FWSAR (CC130H, Buffalo, C27J, V22): Status & Possibilities

[Furniture]

I'm familiar with OT&E, but have never heard of ET&E. Engineering Tests and Evaluation?

 

[ytz]

How much ET&E is still being done though? How far is Airbus into the Certification program and AETE in the Qualification program?

I have not dealt with the program in a few years. But when I last did, they were having problems with certain functions that kind of justified buying the aircraft and were supposed to compensate for lesser performance in other ways. This requires more development work and ET&E.

For example, endurance requirements could be lowered because the sensor requirements should reduce search times. And then there are functionalities like CARP for release of SAR payloads and personnel within a given CEP. If these functions don't achieve the required performance, the impact of lower airframe performance is much higher.

 

[Zoomie]

Plane is done with OT&E. IOC 1 May at QQ.

Plane has been holding SAR Stby for months now - just not officially until 1 May.

That CTV article is garbage.

 

[ytz]

Plane is done with OT&E. IOC 1 May at QQ.

Plane has been holding SAR Stby for months now - just not officially until 1 May.

That CTV article is garbage.

Good to hear! Thank you for clarifying!

 

[Maxman1]

Get more Hercs is the best solution. It can stay on station, parts and training are already in the system, the ultimate multi role aircraft. No more orphan fleet that can’t do its job. Stop wasting time and money on failure. How many times do we need to repeat this.
Cyclone
LSVW
TAPV
Griffon

Could this aircraft do what was required during Boxtop 22?

In principle I agree with you.

@Zoomie can likely explain why the JHerc wasn’t the preference for all of SAR fixed wing tasks.
As I understood it, it was more $, and larger than required for many SAR functions. Plus the sensor suite desired would have made the JHerc SAR birds rather dedicated birds that one wouldn’t want to necessarily task for routine transport.

Not being a Pilot or a SARTech, I couldn’t tell you what the main requirements are for a SAR bird in this situation.

There's a SAR Herc variant, the HC-130J, and another version, the Combat King II that can perform air to air refueling.

 

[daftandbarmy]

Apparently the Kingfisher was supporting thii SAR incident today...

Mother and infant rescued, man still missing as search crews scour Finlayson Arm

A mother and infant have been located but the search continues for a missing man in the Finlayson Arm area following a "boating accident."

cheknews.ca

 

[armrdsoul77]

https://www.facebook.com/100064790793786/posts/pfbid0PDUEcbTciZSBakbPjtXqma34CS6NYfgkimru6UhsqnhCzRHbEXaztKbm3zcdowfFl

 

[calculus]

Friend of mine attended the Paris airshow, and said that Airbus had a Kingfisher on display. I've scoured the social media posts for evidence of this, but couldn't find anything. If true, it would seem Airbus is not bothered by the controversy around this platform here in Canada.

 

[calculus]

Friend of mine attended the Paris airshow, and said that Airbus had a Kingfisher on display. I've scoured the social media posts for evidence of this, but couldn't find anything. If true, it would seem Airbus is not bothered by the controversy around this platform here in Canada.

I found a video that appears to show the tail, around the 55 second mark: https://mediaassets.airbus.com/medias/domain38/media102414/724359-kenj497l5n-480.mp4

 

[armrdsoul77]

 

[armrdsoul77]

The Pilot Project Podcast | Episode 59: The Seeker: Fixed Wing Search and Rescue and flying the CC-115 Buffalo and CC-130H Hercules Part 2 - Dan Conway
Latest episode has the guest Maj Dan Conway talking about the Kingfisher @ 46 min. mark.
-Obviously the C295 will not have the range and persistence of the SAR Hercules but does have modern sensor suite to aid in SAR
-There is a ground based system they can upload data acquired by the sensor suite to further refine the search picture
-Plan to have 3 Kingfishers in Greenwood by Jan 2026 and eventually Trenton, Winnipeg.
-Biggest challenge will be personnel as they need to provide SAR coverage while also transitioning over to the new fleet.

 

[Maxman1]

Would the HC-130J Combat King be a better option?

 

[WestIsle]

Would the HC-130J Combat King be a better option?

Probably but the entire move was political from the get go. Not to mention the governments plans for the CAF at the time.

 

[calculus]

Interesting article on Kingfisher in the latest edition of Skies magazine. The sensor suite seems quite impressive.

Skies Magazine

issues.skiesmag.com

 

[captloadie]

The sensor suite has always been what is trotted out as the reason the aircraft can have less range and on STA time because they can locate the missing pers that much quicker. I was doubtful of this until I spoke to someone who was on a recent SAREX and saw the capabilities first hand. They found the primary and secondary targets well before any other of the airframes competing, if they found them at all, and a third target that was meant to be a surprise for the SAR techs on the ground and thought to be unseen from the sky.

 

[dapaterson]

The bias toward "how we've always done it" is fierce; hopefully this sort of experience will help people start looking at technology as an enabler and multiplier (vs the Mark One Eyeball is the pinnacle of all sensors community).

 

[YZT580]

The sensor suite has always been what is trotted out as the reason the aircraft can have less range and on STA time because they can locate the missing pers that much quicker. I was doubtful of this until I spoke to someone who was on a recent SAREX and saw the capabilities first hand. They found the primary and secondary targets well before any other of the airframes competing, if they found them at all, and a third target that was meant to be a surprise for the SAR techs on the ground and thought to be unseen from the sky.

That seems a great argument if the missing person is in Northern BC but what about the poor bastard down 200 miles west of Rankin Inlet? He's at the extreme end of the range. What time would the Kingfisher have on station then? They can find them faster, definitely, provided they can get there to find them.

 

[Colin Parkinson]

The sensor suite has always been what is trotted out as the reason the aircraft can have less range and on STA time because they can locate the missing pers that much quicker. I was doubtful of this until I spoke to someone who was on a recent SAREX and saw the capabilities first hand. They found the primary and secondary targets well before any other of the airframes competing, if they found them at all, and a third target that was meant to be a surprise for the SAR techs on the ground and thought to be unseen from the sky.

Had we bought the C27J, would it not come with the same sensor package?

 

[dapaterson]

Had we bought the C27J, would it not come with the same sensor package?

Bidders offered a complete solution; I don't know what sensor suite the C27J consortium was offering.

 

[KevinB]

Bidders offered a complete solution; I don't know what sensor suite the C27J consortium was offering.

One reason to have Draft RFP’s to take industry feedback and make the best option at the end of the day be an industry driven one.

OFC the other issue is you need to buy enough to make the OEM’s invested as opposed to ambivalent.