Government hints at boosting Canada’s military spending

I have long said that you could fund the CAF to 4 percent of GDP, but we would still lag behind in NATO and be much the same where we are.

It's never the money, it's politics. It's procedures. It's the pork-barreling in our defence spending that makes us a paper tiger in NATO.

My only hope in all of this for the CAF and the GoC, whatever the political stripe that may be, is that it will rouse them out of the "Peace Dividend" slumber. The world has been unstable since 1945. We have used geography, proximity, and association as a Defence Policy ever since. ICBMs don't care how close to the U.S. or how far from Russia/China we are.

Don't give us a dime more, but let us spend money on defence like it matters. The fact we follow the same rules for purchasing a fighter aircraft as we do for buying office furniture for a Service Canada office is disgraceful. Don't treat defense procurement as a stimulus package for Canadian Industry. There I said it.

We spend so much money, time, and effort trying to get that money to stay in Canada; be it by awarding contracts to companies with no capability to produce items without first "retooling" and"developing the production lines", or by hamstringing perfectly competent and competitive bidders by forcing the project to be made in St. Margaret de Poutain de Champignon, QC because the ruling government either lost the seat in the election, or won it with promises.

We spend so much money and staff hours jumping through TBS regulations that are great for other departments, but are terrible for defence procurement. Some items you have to sole source, because there are technologies and capabilities no one else makes. By doing the bid process, you get companies clamoring for a project they can't deliver on, but because they tick the bright boxes on the score sheet....

I truly and honestly belief we need to split from PSPC and legislate that its not beholden to TBS, only to the PBO/PCO. The guiding principles of this new Defence Procurement department should be "Off the shelf, from somewhere else" if there isn't an industry in Canada.

BOOTFORGEN has demonstrated how well we do when we are able to actually get what we need, instead of lining the pockets of a Canadian company that got lucky.

That, but with tanks, fighters, ships, weapons systems....

 

[Halifax Tar]

I think selection for recruiting needs to be taken away from Career Managers, and handled by CFRG themselves. Make it a selection process, and reward those who choose to be selected.

In my experience, some CMs use recruiting centres as a place to dump a member that wants to live in a particular area, rather than selecting the right personality.

Like I said, the CAF owns part of the problem, but not all of it.

The problem for the whole of the CAF is the competing priorities and national/international obligations...

Its: recruiting VS retention VS training VS operations VS support

Where is our concentration of effort supposed to lay ?

 

[Good2Golf]

Where is our concentration of effort supposed to lay ?

Yes…

 

[Halifax Tar]

Yes…

lol Now I feel better lol

 

[FSTO]

I suspect Clinton lucked out based on what day of the year he was born.

My recollection of the draft goes back to the late 1960s when I was eligible. Around that time, if I recall correctly, the Selective Service (I love that name) under the highly-unpopular General Hershey organized a “draft lottery” based on one’s birthday. All 365 days of the year were placed into a large drum…kind of like what you see on some of the TV shows. In fact, I remember the Selective Service staging a special TV prime time broadcast one night in 1969 to show the American public the draft numbers as they were being picked; I just can’t remember though if there was a sexy girl picking the numbers LOL. Suspense was high and I’m sure the broadcast ratings must have been quite significant as countless millions of eligible young men were hoping to avoid being drafted.

As it turns out the guys whose birthdays corresponded to the first 122 days picked from the drum were prime draft picks so to speak. The second 122 picks were less likely to be drafted. And the final 121 would’t have to worry about being picked.

My draft number (I think it was 37) put me in the top group to be called up, barring any exemptions (such as being in university…I was already enrolled in one). Most of those who were then eligible would probably go to Viet Nam…although my cousin was called up and ended up being stationed in Panama, which he considered a hell hole and was trying to get sent to Viet Nam instead (an even bigger hell hole. As it turns out my mother, unbeknownst to me, had already contacted the local draft board and arranged a sole surviving son exemption for me based on the fact that my father had died while in the USN in the 1950s and I was the only surviving male to carry on the family name. That meant that I would have been called up only in the direst national emergency (e.g. World War 3) in which all other eligible draftees had already been inducted.

Not sure if there is a similar method in place should the U.S. draft be reinstated.

Was there anything stopping a person to just go and join the Coast Guard or Navy instead of getting drafted into the infantry?

 

[Ostrozac]

Was there anything stopping a person to just go and join the Coast Guard or Navy instead of getting drafted into the infantry?

The availability of positions for one thing — the US Navy, Coast Guard and Air Force were all-volunteer throughout the Vietnam era, and could take their pick of suitable candidates.

 

[daftandbarmy]

Was there anything stopping a person to just go and join the Coast Guard or Navy instead of getting drafted into the infantry?

These guys?

 

[markppcli]

I think selection for recruiting needs to be taken away from Career Managers, and handled by CFRG themselves. Make it a selection process, and reward those who choose to be selected.

In my experience, some CMs use recruiting centres as a place to dump a member that wants to live in a particular area, rather than selecting the right personality.

Like I said, the CAF owns part of the problem, but not all of it.

Which is ridiculous because they merit super fucking high .

@daftandbarmy did you consider that the recruiter was just baffled you were trying to gather a physical pamphlet for a potential applicant who has access to the internet ?

 

[daftandbarmy]

Which is ridiculous because they merit super fucking high .

