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Government hints at boosting Canada’s military spending

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I have long said that you could fund the CAF to 4 percent of GDP, but we would still lag behind in NATO and be much the same where we are.

It's never the money, it's politics. It's procedures. It's the pork-barreling in our defence spending that makes us a paper tiger in NATO.

My only hope in all of this for the CAF and the GoC, whatever the political stripe that may be, is that it will rouse them out of the "Peace Dividend" slumber. The world has been unstable since 1945. We have used geography, proximity, and association as a Defence Policy ever since. ICBMs don't care how close to the U.S. or how far from Russia/China we are.

Don't give us a dime more, but let us spend money on defence like it matters. The fact we follow the same rules for purchasing a fighter aircraft as we do for buying office furniture for a Service Canada office is disgraceful. Don't treat defense procurement as a stimulus package for Canadian Industry. There I said it.

We spend so much money, time, and effort trying to get that money to stay in Canada; be it by awarding contracts to companies with no capability to produce items without first "retooling" and"developing the production lines", or by hamstringing perfectly competent and competitive bidders by forcing the project to be made in St. Margaret de Poutain de Champignon, QC because the ruling government either lost the seat in the election, or won it with promises.

We spend so much money and staff hours jumping through TBS regulations that are great for other departments, but are terrible for defence procurement. Some items you have to sole source, because there are technologies and capabilities no one else makes. By doing the bid process, you get companies clamoring for a project they can't deliver on, but because they tick the bright boxes on the score sheet....

I truly and honestly belief we need to split from PSPC and legislate that its not beholden to TBS, only to the PBO/PCO. The guiding principles of this new Defence Procurement department should be "Off the shelf, from somewhere else" if there isn't an industry in Canada.

BOOTFORGEN has demonstrated how well we do when we are able to actually get what we need, instead of lining the pockets of a Canadian company that got lucky.

That, but with tanks, fighters, ships, weapons systems....
 
You nailed the main issue. People are not willing to "sacrifice" People want big money, big benefits for entry level performance/ positions with little to any sacrifice.
One has to make sacrifices if they want to buy that house, buy that boat and have the vacations in warm places in the winter.

I tell the people where I work. If you want the money to go buy a house, buy a new truck. Go work the Oilfield for a few years. Save up the money, then come back to our current job. (which should be well compensated, but not so)
People are willing to sacrifice, if the reward is clear and they deem it worthwhile.

What people aren't willing to do is pay to go to a college to learn a skill that might get them in a high "sacrifice" job, that may some day pay off big time.

We are living with the consequences of industries having turned away people for 20+ years. We lost an entire generation of workers because boomers stayed working, and companies decided that they could treat new workers as disposable. Turns out that if you do that for a couple of decades, you get a reputation as a bad place to work.
 
I think you are beyond the writ of what the RCN/CAF or any western Armed Forces can offer. You could build apartments and PMQ's and tie rent there to pay. But even that will take 10 years to show an effect, that would be in the possible writ of the CAF.
 
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I think you are beyond the writ of what the RCN/CAF or any western Armed Forces can offer. You could build apartments and PMQ's and tie rent there to pay. But even that will take 10 years to show an effect, that would be in the possible writ of the CAF.
That is a possible solution not just for the CAF, but also for the marine industry in general. That industry refuses to consider it has more to do with the availability of cheap foreign labour than it does with feasibility.

People are fairly simple. They want a "nice" place to live, the ability to spend some money on entertainment/toys, and they want time to enjoy their entertainment/toys. The only reason the CAF can't sort it out is the voting public doesn't care about the CAF or it's problems.
 
The only reason the CAF can't sort it out is the voting public doesn't care about the CAF or its problems.
The government of Canada funds a dysfunctional and broken DND currently to approximately 700$ per capita.
A family of 4 in BC with no government employee benefits pays approximately 1200$/per capita for extended care benefits. One is expensive and useful to the family, the other is expensive and without a doubt useless to that family.

Do you see why the public doesn’t care about the CAF.
 
The government of Canada funds a dysfunctional and broken DND currently to approximately 700$ per capita.
A family of 4 in BC with no government employee benefits pays approximately 1200$/per capita for extended care benefits. One is expensive and useful to the family, the other is expensive and without a doubt useless to that family.

Do you see why the public doesn’t care about the CAF.
Except, the CAF is a big part of the reason the family in BC get as much as they do out of the system.

Canada is a trading nation, which means it relies on the good will of others, as well as safe and secure trade routes. The CAF helps ensure both of those things... A responsible government would make that clear to Canadians, but we don't have responsible governments, so Canadians are told the CAF is a waste of money.
 
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There is a huge effort to do just that, with various levels of the sector and government involvement, and it mainly comes down to the reason why other sectors of the economy are suffering too: not enough young people ...

Canada tries to combat aging marine shipping workforce with online 'ocean school'​

Transport Canada says 43% of marine workforce set to retire over next 10 years​


From the article:

After a "few months of training," Fields said people can go directly into entry-level positions that pay around $60,000 per year and are responsible for duties such as maintaining and docking the vessel, and loading cargo.

