Government hints at boosting Canada’s military spending

I have long said that you could fund the CAF to 4 percent of GDP, but we would still lag behind in NATO and be much the same where we are.

It's never the money, it's politics. It's procedures. It's the pork-barreling in our defence spending that makes us a paper tiger in NATO.

My only hope in all of this for the CAF and the GoC, whatever the political stripe that may be, is that it will rouse them out of the "Peace Dividend" slumber. The world has been unstable since 1945. We have used geography, proximity, and association as a Defence Policy ever since. ICBMs don't care how close to the U.S. or how far from Russia/China we are.

Don't give us a dime more, but let us spend money on defence like it matters. The fact we follow the same rules for purchasing a fighter aircraft as we do for buying office furniture for a Service Canada office is disgraceful. Don't treat defense procurement as a stimulus package for Canadian Industry. There I said it.

We spend so much money, time, and effort trying to get that money to stay in Canada; be it by awarding contracts to companies with no capability to produce items without first "retooling" and"developing the production lines", or by hamstringing perfectly competent and competitive bidders by forcing the project to be made in St. Margaret de Poutain de Champignon, QC because the ruling government either lost the seat in the election, or won it with promises.

We spend so much money and staff hours jumping through TBS regulations that are great for other departments, but are terrible for defence procurement. Some items you have to sole source, because there are technologies and capabilities no one else makes. By doing the bid process, you get companies clamoring for a project they can't deliver on, but because they tick the bright boxes on the score sheet....

I truly and honestly belief we need to split from PSPC and legislate that its not beholden to TBS, only to the PBO/PCO. The guiding principles of this new Defence Procurement department should be "Off the shelf, from somewhere else" if there isn't an industry in Canada.

BOOTFORGEN has demonstrated how well we do when we are able to actually get what we need, instead of lining the pockets of a Canadian company that got lucky.

That, but with tanks, fighters, ships, weapons systems....

 

[SeaKingTacco]

Not surprised we are not there but I think we need to go that route, popping the artificial bubble that JT has created. We need to be pushed on the side for real foa a while until he understands.

He doesn’t care.

 

[rmc_wannabe]

Not surprised we are not there but I think we need to go that route, popping the artificial bubble that JT has created. We need to be pushed on the side for real foa a while until he understands.

He understands fully. He just doesn't give a rat's ass.

The Defence Portfolio doesn't buy votes, nor does it see a return on investment domestically. The only thing it buys you is clout internationally, but I think JT realises his goose is cooked on the world stage. He has F'ed Around enough with faux pas' and paper tiger threats that he is now rightfully Finding Out.

Perhaps if we become a grown up country, we might see our national defence, sovereignty, and foreign policy as non-partisan issues. Until then, the CAF is a hot potato no politician wants to hold near and dear to their hearts.

 

[Kirkhill]

He doesn’t care.

But

and it is a big but, there is an outside chance that more Canadians may notice he , and his CABAL, don't care.

And maybe that will focus minds enough that they act at the next election.

 

[Kirkhill]

He understands fully. He just doesn't give a rat's ass.

The Defence Portfolio doesn't buy votes, nor does it see a return on investment domestically. The only thing it buys you is clout internationally, but I think JT realises his goose is cooked on the world stage. He has F'ed Around enough with faux pas' and paper tiger threats that he is now rightfully Finding Out.

Perhaps if we become a grown up country, we might see our national defence, sovereignty, and foreign policy as non-partisan issues. Until then, the CAF is a hot potato no politician wants to hold near and dear to their hearts.

Defence may not be the issue but China, or drugs, or Uktrainians might be.

 

[rmc_wannabe]

Defence may not be the issue but China, or drugs, or Uktrainians might be.

Not as big as home affordability, grocery prices, Healthcare, and many other sacred cows that have been the main narrative for the past 3 years. Your average voter can't see past making next week, let alone if we are prepared to eventually get pulled into conflict on one or both sides of the world.

 

[Good2Golf]

But

and it is a big but, there is an outside chance that more Canadians may notice he , and his CABAL, don't care.

And maybe that will focus minds enough that they act at the next election.

So long as Herr Porsche-Rolex stays attached at the hip, odds are JT’s going to try to ride it out until 2025…

 

[Underway]

Perhaps if we become a grown up country, we might see our national defence, sovereignty, and foreign policy as non-partisan issues. Until then, the CAF is a hot potato no politician wants to hold near and dear to their hearts.

We're not a traditional nation state, we are a collection of provinces. So you're not going to get what you like barring a massive restructuring of federalism. A weak federal government is a feature not a bug. It has nothing to do with being grown up, but everything to do with how we designed federalism.

 

[FJAG]

We're not a traditional nation state, we are a collection of provinces. So you're not going to get what you like barring a massive restructuring of federalism. A weak federal government is a feature not a bug. It has nothing to do with being grown up, but everything to do with how we designed federalism.

