Karla Homolka and Paul Bernardo movie

[Bruce Monkhouse]

Quote from Silverbach,
Well, the last post on this topic was on november 2004, when the movie was in production. Now, in january 2005, a lot happened with regards to Karla: she got out, she's conditions-free, and she can now fly like a bird...
I was wondering what are your positions on this movie, Karla or both... on january 20th, 2005, the day of the opening of this movie.


Psst, its now Jan. 2006........and I nearly got ill just watching the trailer on TV......a severe pox on anyone who goes to see this .....thing.

 

[Jed]

I object to the fact that people have to witness the movie trailer alone, let alone go see the entire movie. Its almost like seeing the baddies behead some hostage in Iraq.

 

[silverbach]

that reminds me...has anyone of you ever saw that 70's television-made movie on the life of Charles Manson ?

 

[Bruce Monkhouse]

No, I don't care about watching "good" celeberties....I sure would not waste my time watching movies about dirtchute celeberties....

 

[silverbach]

well, that goes without saying...clearly not a Mary Hart fan, otherwise, my guess is that you would know how to write CELEBRITIES !

 

[Bruce Monkhouse]

..but I do know what YEAR it is.

 

[silverbach]

2005 was such a good year, just can't let it go, I guess 

 

[3rd Herd]

Movie opens tonight in Vancouver in one theatre. Other theaters in greater Vancouver area cannot show it as not all of there staff are over the age of 19.
Source: Check News 07:00 this am

 

[silverbach]

that reminds me...has anyone of you ever saw that 70's television-made movie on the life of Charles Manson ?

Wonder if that Charles Mason's movie raised that much reaction when it came out...because let's face it, Homolka's action was next to nothing compared to what Mason did. May be some 50 years old's in here remember about reactions to this Mason's movie...

 

[dutchie]

Wonder if that Charles Mason's movie raised that much reaction when it came out...because let's face it, Homolka's action was next to nothing compared to what Mason did. May be some 50 years old's in here remember about reactions to this Mason's movie...

But were not just dealing with facts, which are bad enough, but emotion and shock. Manson's killings are old news, and the shock and emotional impact has worn off to a great extent. The outrage that comes with these brutal crimes tends to fade over time.

On top of that, the Bernardo/Homolka slayings have the added nuance of the deceit surrounding the tapes/plea bargain, and the killing of Karla's sister. They are very different crimes seperated by many many years.

As well, Manson is viewed as a looney, whereas Karla is viewed as a sociopath who cheated the system. There is a lot of anger and resentment among the public, and a strong desire, IMHO, to atone for the deceit and the slack sentence.

 

[3rd Herd]

I will take you up on that, not that you have to be fifty, just older than 29 and holding.
I believe Helter Sketer was the name of the movie and given that special effects had not progressed to the extent of today it was more in the lines of a docu drama. Much of the movie focused on the investigation of the crimes and the following court cases from the prospective of the prosecuter. If you want an idea on the effect of the Manson cult I would suggest renting a copy of Roman Polanski's (SP?) version of Hamlet. Sharon Tate was his wife and it was his first movie after her murder.

 

[dutchie]

I will take you up on that, not that you have to be fifty, just older than 29 and holding.
I believe Helter Sketer was the name of the movie and given that special effects had not progressed to the extent of today it was more in the lines of a docu drama. Much of the movie focused on the investigation of the crimes and the following court cases from the prospective of the prosecuter. If you want an idea on the effect of the Manson cult I would suggest renting a copy of Roman Polanski's (SP?) version of Hamlet. Sharon Tate was his wife and it was his first movie after her murder.

I'm not saying Manson is forgotten, but he doesn't bring up this kind of emotion today. If a Manson movie came out now, I doubt it would evoke this kind of response.

I actually do remember a lot of the hate towards Manson. When I was a kid, Geraldo Rivera did an interview with Manson when he was still with 20/20 (IIRC). It was big news, with groups calling for it not to be aired, saying it only glorified and revictimized. Sounds similar to the furor over this piece of cinematic trash.

Speaking of trash, I think I heard recently that Polanski was going to turn himself in on the child molestation/sex with a minor charges in the US.

