How about forming a Reg Force Kilted Regiment

[Edward Campbell]

2nd Bns all kilted? How ridiculous.

Make it the 3rd Bns.  I look forward to the kilted para companies, particularly jumping in for an arctic SovEx.

Done, already: see here, 3rd paragraph.

 

[Task]

If we form it for that particular reason, what do we do with it after CF involvement in Afghanistan ends?

(Or any other such unit formed because of a CF role in a particular region.)

Good question. If it were a Coy size it should be easy enough to absorb in other near by units. Reg't size a tad more difficult. I honestly have not thought about it that hard. It was more of a fleeting thought after seeing the topic.

Are you proposing a segregated military? I know this is not your intent, but that's what it amounts to.

We are already segregated ask a PPCLI what he thinks of an RCR. Segregation is a tool used to build esprit du corps and part of human nature. So is used properly as the military generally does it is very effective.

Yeah, good idea.  After all, they would be better off with *their own kind* instead of mixing with the rest of us Canadians, right?

Do you think that way now when you look at a member of non-Eurpean decent? I wouldn't think so. My point is the CF is predominantly white male but you don't think of yourself in terms of 'us or them' (barring Regimental affiliations) you think of us all as Canadian soldiers.


Before this gets too carried away please realize this was just a thought I had.  I am not trying to elevate anyones blood pressure but I open for discussion.

I want to win whatever we do and I believe we are not using one of our Canadas resources.

 

[chrisf]

For the rest of you who are wondering WTF??? - R22eR: Largely Francophone; PPCLI: Largely Redneck ( ); The RCR : a preponderance of Newfoundlanders and Maritimers which makes it difficult to communicate with either of the other 2 regiments (and their supporting units if they aren't from the areas aforementioned). 

Then perhaps we should change the dress ethnically based on those criteria? Dress uniform with cow-boy hat and jeans for the PPCLI, large yellow rubber sou' westers for the RCR to match their scarlets, and.... well I don't know what sort of clothes is stereotypical in Quebec, perhaps they could just carry a slice of meat pie on parade?

 

[Brutus]

Good question. If it were a Coy size it should be easy enough to absorb in other near by units. Reg't size a tad more difficult. I honestly have not thought about it that hard. It was more of a fleeting thought after seeing the topic.

We are already segregated ask a PPCLI what he thinks of an RCR. Segregation is a tool used to build esprit du corps and part of human nature. So is used properly as the military generally does it is very effective.

Do you think that way now when you look at a member of non-Eurpean decent? I wouldn't think so. My point is the CF is predominantly white male but you don't think of yourself in terms of 'us or them' (barring Regimental affiliations) you think of us all as Canadian soldiers.


Before this gets too carried away please realize this was just a thought I had.  I am not trying to elevate anyones blood pressure but I open for discussion.

I want to win whatever we do and I believe we are not using one of our Canadas resources.

Segregation based on race is not only just plain wrong, it's a violation of the Charter and the Human Rights Code. Besides, I was under the impression that when a soldier that deploys to a country of their ethnic origin, we change hide their connection to that country by changing their nametag (I seem to remember a post here somewhere referencing a troop of Yugo descent having a name tag with 'Smith' on it).

 

[57Chevy]

Having a respected proportion of Foreign Canadians in any unit is ideal.
It represents the multicultural society that we live in.
We are all responsible for the defence of our country

 

[Task]

Segregation based on race is not only just plain wrong, it's a violation of the Charter and the Human Rights Code. Besides, I was under the impression that when a soldier that deploys to a country of their ethnic origin, we change hide their connection to that country by changing their nametag (I seem to remember a post here somewhere referencing a troop of Yugo descent having a name tag with 'Smith' on it).

I would think it would have to be organized like scottish Regiments. Any may join but the attraction would likely be of the targeted ethnic culture.

We changed their names for a different reason than what I am proposing. The Smith we used in Bosnia was used to spy on our interpreters to ensure they were relaying what we were saying to the population. I imagine the reason we did this (correct me if I am wrong) and not use them for terps was because we did not have enough of them.