Not sure that works.

The US constitution is one heavily tilted to states rights - and yet strong Federal defence powers. The Federal government has essentially coopted the various states' defence forces over the years.

The Canadian constitution is heavily tilted to the Federal government's powers (look, for example, at the residual powers clause) - it doesn't even have provincial defence forces. The Feds coopted that power on the first day.

There are more than enough mechanisms by which the Canadian Federal government could be a "grown up" vis a vis defence. Primarily a constitutional responsibility for national defence and a practically limited taxation and spending power.

It's not structure; it's attitude.

 

[WLSC]

He doesn’t care.

He will when it will turn into big business start to turn is back on us.

 

[WLSC]

Not sure that works.

The US constitution is one heavily tilted to states rights - and yet strong Federal defence powers. The Federal government has essentially coopted the various states' defence forces over the years.

The Canadian constitution is heavily tilted to the Federal government's powers (look, for example, at the residual powers clause) - it doesn't even have provincial defence forces. The Feds coopted that power on the first day.

There are more than enough mechanisms by which the Canadian Federal government could be a "grown up" vis a vis defence. Primarily a constitutional responsibility for national defence and a practically limited taxation and spending power.

It's not structure; it's attitude.

I’ve said it somewhere else on the forum, the federal abandoned it responsibilities and had become a big provincial government. The two level is competing on who’s will be the real care giver to the population.

Not that the federal doesn’t have a role to play, it sure does but as you said, it’s all about the attitude.

 

[Rifleman62]

Not as big as home affordability, grocery prices, Healthcare, and many other sacred cows that have been the main narrative for the past 3 years.

Trudeau has failed at the above.

 

[ueo]

But

and it is a big but, there is an outside chance that more Canadians may notice he , and his CABAL, don't care.

And maybe that will focus minds enough that they act at the next election.

Presuposes an interest on the part of Joe Canadian.

 

[Spencer100]

I’ve said it somewhere else on the forum, the federal abandoned it responsibilities and had become a big provincial government. The two level is competing on who’s will be the real care giver to the population.

I like the way you put that. It so true.

 

[KevinB]

He will when it will turn into big business start to turn is back on us.

Start? It’s been occurring for years.

 

[rmc_wannabe]

Start? It’s been occurring for years.

This.

Most vendors in the US clamor for defence contracts. In Canada, they run the other way. Why? It's a losing bet.

The odds are heavily stacked against the industry; the GoC will either take too long to make a decision, will demand the project be within some asinine paramater (Green, Aboriginal, vote rich Ste. Poutain de Caliss, etm.) , or eventually cancel the project after a decade of courting and R&D.

 

[Furniture]

He will when it will turn into big business start to turn is back on us.

He won't care, because he is wealthy enough that he and his children will never feel the impact of it.

 

[KevinB]

He won't care, because he is wealthy enough that he and his children will never feel the impact of it.

Pretty sure someone named Louis the XVI thought the same

 

[Kirkhill]

Other stuff we're missing out on because: China

The AI side of AUKUS: UK reveals ground-breaking, allied tech demo - Breaking Defense

The AI trial saw a wide range of air and ground vehicles tasked with testing target identification capabilities, as the allies cope with what the UK Ministry of Defence called a "rapidly evolving" strategic environment.

breakingdefense.com

Boeing's Ghost Bat loyal wingman drone spotted hanging in US - Breaking Defense

The Air Force said months ago it was planning to run flight experiments with the unmanned system, and even though this Ghost Bat was housed not far from an Air Force base, it's unclear if the testing has begun.

breakingdefense.com

 

[Kirkhill]

And in the UK even the bean counters are figuring out there is something to this risk/reward calculation.

Apparently indecision costs lives.

After watching Ukraine, UK 'looking at' more risk-taking in weapons development, integration - Breaking Defense

“Making these decisions can actually affect the safety of people, so what we’re looking at now, [considering] there will always be an end-state of a design for a weapon, there may be occasions where we want to take greater risk and therefore accelerate integration," said John Cunningham, Head of...

breakingdefense.com

Continuous Improvement demands Continuous Investment.

 

[KevinB]

Other stuff we're missing out on because: China

The AI side of AUKUS: UK reveals ground-breaking, allied tech demo - Breaking Defense

The AI trial saw a wide range of air and ground vehicles tasked with testing target identification capabilities, as the allies cope with what the UK Ministry of Defence called a "rapidly evolving" strategic environment.

breakingdefense.com

Boeing's Ghost Bat loyal wingman drone spotted hanging in US - Breaking Defense

The Air Force said months ago it was planning to run flight experiments with the unmanned system, and even though this Ghost Bat was housed not far from an Air Force base, it's unclear if the testing has begun.

breakingdefense.com

It’s just not China, it’s Canada’s entire reluctance to be an adult on Defense issues.