@daftandbarmy did you consider that the recruiter was just baffled you were trying to gather a physical pamphlet for a potential applicant who has access to the internet ?

He did not engage with me apart from shooting me some annoyed looks, so I can't comment.

In another time and place I would have charged his miserable ass

 

[Furniture]

Which is ridiculous because they merit super fucking high .

@daftandbarmy did you consider that the recruiter was just baffled you were trying to gather a physical pamphlet for a potential applicant who has access to the internet ?

Might be more of a "thing" in occupations like mine, where they have a limited number of positions in any one place, but lots of places with those limited positions.

Most locations my occupation has positions, we have less than 10 positions ranging from S3-PO 2.

 

[ArmyRick]

Meanwhile, the 65+, and 75+ year old machine guns enter the chat

FN MAG - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

M2 Browning - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

But they stayed in shape.

 

[markppcli]

Might be more of a "thing" in occupations like mine, where they have a limited number of positions in any one place, but lots of places with those limited positions.

Most locations my occupation has positions, we have less than 10 positions ranging from S3-PO 2.

Recruiting is the highest priority posting, so normally they get people who are good at their jobs…. Those jobs however are not necessarily going to translate to recruitment

 

[Furniture]

Recruiting is the highest priority posting, so normally they get people who are good at their jobs…. Those jobs however are not necessarily going to translate to recruitment

Again, it's occupation dependent. The PPCLI might view recruiting that way, but I know for a fact other trades do not.

I know people posted to recruiting centres... Let's just say that I wouldn't want some of them as subordinates.

 

[Grimey]

These guys?

So what? That’s the average morning stand-easy.

 

[markppcli]

Again, it's occupation dependent. The PPCLI might view recruiting that way, but I know for a fact other trades do not.

I know people posted to recruiting centres... Let's just say that I wouldn't want some of them as subordinates.

Okay, well I suppose that is possible but as I understood it it was all across the army that recruiting was 1, schools 2, units 3.

Obviously what career managers end up doing will be up to them. I reiterate that job proficiency = \ = good recruiter.

 

[Grimey]

A few months ago I went ionto a local CFRC looking for some pamphlets or other up to date info for the son of a friend.

Trying to get in, I was treated like a criminal. Standing there awkwardly in an almost empty office, fielding glares from an angry Sgt who was looking after the only other guy in there, I gave it 15 minutes then had to leave to make a meeting on time. Empty handed. After the worst customer service experience of my recent life (and I've been to the UK recently).

I think they need more than a few tools

Did you give said Sgt your best crap hat glare?

 

[Furniture]

Okay, well I suppose that is possible but as I understood it it was all across the army that recruiting was 1, schools 2, units 3.

Obviously what career managers end up doing will be up to them. I reiterate that job proficiency = \ = good recruiter.

Ah... yes, for bums in seats, not for quality.

My main point, and it goes beyond recruiting, is the CAF does not select people for jobs based on personality, rather based on checklists, and "who's available today, and willing". That leads to a lot of bad choices, and "expert" by posting message...

 

[daftandbarmy]

Did you give said Sgt your best crap hat glare?

I was standing over by the (oddly bizarre) array of headless uniformed mannequins they have on display in the front window, as a warning I guess, so might have blended in too well

 

[rmc_wannabe]

Ah... yes, for bums in seats, not for quality.

My main point, and it goes beyond recruiting, is the CAF does not select people for jobs based on personality, rather based on checklists, and "who's available today, and willing". That leads to a lot of bad choices, and "expert" by posting message...

Career, Talent, Potential, Position Management. There we go. That's more accurate.

Funny that we in the RCCS have 4 NCM trades that are in the Red and incentivized recruiting, yet, we currently have ZERO billets for recruiting or MCCs. CCA Priority is for training, CAF priority is for operational support. Hard to sell our trades when recruiters don't have any first hand knowledge of them outside "Iunno....Infantry with a radio I think?"

 

[Furniture]

Career, Talent, Potential, Position Management. There we go. That's more accurate.

Funny that we in the RCCS have 4 NCM trades that are in the Red and incentivized recruiting, yet, we currently have ZERO billets for recruiting or MCCs. CCA Priority is for training, CAF priority is for operational support. Hard to sell our trades when recruiters don't have any first hand knowledge of them outside "Iunno....Infantry with a radio I think?"

We have one billet, in Fredericton... beside the JMC in Gagetown, so it's a no cost move to put someone there from JMC, to keep them in the area longer.

Recruiters can never know all occupations, but there needs to be more work on getting relevant info to the recruiting centres, and maybe more occupations filling recruiting roles.

 

[rmc_wannabe]

We have one billet, in Fredericton... beside the JMC in Gagetown, so it's a no cost move to put someone there from JMC, to keep them in the area longer.

Recruiters can never know all occupations, but there needs to be more work on getting relevant info to the recruiting centres, and maybe more occupations filling recruiting roles.

Many in the RCCS have asked. We have received a "hard no" from both MPC and the Sigs Mafia. Why? "Well it's out of trade and we need people doing the business...."

Yes. That's the point. Have people who know what the hell they're talking about sell the trades for what they are, not what someone thinks they ought to be; then maybe you'll have MORE people doing the business.

I mentioned IS Tech becoming a thing in a Facebook post 2019, and a friend who was a recruiter asked offline for an ELI5 from me because, shockingly, CFRG had no idea the Corps was restructuring and was still pushing ACISS as a thing.