 

[Foxhound]

PPCLI: Largely Redneck (  ); The RCR : a preponderance of Newfoundlanders and Maritimers which makes it difficult to communicate with either of the other 2 regiments

[off topic]
:warstory: Oh,"Down Home" isn't too difficult to learn, back in the day in London, the whole battalion spoke it fluently.  Even those that weren't from Down Home.  So fluently in fact, I seem to remember one spectacular dressing-down because the subject had answered, "Yes b'y" to a CSM.  I think the lad was from Ottawa.  Even the servers at Timmies on Oxford St. learned it, and spoke it.

I also remember a certain eight-fingered Sgt. in the INT Sect., re-badged in from The PPCLI, who grew to "appreciate" the phrase, "LOR' TUNNERIN'.. (fill in the blank)!!!"
[/off topic]

 

[Dwight Schrute]

Hell, half of 3PPCLI were Cape Bretoners, Newfies or from PEI when I was in. Good scrappers. You wanted a Caper on your side when things went sideways at the Tudor House (plugs always outnumbered us 5 to 1).

 

[Infanteer]

Without the Reserve tribes I think we already would have gone to a much cheaper and easier system of numbered regiments like Australia has done.

This is probably the only statement in 4 pages actually worth discussing.

 

[vonGarvin]

Without the Reserve tribes I think we already would have gone to a much cheaper and easier system of numbered regiments like Australia has done.

This is probably the only statement in 4 pages actually worth discussing.

As I recall from my Regimental Officers' Indoctrination Course in 1999, we were told how back during unification/integration, there was a move afoot to do just that; however, it wasn't the Reserve Tribes that "saved" us: it was the Royal 22e Régiment.  It was argued that without a unique "canadien" regiment, an aspect of our "dual" society would have been lost.  Let us not forget that in that time (~1970) a certain group of young Québecois youth were feeling "disenfranchised" and had a little club called the "FLQ".  Anyway, that's how it was explained to us.

As for having units such as "Queen's Own Rifles" on UN duties as neutral observers when on one side of the belligerants were elements of the UK Army, who also had as commander in chief a certain HM The Queen, the appearance was that they weren't neutral at all.

As for having regiments that are based on exclusivity, I'd rather have inclusivity, which we already do.  The Royal Canadian Regiment, Princess Patricia's Canadian Light Infanty and Royal 22e Régiment all have rich histories and traditions that reflect Canadian history.  The reserve units also have rich histories that reflect and comprise Canadian History. 

As stated elsewhere in this thread: the system may need tweaking, but when prioritised, it falls well after such things as "What APC will we need?" and "How can we train musketry?".  Besides, wouldn't an airborne highland regiment require special weighted kilts to avoid this?

 

[medicineman]

TV - you just ruined my morning coffee...and my optic discs...and almost my laptop.

MM

 

[Crane Driver]

You know you've got 2 posts, and both take a shot at the puzzle palace workers. Obviously you have a bone to pick with the high numbers of staff people in Ottawa, so why not just start that topic, instead of throwing up a random post about Kilted RegF Infantry units to cover shots at NDHQ.

I found this forum by accident while looking for other information.

I am completely new to these types of forums / blogs? etc.. So, bear with my learning curve.  I seemed to remember a ‘study’ that was done a short while before I retired that suggested that there was a need to have significantly more ‘feet on the ground’.  After I posted my comment I did a little looking and found a paper from 1994.

1994 White Paper;
p. 75. The Government agrees with the Special Joint Committee that the land force must be expanded. Approximately 3,000 soldiers will be added to the army's field force. Additional resources will be provided through reductions in headquarters, restructuring of the three environments and a reduction in the size of the Reserves.

I have absolutely nothing against head office personnel. I finished my career as one. 

I am wondering if the 3000 soldiers were added to the field force?

 

[Jarnhamar]

Brother, you're suggesting the regular force form a regiment wearing something that's hugely identified as a reservist piece of kit?

