How would you rate the canadian armed forces???

[Ex-Dragoon]

Michael Dorosh: you brought up the starvation diet of the US troops at Bataan but have you forgotten our guys at Hong Kong and the **** they went through? I think you have...

 

[Danjanou]

I don‘t think he forgot it at all. Not to in anyway take anything away from those at Hong Kong, but the two battles cannot be really compared. The battle for Hong Kong lasted from Dec 7-25, 19 days. The seige at Baatan went on for months. Both were in their own right heroic endeavours.

The American and Fillipino soldiers endured months of starvation in addition to artillery and aerial bombardment, and assaults before finally submitting.

The heroic if brief resistance put up by the two Canadian units is best seen in the context that they were recently arrived, for the most part untrained, under equipped, and really had no business being there in the first place aside from political expediency by the Brits who needed two extra battalions to beef up the garrsion.

Michael you raise an excellent point with fine examples. All societies, countries, cultures are capable of and have produced excellent fighting soldiers. Sometimes that same society/country has seen fit to provide them with the material and moral support they need to do their job, sometimes (perhaps many times) not.

Sometimes they‘re victorious, sometimes they lose even if they had all the material and other support going for them. That is the sad reality of war.

 

[Ex-Dragoon]

I am thinking what the guys went through afterwards as well.

 

[Spartan]

there are more examples of troops (incl Canadians) that were put through alot more misery and treachery (whether it be food, clothing, working equipment, lack of equipment etc ) do to their governments actions, or rather inactions...

my $.02 is that anyone who has fought for their country. .*and whichever idealogy the government wants to spew off* is one who deserves honour in that country.... and honour and respect overall....
whether it be through propaganda, misinfo whatev... i‘m sure that they worked their asses off *yes there are always those examples of slackers * in order to do what needed to be done in order to accomplish their objectives and goals...

all in all... when it comes down to it ....a soldier is the same all around the globe....their training and ideas may differ but the person behind that doesn‘t

 

[Danjanou]

Ex Dragoon, I know, and that‘s what I meant by not taking anything away from them.

Ed‘s right. A soldier is a soldier irregardless of the uniform he/she wears or has worn. Those of us who chose (and it was a choice even in those countries with conscription there is an option to decline to serve albeit often unpleasant)are part of a unique group.

Sometimes our political masters may have made us fight one another, but that‘s what we signed on the dotted line for.

Over the last couple of years I‘ve shared a beer or two with former soldiers from Cuba, Colombia, Morocco, Belize, Guatemala, The Dominican Republic, The US, The UK, Russia, Panama and a lot of other places.

It was something we had in common, sometimes moreso than with our own families and friend and neighbours.

 

[Michael Dorosh]

Ex-Dragoon, aside from agreeing with Danjanou (and thanks for your views, also, Danjanou), the main point is that it is idiotic to start comparing and contrasting.

And as for the US troops at Bataan "afterwards", perhaps a google search on "Death March" will reveal that they suffered as much in Japanese hands, and quite possibly much more. I haven‘t read of Canadians forced to bury each other alive at bayonet point, but those stories certainly have filtered out of the Bataan Death March.

The point again being that the troops in both locales were poorly treated in captivity, so why say one set suffered more or less?

As for starvation during combat, Canadians have never experienced the conditions the US Army did at Bataan during the fighting. Again, does that make Canadian troops somehow less brave or worthy of remembering?

 

[Ex-Dragoon]

Sorry Mike but I took your views to be the ones that are now commonly held by most of the Canadian population that the Yanks did more and we were just there. I so often hear about how well the US did in WW2 and granted they did but when you tell people the sacrifices Canadian personnel made you get the blank look.

