Kandahar base hit by rocket again

[GAP]

Canadian base in Afghanistan hit by rocket as Taliban threatens more violence
Terry Pedwell, Canadian Press    Wednesday, July 19, 2006
http://www.canada.com/topics/news/national/story.html?id=a9d89010-a1c1-4f79-92a9-200442fbc1aa&k=77710

KANDAHAR, Afghanistan (CP) - The Kandahar Air Field, where Canadian soldiers are based, came under rocket attack again Wednesday as the Taliban threatened escalated attacks against foreign forces in Afghanistan.

It was the second attack in less than four days and the sixth attack since the end of June, when two Canadians were injured.

A coalition soldier was injured in Wednesday's attack when a single rocket slammed into the base.
more on link

 

[Jarnhamar]

Too bad we couldn't use patriot missles or those anti missle mini-guns on ships.

 

[Korus]

Ah... A Phalanx CIWS would have been neat. I would have propped up a chair at night, gotten some popcorn, and watched the fireworks as rockets exploded harmlessly in the air....

 

[Jantor]

It would seem some other people share your opinion.

http://www.azstarnet.com/dailystar/allheadlines/75851.php

The U.S. Army is looking at a Raytheon-made ship-defense system to shoot down mortar rounds that are fired at U.S. troops in Iraq.
The Army is studying Raytheon's Phalanx B1 Close-In Weapon System - a radar-guided, ship-mounted version of a multibarreled Gatling gun - among several technologies to counter mortar and small-rocket threats, the company and the Army said.

 

[buzgo]

It seems that they have installed them:

http://www.strategypage.com/dls/articles/20056301044.asp

Naval Gunfire Heard Over Baghdad
by James Dunnigan
June 30, 2005
Discussion Board on this DLS topic

Two Phalanx anti missile system have been sent to Iraq, modified to destroy rockets and mortar shells fired into the Green Zone (the large area in Baghdad turned into an American base). The Phalanx is a 20mm cannon designed to defend American warships, by destroying anti-ship missiles. Phalanx does this by using a radar that immediately starts firing at any incoming missile it detects. The modified versions sent to Iraq, called the C-RAM (Counter-Rocket Artillery Mortar) system has had it’s software modified to detect smaller objects (like 82mm mortar shells). The original Phalanx, it was found, could take out incoming 155mm artillery shells. This capability is what led to C-RAM. The other modifications include linking Phalanx to the Lightweight Counter Mortar Radar and Q-36 Target Acquisition Radar. When these radars detect incoming fire, C-RAM points toward the incoming objects and prepares to fire at anything that comes within range of its cannon. C-RAM also uses high explosive 20mm shells, that detonate near the target, spraying it with fragments. By the time these fragments reach the ground, they are generally too small to injure anyone. The Vulcan used 20mm depleted uranium shells, to slice through incoming missiles. The C-RAM, like the Vulcan, fires shells at the rate of 75 per second. Another advantage of C-RAM, is that it makes a distinctive noise when firing, warning people in the Green Zone that a mortar or rocket attack is underway, giving people an opportunity to duck inside if they are out and about. Without C-RAM to stop the incoming shells, they usually land without hitting people. The Green Zone is a big place, but something usually gets damaged during each attack, and sometimes the shells are duds, meaning they remain dangerous until found and removed. It took about a year, from the time an army general demanded that some kind of anti-mortar weapon be found, until the first C-RAMs arrived in Iraq.

 

[armyvern]

Now...if only they'd instal some at Khandahar....

 

[GAP]

So far, the numbers don't warrant it.

 

[Trinity]

So far, the numbers don't warrant it.

ah yes.. numbers...

Cause we're not human lives... we're just walking equipment.  *sigh

 

[Old Guy]

The article gives the impression that the system uses DU ammunition.  I can't think of any reason why it would.  As far as I know, DU is used primarily against armor.  Opinions?  Different takes on the use of DU?

Also, if the system works, look for it to be deployed quickly -- but 'quickly' does not mean in zero time.  Fielding such a system in reasonable numbers will take awhile.

Jim

 

[George Wallace]

The old Vulcan system used DU to 'slice' through rockets.  The new system does not.  It uses HE rounds.

C-RAM also uses high explosive 20mm shells, that detonate near the target, spraying it with fragments. By the time these fragments reach the ground, they are generally too small to injure anyone. The Vulcan used 20mm depleted uranium shells, to slice through incoming missiles.