They'd mutney

 

[wildman0101]

dpaterson,,
exactly what ethnic group was Canada pandering to in regard's to joining the war
effort be it boer/ww1/ww2/korea.... Hmmmm. Scots/Welsh/Irish???????
If I remember my history(canadian) all of those ethnic group's were a part of the
Common wealth. They were not pandered/asked/conscripted. they didn't have to
be pandered to they were allready serving.
As for forming a Regiment (kilted) we dont have to. All we have to to is reactivate
a Regiment deactivated like oh say the Seaforth Highlander's(canada) or the
Queen's Own Cameron Highlander's(Winnepeg) or or or .
redeye thanks.
blackadder1912 right on lad.
shamrock concur.
Have you ever wondered why the viking's gave up raiding said (kilted) land like
Scotland and other (kilted) country's. We kicked thier collective ass.
In other word's we were more buserker than said viking's(hint)(hint) paterson.
scoty b

 

[SeanNewman]

Good points about them being commonwealth in the past.

We could make ethnic regiments in the past that catered to a certain group because those people were joining the Infantry in droves anyway so it made sense.

For those of you in the Reserves in a large city who think that is a representation of what Reg Force units are like and we're a massively diverse Infantry, I've got some news for you.

Despite equal and accommodating hiring practices, a Reg Force infantry unit is still made up of predominantly white males.  Yes you will still see a few women, black, and other non-whites, but the truth is what it is and without knowing the exact numbers I would not hesitate to bet it was over 90% white males.

What does this mean?  It means that the Infantry brand is something that white males buy into.  And if we start watering that down (the brand, I don't mean the race), it means we will lose our target market.

If we start messing around with units in order to make them more diverse, it would be like Chevrolet starting to market the Corvette toward old women instead of middle aged businessmen.  Do you know what would happen?  Yes, they might sell 100 more cars to old women, but they would lose 10,000 sales because their target market would see the commercials and think "wow, that's really not for me".

 

[Haggis]

[off topic]
:warstory: Oh,"Down Home" isn't too difficult to learn, back in the day in London, the whole battalion spoke it fluently.  Even those that weren't from Down Home.  So fluently in fact, I seem to remember one spectacular dressing-down because the subject had answered, "Yes b'y" to a CSM.  I think the lad was from Ottawa.  Even the servers at Timmies on Oxford St. learned it, and spoke it.

I also remember a certain eight-fingered Sgt. in the INT Sect., re-badged in from The PPCLI, who grew to "appreciate" the phrase, "LOR' TUNNERIN'.. (fill in the blank)!!!"
[/off topic]

Laird Tunderin bye, yer right!  When I came home to Eastern Ontario on leave from "the First of the Finest", the only person who could understand me was my Irish Catholic mother.  All my friends though I was drunk!

 

[Old Sweat]

Laird Tunderin bye, yer right!  When I came home to Eastern Ontario on leave from "the First of the Finest", the only person who could understand me was my Irish Catholic mother.  All my friends though I was drunk!

Something similar. When I went to the RCA Depot for recruit training, I was put in a room with three Cape Bretoners. I still lapse into Cape speak on occasion. Back home on leave in the Niagara Peninsula, the only person who could catch everything I said was a girl in high school whose father had been a dental officer and her previous place of residence was Lincoln, NB.

 

[a_majoor]

We are actually moving the other way in the Reserve world; the three service battalions in 31 CBG have become a singular 31 SVC BN.

It isn't too hard to imagine the two tiny reserve armoured "regiments" becoming 31 Armoured Regt, two tiny artillery "regiments" melding into 31 Field RCA and the six company sized infantry regiments scattered about SW Ontario becoming 31 Light Infantry Bn (Motor Infantry Bn if you are ambitious).

Given the actual numbers of troops being fielded, this would rationalize the numbers of headquarters and devote more resources to the armoury floor (in the ideal world anyway).

I am pretty sure this idea was seriously considered in the 1990's, and before we hear the "we will loose our traditions/people will quit" arguments, think about the turnover in the average Reserve unit. In five years, something like 80% of all the people who were in at the time of the change will be gone, and the majority of soldiers will think "A Coy, 31 Light Infantry Bn (Essex and Kent) is the normal and natural state of affairs.

 

[Infanteer]

YES!

 

[OldSolduer]

What about the 38 Mess Tin Repair Company? >