Hobbit?

[jordan_o]

Australian and Indonesian scientists have identified a new and completely unexpected species of human. It was only a metre high, had a small brain but a distinctly human face. It made delicate stone tools and it shared the planet with Homo sapiens at least 18,000 years ago.

The scientists report in Nature today that they found the skull and incomplete skeleton of creature known as LB1 in the sediments of a limestone cave at Liang Bua on the remote island of Flores in Indonesia last September.

Since then, fragments of bone from at least seven individuals have been found.

The new creature, officially titled Homo floresiensis but nicknamed "the hobbit" by some researchers, upsets the orthodox view of human evolution.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/indonesia/Story/0,2763,1337717,00.html

Just found this, thought it was interesting...thoughts?

 

[Sh0rtbUs]

I was kinda disapointed there wasnt a picture. Sounds like something the Inquirer would release.

 

[Michael OLeary]

Skull of hominid Homo floresiensis, top, and a modern human. (Courtesy: Peter Brown)

http://www.cbc.ca/story/science/national/2004/10/27/dwarf_hominid041027.html

New find raises questions about earliest humans
Last Updated Wed, 27 Oct 2004 19:04:40 EDT

LONDON - Modern humans began dominating the world far earlier than thought, according to anthropologists who say they've discovered fossils of a new human dwarf species.

One specimen appears to be an adult female less than one metre tall with slight dimensions, coarse features and a skull the size of a grapefruit.
Skull of hominid Homo floresiensis, top, and a modern human. (Courtesy: Peter Brown)

The creature lived about 18,000 years ago on the remote Indonesian island of Flores east of Java, leading researchers to dub it Homo floresiensis, "Man of Flores."

"It challenges the whole idea of what it is that makes us human," Prof. Chris Stringer, of the Natural History Museum in London, told a news conference on Wednesday.

For decades, researchers believed Homo sapiens dominated the world. The new find may mean we coexisted with another Homo species more recently than thought, some anthropologists say.

The discovery includes the skull, femur and tibia, hand and vertebrae fragments from one individual, and a premolar from another.

Peter Brown of the University of New England in Australia and his colleagues describe the fossils and their archeological significance in Thursday's issue of the journal Nature.

The researchers think the new species descended from full-sized Homo erectus, which are thought to be the forebears of Homo sapiens.

"They are among the most outstanding discoveries in paleoanthropology for half a century," wrote University of Cambridge anthropologists Marta Mirazon Lahr and Robert Foley in a Nature commentary.

Species debate
The find includes small canine teeth and evidence of walking upright â “ key traits of the genus Homo, the pair said.

Evidence from the cave site suggests Flores Man made stone tools, lit fires and hunted in groups. The fossils were found together with prehistoric dwarf elephants and Komodo dragons.

Since the specimen bears little resemblance to modern humans or an australopithecine like Lucy, not all anthropologists agree it belongs in the genus Homo.

A lack of food and overpopulation may have pressured Flores Man to shrink in height, the researchers speculated. Over time, it was replaced by taller hominids with bigger brains.

Documenting whether the two species interacted is a priority for future research, said study co-author Mike Morwood of University of New England.

Written by CBC News Online staff

 

[Pieman]

The researchers think the new species descended from full-sized Homo erectus, which are thought to be the forebears of Homo sapiens.

Any relation to these wee lads I wonder?

http://www.artsci.wustl.edu/~anthro/courses/306/ituri_coolidge.JPG

 

[atticus]

couldn't it just have been a midget? Or just like a dwarf like group of people like the picture above? they only found bone fragments of 7 other ones so how do they know they were the same?

P.S. Whats the info on the picture???

 

[1feral1]

Nope, definatly a small separate species, and there was drawing of the creature in yesterday's Sydney Daily Telegraph. Try www.dailytelegraph.com.au . In today's paper they say the creatures existed as little as 500 yrs ago, as the Dutch mention about them in diaries.

Regards,

Wes

 

[Scratch_043]

it is possible that there was a seperate group of unevolved humans on this island who are only a metre tall, as a long time ago, all homosapiens were that short.

 

[FormerEnlisted]

I remember reading a history of South Africa and at the beginning it explains how the Zulu's would use aboriginal midgets in their gold mines... maybe this has some bearing...

 

[PARAMEDIC]

maybe they were the pygme equivalent of  regular african people. (if ya make me explain this to ya imma break this keyboard over ya head) ;D

Scientist who spend their life time trying to find a new species want to give meaning to their wasted years.

or they could be Endorians (battle for Endor)  ;D ;D those little furry buggers

 

[Scratch_043]

or they could be Endorians (battle for Endor) ;D ;D those little furry buggers

I like that explanation best, let's go with that.

