also include in service support, provided through a joint venture between Airbus Defence and Space and PAL Aerospace.

Simon Jacques, Head of Airbus Defence and Space in Canada said: "We are acutely conscious of the importance of search and rescue in Canada's vast and challenging territory and we are honoured to have been selected to provide the aircraft and service to ensure that the role is carried out effectively."

The C295W features substantial Canadian content. Every C295 is powered by Pratt & Whitney Canada engines, pilots and technicians will be trained at a new facility developed by CAE in Comox, BC, and the electro-optical systems for FWSAR will be provided by L3 Wescam of Burlington, ON. In-service support for the life of the program will be provided by AirPro, a joint venture between Airbus Defence and Space and PAL Aerospace of St John's, Newfoundland.  In-service support will be conducted by Canadians in Canada.

Jacques added: "About 20 percent of the aircraft is already Canadian, meaning that it already serves as a global ambassador for the skills, innovation and expertise of Canadians. Now it will get to serve them directly."

Canada's C295Ws will be delivered starting three years after contract award. In service, they will join five Airbus CC-150 aircraft used in the air-to-air refueling, transport, and VIP travel roles.

When the contract is finalized, 185 C295s will have been ordered by 25 countries.

About Airbus Defence and Space

Airbus Defence and Space, a division of Airbus Group, is Europe's number one defence and space enterprise and the second largest space business worldwide. Its activities include space, military aircraft and related systems and services. It employs more than 38,000 people and in 2015 generated revenues of over 13 billion Euros.

For more information visit http://www.C295W.ca.

SOURCE Airbus Defence and Space ...

Company photo attached.

 

[kev994]

The other tidbits I noted were that the expected 20 year in service support is actually 5 years with an option for another 15, and the CEO of Airbus Canada is already talking about the availability of additional features, which we can bet would come at additional expense.

 

[The Bread Guy]

And now this, from the CAF/DND info-machine ...

Search and rescue is an essential public service for Canadians from coast to coast to coast. That’s why the Government of Canada is building a more agile, better-equipped military, while ensuring the best value for Canadians.

Following a rigorous, open and transparent competition, the Government of Canada today announced the awarding of a contract for $2.4 billion to Airbus Defence and Space to replace Canada’s fleets of CC115 Buffalo and legacy CC130 Hercules aircraft. The company has partnered with Newfoundland-based PAL Aerospace for maintenance and support services.The contract will provide a complete, modern and technologically advanced search and rescue solution, including maintenance and support services up to 2043.

As part of this contract, Airbus will provide 16 C295W aircraft, equipped with advanced technology systems, to support Canada’s search and rescue operations, construct a new simulator-equipped training centre in Comox, British Columbia, and provide ongoing maintenance and support services. The contract also includes options to extend the maintenance and support services for an additional 15 years. Should Canada choose to exercise these additional options, the contract value would increase to $4.7 billion.

The new technology being acquired includes state-of-the-art communications systems that will allow search and rescue personnel to share real-time information with partners on the ground. Using integrated sensors, crews will be able to locate persons or objects, such as downed aircraft, from more than 40 kilometres away, even in low-light conditions.

As part of its proposal Airbus Defence and Space has committed to make investments in the Canadian economy equal to the value of the contract, creating and maintaining good middle class jobs. Through Canada’s Industrial and Technological Benefits Policy, the company will incorporate many of Canada’s leading aerospace firms into its global supply chain and establish strategic partnerships with Canadian companies to ensure the aircraft are supported in Canada by Canadians. This work will help grow Canada’s innovative and strong aerospace sector, while providing well-paying jobs for the middle class and those working hard to join it.

Quotes

    “"In a country as large as Canada, our search and rescue personnel must have the right equipment to face the varying challenges they encounter every day. Working closely with partners through a fair, open competition, we have selected aircraft and advanced technology that will ensure the safety of Canadians from coast to coast to coast while providing good middle class jobs."”
    The Honourable Judy M. Foote
    Minister of Public Services and Procurement

    “"Members of the Royal Canadian Air Force search and rescue community are among the best trained in the world and respond to incidents in every type of environment, whether in the Arctic, over the Rockies or in the middle of the ocean. Canadians in distress can count on them to give their very best to save lives. With this technology, we are giving our women and men in uniform the tools they need to continue to deliver effective and essential search and rescue operations."”
    The Honourable Harjit S. Sajjan
    Minister of National Defence

    “"Through the Industrial and Technological Benefits Policy, 100 percent of the contract value will be invested into the Canadian economy. Airbus Defence and Space will ensure that the maintenance, training, repair and overhaul work of the aircraft are performed in Canada which will create high-value, well-paying jobs for middle class Canadians and generate sustainability and growth for Canada’s aerospace and defence sector."”
    The Honourable Navdeep Bains
    Minister of Innovation, Science and Economic Development

Quick Facts

    The Canadian Armed Forces is responsible for providing aeronautical search and rescue operations. In collaboration with federal, provincial/territorial and municipal governments, as well as local search and rescue organizations, the Armed Forces respond to Canadians in distress across the country and at sea.
    The initial contract for a period of 11 years is valued at $2.4 billion (plus applicable taxes) and includes 6 years of acquisition and set up, including the construction of a new training centre in Comox, British Columbia, as well as the first 5 years of maintenance and support services.
    The contract is performance-based, which means the contractor will only be paid when equipment and services are delivered and accepted by Canada.
    The contract also includes options to extend the maintenance and support services for an additional 15 years. Should Canada choose to exercise these additional options, the contract value would increase to $4.7 billion (plus applicable taxes).
    A fairness monitor was engaged to oversee and report on the openness and transparency of the procurement process. The fairness monitor’s report identified no fairness‑related issues.
    Canada’s CC115 Buffalo and CC130 Hercules have served Canada well over the last 20 to 40 years. These aircraft perform over 350 missions annually and are responsible for saving thousands of Canadian lives every year.
    During the transition the existing fleets will continue to be maintained and operated to ensure search and rescue responsibilities.

Related Products

Backgrounder: A modern and effective search and rescue solution for the Canadian Armed Forces
Backgrounder: Fixed-wing search and rescue aircraft procurement process
Infographic: Procuring Canada’s future fixed-wing search and rescue aircraft (attached PDF)
Infographic: Capability (attached JPEG)