 

[silverbach]

As well, Manson is viewed as a looney, whereas Karla is viewed as a sociopath who cheated the system. There is a lot of anger and resentment among the public, and a strong desire, IMHO, to atone for the deceit and the slack sentence.

I'm no psychiatrist, but the difference between being a looney or a sociopath is clearly thin...some could actually argue that looney is kind of a slang term to define forms of sociopathology.

As far as the slack sentencing is concerned, well, we could debate this point forever, but at the end, it wouldn't change much. She did her time, and now, she is free as a bird. Of course, we can speculate on what she is, what she has done in these 12 years, etc...but frankly, I would consider this a waste of time and energy, simply because it won't change a thing. If shouting for the hell of it is the hip thing to do, then I prefer being recognized as a dull, self-centered man. There are so many things that should retain our attention: Kandahar, CF involvement, and so on.

Thank God not all murder cases in Canada are on the 6 O'clock news as Karla's case was...'cause a lot of people in this country wouldn't sleep !

 

[dutchie]

I'm no psychiatrist, but the difference between being a looney or a sociopath is clearly thin...some could actually argue that looney is kind of a slang term to define forms of sociopathology.

Well, for starters, you'll likely hear Psychologists, not Psychiatrists talk about the diff between loonies and sociopaths. Having said that, by 'looney', I refer to someone who has had a psychotic break, ie - they do not perceive the world with any sense of reality, they are clinicaly insane. Your typical raving lunatic.

A sociopath on the other hand, has not had a psychotic break, but lacks the internal controls over his own behavior (no conscience, some say). This is also called 'anti-social personality disorder' or 'psychopathic personality'.  Basically, the sociopath is what most would call a Psycho. He lacks the shackles of social norms (ie-don't kill, rape, steal, etc.) They are aware what they are doing is wrong, but simply don't care. They are different from (although very similar to) Psychopaths in that their disorder is related to how they view others and society.

Psychopaths are narcisistic in the extreme. They act out of pure self-centredness (is that a word?). They tend not to be as violent as sociopaths as breaking the law does not serve as an advantage to them in most cases. Psychopaths can be extremely manipulative, and are good at it. It is said that a lot of top CEOs are actually psychopaths.

Here endeth the lesson.

As far as the slack sentencing is concerned, well...

I was only pointing out what I think is the root of the outrage and hostility towards Karla. I fully understand that she whas served the sentence handed her.

edit:The term 'sociopath' is usually linked to the disorder (anti-social personality disorder), whereas 'psychopathy' is usually used to describe a symptom of that same disorder (or as a stand-alone condition).
For those that care.

 

[silverbach]

Would you mind giving us the web site where you copied all that data to paste it in here...would have saved you the trouble ;D

 

[dutchie]

Would you mind giving us the web site where you copied all that data to paste it in here...would have saved you the trouble ;D

I can't seem to paste 3 years of Psych....do you know how, smartass?

You paint yourself the 'intelligent CF wannabe'. Yet when someone posts a reply to your post that is neither contradictory nor argumentative, you come back with this tripe. I in fact DID have to look up what the current thoughts (readSM) def is on sociopath/anti-social pers disorder/psychopathy, as it is constantly in debate in the Psych community and evolving. Does that mean that I am full of shyte, or am I just being careful about what I post?

You posted that there was little difference between a 'loony' and a sociopath. In order to enlighten you, which is clearly offensive to such a lofty member of the  intelligentsia as yourself, I outlined the differences between the 2. I suggest next time that you are faced with a post that is clearly beyond your area of expertice and understanding, that you resist the urge to reply. If you care to refute my points, please feel free.

 

[silverbach]

Well, corporal, when a person copies the work of others and use it as his own, I believe this phenomena is known as PLAGIARIZING...so, may I suggest that when you do that, you follow your pasting work by giving the source of your information.

Furthermore, instead of using other's work as your own, here are two (2) suggestions:

1) ask these people to reply themselves to my post and stay out of it;
2) stick with your domain of expertise: shinning boots and doing what you're told by your chain of command...

...smartass !

 

[Michael OLeary]

Folks, since we can't seem to have a civil conversation, this topic is locked.

You may try to convince a Moderator you have something worth adding - given the topic I'd suggest credentials from a registered university in a related medical field MIGHT suffice to create a case for continuance.