 

[atticus]

I just found this:
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=1540&ncid=1540&e=2&u=/afp/20041106/sc_afp/indonesia_science_palaeontology_041106133524

JAKARTA (AFP) - A leading Indonesian scientist challenged the widely publicised theory that fossilised bones found on the eastern island of Flores were from a previously unknown species of human.


Professor Teuku Jacob, chief palaeontologist from the state Gajah Mada University, will carry out tests to prove the fossils are from a sub-species of homo sapiens -- "an ordinary human being, just like us".


"It is not a new species. It is a sub-species of homo sapiens classified under the Austrolomelanesid race. If it's not a new species, why should it be given a new name?" the professor said.


Australian scientists last month made world headlines by announcing the discovery of a new twig in mankind's family tree, 'homo floriensis', a one-metre (3.25 foot) hominid with a grapefruit-sized skull.


Their theory, published in the British weekly scientific journal Nature, was that it was the smallest of the 10 known species of the genus Homo, the hominid that arose out of Africa about 2.5 million years ago.


Jacob said his team will aim to prove that the skeleton is from a 25-30-year-old omnivorous sub-species of man, not a 30-year-old female from the new species as previously announced.


They believe the skeleton's small skull is related to mental defects rather than being evidence that it is a different species.


In an intriguing development last month, researcher Bert Roberts of the University of Wollongong told the Australian newspaper that the new skeleton sounded remarkably similar to the Ebu Gogo, strange hairy little people that legend says lived on Flores.

 

[I_am_John_Galt]

National Geographic did an interesting article on the subject: http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2004/10/1027_041027_homo_floresiensis.html

[attachment deleted by admin]

 

[bubba]

hey i know that guy

 

[Big Foot]

Hmmm, that guy seems to resemble people I've seen on the bus... :warstory:

 

[Sheerin]

it is possible that there was a separate group of unevolved humans on this island who are only a metre tall, as a long time ago, all homosapiens were that short.

umm, not exactly. 

First of all anatomically modern Homo sapiens sapiens began appearing in the archaeological record approximately 100 KYA (thousand years ago).  archaic Homo sapiens sapeisn appeared between 500 and 250 KYA, and roughly during this period (250KYA on) that Homo sapiens neandertalensis appeared. 
All these sub groups of humans were really, on average, only a few centimetres shorter than us. 
In short, with the exception of genetic conditions like Achondroplasia, very few, if any, modern, archaic and neandertal were as short as flores man.
Based on the morphological evidence (as posted earlier in this discussion) it looks like Flores was a sub-species of Homo erectus.  This is based on the brow ridges, the sloped forehead, the zygomatic arch, the orbits, et cetera.  If I have time on Monday I'll post a some pictures of erectus skulls. 

And finally, I think you may be thinking Australopithecus and its many sub-species.  These early hominids were fairly short, the tallest one found (if I remember correctly was only just over 1 metre).  They inhabited Africa roughly 4.5 MYA (million years ago).  They never left Africa either so it is impossible that Flores could be an Australopithecus.  Again the morphological traits on the skull shown aren't even close to what Australopithecus looked like. 
A little tidbit, the first proto-human species to leave Africa appears to be H. erectus roughly 1.5 mya.


Fagan, Brian M. 2004.  People of the Earth: An introduction to world prehistory
, 11th ed  Pearson Prentice Hall New Jersey

 

[Burrows]

I like that explanation best, let's go with that.

ITS AN EWOK!!!not ENDORIAN? what are you smoking?

 

[Scratch_043]

actually, there is a 'seperate' movie about the ewoks, and in that movie, they are called endorians.

 

[atticus]

actually, there is a 'seperate' movie about the ewoks, and in that movie, they are called endorians.

What? A Star Wars movie? Whats that called?

 

[JBP]

actually, there is a 'seperate' movie about the ewoks, and in that movie, they are called endorians.

Dude, I think your getting Star Trek mixed up with Star Wars! Only time I've EVER heard of "Endorians" was on Star Trek. Never Star Wars, can we say copyright infringement!?!?!

Unless you found some amazing long lost/little known snippet of Star Wars where that's at?!?!

I'd be more than happy to see it!!!

 

[NavyGrunt]

The planet moon that the Ewoks are on is called Endor.......there is no endor in Star Trek......The movies was called "Ewoks" was it not.....

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0087225/