 

[GAP]

ah yes.. numbers...

Cause we're not human lives... we're just walking equipment.   *sigh

We all lift our heads when we hear the screech of tires and either a crash or thump when a car accident occurs. This is preventable by installing safety devices on cars that allow them to withstand the impacts, or avoid collision, if we spend enough money. Do we? No, the numbers don't warrant it.

One or two or more incoming rounds, while touted in the press as though Genghis Khan is overrunning us, is simply a combat base reality. Could we do large, noisy, expensive things? probably. At the expense of doing things that NEED to be done.

 

[Jarnhamar]

Hey Old Guy! Good to see you.

This is preventable by installing safety devices on cars that allow them to withstand the impacts, or avoid collision, if we spend enough money. Do we? No, the numbers don't warrant it.

Have to respectfully disagree Gap.  Automobiles, car accidents safety and numbers (price vs cost) is one thing.  Rockets launched at us by an enemy in a war is something all together different.

The "price" of these rocket attacks are high.
Each landed rocket is a huge victory for the enemy, as is each injury.
Each injury and landed rocket becomes a huge issue in the media whether it is or isn't.
Being protected from rocket attacks probably plays a huge role in the morale of the soldiers being rocketed.

Rocket attacks may not cause too too much materail damage (though I'm sure injured soldiers will disagree) but VISUALLY they cause a lot of shit.

Canadians have a lot of support for their soldiers. (Like Americans of course)  I'm guessing when a Canadian citizen see's the government doing what they can to protect their soldiers it raises THEIR morale and support for the war (and government).  I've spoke with a lot of people who almost live vicariously through soldiers over there. And attack on "us" is an attack on "them".

 

[GAP]

Have to respectfully disagree Gap.  Automobiles, car accidents safety and numbers (price vs cost) is one thing.  Rockets launched at us by an enemy in a war is something all together different.

The "price" of these rocket attacks are high.
Each landed rocket is a huge victory for the enemy, as is each injury.
Each injury and landed rocket becomes a huge issue in the media whether it is or isn't.
Being protected from rocket attacks probably plays a huge role in the morale of the soldiers being rocketed.

Rocket attacks may not cause too too much materail damage (though I'm sure injured soldiers will disagree) but VISUALLY they cause a lot of shit.

Canadians have a lot of support for their soldiers. (Like Americans of course)  I'm guessing when a Canadian citizen see's the government doing what they can to protect their soldiers it raises THEIR morale and support for the war (and government).  I've spoke with a lot of people who almost live vicariously through soldiers over there. And attack on "us" is an attack on "them".

I agree with all your reasoning, but as one who had daily rocket/mortar attacks on a daily basis for 2+ years, in Da Nang, Quang Tri, Cua Viet, Khe San (during 68 Tet), each incident in itself matters to the soldier, but never hurt the moral of the soldiers.
From a press point of view, well that's different. The press at the time was not there, choosing to write most of their stories out of Saigon, whereas they are sitting around in Kandahar dying for something to write about.

The US is just getting around to it now in Iraq, and they have 100,000+ troops, multiple bases, etc. and what are they talking about protecting? Not those multiple bases, but the Green Zone. It's a PR gambit, a valid one probably, but still a PR gambit.

 

[GINge!]

I wouldn't be surprised if the 'old' GDF-005 2x35mm guns were pulled out of storage for this exact task. Equipped with AHEAD rounds, they could engage and likely destroy rockets on a ballistic trajectory.

 

[Old Guy]

There are any number of existing weapons that might work to destroy incoming rockets.  The key ingredient is the detection and control system, not the weapon (within reason).  I look for a lot more emphasis on such defensive tools in the next couple years.  Contrary to media blathering, hitting a bullet with a bullet is do-able, given the right combination of technology -- and in the case of mortars, rockets, etc -- not particularly costly technology.

I can think of a further development of a rocket defense system -- virtually instantaneous trackback to the launch point.  I'll be someone, somewhere is already working on it.

GAP has the right idea.  Mortar and rocket attacks are to be expected at a combat base.  We soaked up our share in the Delta -- Vinh Long and Dong Tam.  However, defensive weaponry may very well minimize the effectiveness of such attacks in the foreseeable future.

jim