 

[northamericanrebel]

What is the deal, the majority of canadians just dont want to join the military? i mean 37,000,000 or so people in canada i would imagine u would want to be at LEAST 100,000 strong considering you are the 2nd largest country in the world....most canadians i talk to are liberal,leftist anti-war, and dont give a hoot about the canadian military and just say they know the states will be there to save their *** . i know you give what you can...but 60,000 is just plain unacceptable. i dont know what the fisical situation is but i know defense is priority #500000000 and the folks in parlament hill dont give a ****
:sniper:

 

[Danjanou]

Ex Dragoon, it‘s a sad but true fact that while we do have a rich military history and tradition in this country, the majority of Canadians are ignorant of it.

Look at the present thread here regarding the sale of poppies or past threads on the subject of military history including the teaching of it to our youth, or rather the lacl of teaching.

The average Canadian may be vaguely aware of Peace keeping, WWI and WWII but that‘s it. Try quizzing them on the French and Indian Wars, Our participation in the American Revolution ( or any Yank conflict for that matter), The War of 1812, the Riel Rebellion and the March West. The Nile Expedition etc etc. well you get the point.

The comparison thing is a bit unrealistic, mind it is something we all do. Anytime I worked with foreign military (Brits, Yanks, Germans etc) we were always eying their kit and comparing it and tactics etc.

Oh yeah Mike, you‘re welcome.

 

[Michael Dorosh]

I‘m just glad we still have a Rememberance Day.

well, if you work for some ****ing corporation who gives you the option of an extra day off at Christmas if you work on Nov 11, I guess that doesn‘t count.

Or if you work at a mall who opens the stores on 11 Nov so they can get their almighty dollar...

 

[Gunnar]

I get the day off. I make **** certain I am up and on the road in time to make the Remembrance Day ceremonies *somewhere*....and I remind my co-workers occasionally that their "day off" is so that they can make a point of remembering our dead, not to sleep in late and catch up on Oprah.

There‘s only so much you can do without being a nag...

I don‘t mind the stores being open so much...as long as they stop at 11 for two minutes. That really isn‘t all that much to ask...that everything everywhere stop for two lousy minutes?

 

[Danjanou]

I get the day off and I‘m sure many of my oh so progressive p/c coworkers will enjoy thee day sleeping in and watching the soaps in their underwear,or whatever. Some are bitching that they can‘t have Monday off instead.

My blazer is pressed, shoes and medals shined, etc. and I‘ll be at the Cenotaph to pay my respects. Afterwords I may hoist one or two in respect.

 

[AZA-02]

Jean chretien must go. He is a shame for the CF.But that doesn‘t mean the CF should be treated lightly or as a weak military power, because our guys are brave, loyal, smart, and proud.

rating: 10/10

Hopefully Paul will make things better for the CF.
:mg: JEAN CHRETIEN

 

[nULL]

don‘t be such an immature d*ick.

if you think you can do a better job, go for it.

 

[Jarnhamar]

Relax the guy is just sharing his opinion. Something i think you as well have done often in the past, no?

I know i wouldn‘t do a better job then Chretien but i‘m still smart enough to see the mistakes he‘s making and how he needs to be replaced.

 

[nULL]

everyone has a right to an opinion, but someone in your line of work is particularly vulnerable to being targeted by the media. comments "suggesting" military personnel kill chretien aren‘t going to be well received by the public, i think.

 

[jrhume]

Most Vietnam veterans have a great deal of regard for their former foes. Every American I‘ve talked to or read about who made a return to Vietnam in the last ten years or so has told of meeting ex-NVA or local force veterans and sharing a beer and sometimes tears with them.

Veterans understand one another, regardless of country.

I‘ll be at the local Veteran‘s Memorial on the 11th. We have new dead to salute.

Jim

 

[northamericanrebel]

i agree al-x blast him what all ya got
:mg: :sniper: :cam: :rocket: :akimbo: JEAN CHRETIEN

 

[patrick666]

No one compares to the Canadian Army!

Mostly because I don‘t think another nation‘s military would wear GREEN camo in the desert.

All kidding aside, very proud of the military and it‘s history.

 

[Jarnhamar]

Ah, i missed where it was mentioned about actually killing someone Null. Saying something like that is simply stupuid.

That whole green in the desert thing is pretty funny especially after the hassel they went through to get desert uniforms.