So, after paying for training, you can maybe get a Cpl equivalent job that will take you away from home half of the year, every year, for the rest of your working life... Lets be honest, $60K sounds good to those of us who grew up in a world where houses cost $100-300K... In a world of $600K+ houses near the ports we need people, $60K doesn't sound appealing.
 
So, after paying for training, you can maybe get a Cpl equivalent job that will take you away from home half of the year, every year, for the rest of your working life... Lets be honest, $60K sounds good to those of us who grew up in a world where houses cost $100-300K... In a world of $600K+ houses near the ports we need people, $60K doesn't sound appealing.
A Cpl starts at $72K...
 
A Cpl starts at $72K...
Yep and a lot of the seagoing trades are Spec 1 so an S1 (Sailor 1st Class = Cpl) is ~$80'000. That of course doesn't include Sea Pay ($267 per month minimum ~3400/year) , or your Canadian forces housing differential which tops you up to the tune of $800 per month in Victoria ($9600) or Halifax $450 per month ($5400).

All together a S1 with Spec 1 earns ~$92'800 if they are posted to ship in Victoria. And if you go on deployment well, tax free is the big money.

Hmm I think I need to redo my sales pitch to teenagers.
 
Yep and a lot of the seagoing trades are Spec 1 so an S1 (Sailor 1st Class = Cpl) is ~$80'000. That of course doesn't include Sea Pay ($267 per month minimum ~3400/year) , or your Canadian forces housing differential which tops you up to the tune of $800 per month in Victoria ($9600) or Halifax $450 per month ($5400).

All together a S1 with Spec 1 earns ~$92'800 if they are posted to ship in Victoria. And if you go on deployment well, tax free is the big money.

Hmm I think I need to redo my sales pitch to teenagers.
Your SDA is off, it starts at $327/month, and by the time you're a S1 you're likely not too far off $465/month.
 
Your SDA is off, it starts at $327/month, and by the time you're a S1 you're likely not too far off $465/month.
Probably grabbed an out of date version when I was online. The one I was looking at was last finalized in 2021.

Edit: Was for some reason looking at the Paratroop allowance. So yah, you are correct its higher.
 
Yep and a lot of the seagoing trades are Spec 1 so an S1 (Sailor 1st Class = Cpl) is ~$80'000. That of course doesn't include Sea Pay ($267 per month minimum ~3400/year) , or your Canadian forces housing differential which tops you up to the tune of $800 per month in Victoria ($9600) or Halifax $450 per month ($5400).

All together a S1 with Spec 1 earns ~$92'800 if they are posted to ship in Victoria. And if you go on deployment well, tax free is the big money.

Hmm I think I need to redo my sales pitch to teenagers.
Wow.

But, unlike many (most?) civilians, the moving around for most people means that it’s also a 1-income family.
 
Yep and a lot of the seagoing trades are Spec 1 so an S1 (Sailor 1st Class = Cpl) is ~$80'000. That of course doesn't include Sea Pay ($267 per month minimum ~3400/year) , or your Canadian forces housing differential which tops you up to the tune of $800 per month in Victoria ($9600) or Halifax $450 per month ($5400).

All together a S1 with Spec 1 earns ~$92'800 if they are posted to ship in Victoria. And if you go on deployment well, tax free is the big money.

Hmm I think I need to redo my sales pitch to teenagers.

I'm a CPO2, and I am in the top three for FSPs on the ship. And this deployment has shown me the tax free, FSP ect ect are not worth it.

I actually had to sit with my Snr HRA and go over my pay as I was shocked. To quote him "It's not worth it, is it Chief ?", no it's not.
 
I'm a CPO2, and I am in the top three for FSPs on the ship. And this deployment has shown me the tax free, FSP ect ect are not worth it.

I actually had to sit with my Snr HRA and go over my pay as I was shocked. To quote him "It's not worth it, is it Chief ?", no it's not.
As someone at the second level of SDA, but with lots of FSP/Hardship points, it would totally be worth it for me.

It's a weird situation to be in though, because ma lot of sailors with lots of experience will end up not much farther ahead to spend a lot of time away.
 
It's a weird situation to be in though, because ma lot of sailors with lots of experience will end up not much farther ahead to spend a lot of time away.

That's exactly it.

My time and experience is valuable, and I believe it should be compensated accordingly. This deployment it has not been compensated accordingly, IMHO.
 
My time and experience is valuable, and I believe it should be compensated accordingly. This deployment it has not been compensated accordingly, IMHO.

Do you mean the pay and benefits together as a CPO2 on deployment are not in line with the expectations of the rank and position when compared with the pay and benefits of a lower rank and the expectations of that rank?
 
Do you mean the pay and benefits together as a CPO2 on deployment are not in line with the expectations of the rank and position when compared with the pay and benefits of a lower rank and the expectations of that rank?

Yes. And I would like to add I continue to be underwhelmed by our post deployment leave compensation package.
 
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