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Living with an OSI.

OldSolduer

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This can be approved by the Surgeon General. He can approve up to 183 days, not including sick leave already granted.

This is a case of people not wanting to done job.

 

CountDC

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Jim Seggie said:
In my mind , having you come in every 14 days to get another 14 days does violates the intent and spirit of the above. IMO, and it is only an opinion, the HS pers are getting around the approval process by having the soldier report every 14 days. If you need 91 days SL, then the formation MO should be signing off on it, and your CoC SHOULD have a policy in place to contact you once a week or so to make sure you are OK and you and your family are safe.

Question - if the soldier was recovering from significant surgery which impaired his mobility - would HS have them come in every 14 days?

But it appears that the military doctor has determined that the needs in this case is for them to see the member every 14 days at a time not 91 days.  I believe that the long leave periods are aimed at physical issues that do not need regular visits with medical staff.  They can send you home to recover with the intent that the unit will maintain contact. Often people depend on what civilian doctors from outside say not taking into account that it is just another opinion that will be weighed in the final decision of our own medical staff.  Outside shrinks especially seem to be a difficult case to deal with.

The COC should be in contact with the member regardless of his medical visits but they are not medical staff and thus can not determine his medical needs.  Doesn't always happen though.

Impaired mobility is wide open.  I have seen people that have been required to report in for check ups using family members and wheel chairs.  It is something that will be determined on a case by case basis.  If needed then they will send someone to the member.

From my knowledge medical staff have taken a kick on this matter in the past so I can understand why they may feel the need for the visits.  Cases dealing with mental health issues are touchy and some events in the last 5(?) years have brought the issue forward.

For the OP:  Along with talking to the civilian shrink have you tried going higher in the chain at the hospital?  Have you asked about maybe contacting them by phone instead of going in?  Offer a midway - 1 monthly visit with a phone call in between. Could be worth a try - it worked for me, 1 monthly, phone call and emergency visits when I needed them.  Also maybe I missed it but have you been in contact with the psych at the military site or is it the GP you are reporting to? Could be a factor.  I believe there is a solid policy on mental health cases that dictate at least a monthly visit (at least that is what my worker told me at the time).

Good luck in getting a satisfactory outcome.
 

dogger1936

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CountDC said:
But it appears that the military doctor has determined that the needs in this case is for them to see the member every 14 days at a time not 91 days.  I believe that the long leave periods are aimed at physical issues that do not need regular visits with medical staff.  They can send you home to recover with the intent that the unit will maintain contact. Often people depend on what civilian doctors from outside say not taking into account that it is just another opinion that will be weighed in the final decision of our own medical staff.  Outside shrinks especially seem to be a difficult case to deal with.

The COC should be in contact with the member regardless of his medical visits but they are not medical staff and thus can not determine his medical needs.  Doesn't always happen though.

Impaired mobility is wide open.  I have seen people that have been required to report in for check ups using family members and wheel chairs.  It is something that will be determined on a case by case basis.  If needed then they will send someone to the member.

From my knowledge medical staff have taken a kick on this matter in the past so I can understand why they may feel the need for the visits.  Cases dealing with mental health issues are touchy and some events in the last 5(?) years have brought the issue forward.

For the OP:  Along with talking to the civilian shrink have you tried going higher in the chain at the hospital?  Have you asked about maybe contacting them by phone instead of going in?  Offer a midway - 1 monthly visit with a phone call in between. Could be worth a try - it worked for me, 1 monthly, phone call and emergency visits when I needed them.  Also maybe I missed it but have you been in contact with the psych at the military site or is it the GP you are reporting to? Could be a factor.  I believe there is a solid policy on mental health cases that dictate at least a monthly visit (at least that is what my worker told me at the time).

Good luck in getting a satisfactory outcome.

Thanks brother.

My situation is a little different than what I was dealing with at my last base. Currently I see two civilian Dr's hired by the military to provide care to soldiers. One works off base and the other (whom I refer to as the pill guy) who works on base.

The CDU Dr on base is great. Fantastic guy. However again he is civilian. The first month I went in he gave me 30 days off. This time he was apologetic and stated he could only award 14 now. (On a lighter note the rash that every Dr back at my old bases said was heat rash he quickly diagnosed as some fungal infection and for the first time in 9 years I no longer have a rash all over my torso!)

To me where I stand I believe my Maj got involved the last time a 30 day chit was issued. In fact my MAJ CALLED ME to inform me I wouldn't be getting 30 days off. I waited for the CDU to call me on this and they didn't so I took the 30 days on the chit.

Currently in treatment I see one Dr 2 hrs a week plus the other pill Dr every 2 weeks. aside from writing a new chit the CDU really isn't providing any type of care.

I'm  really trying to wade through all this stuff alas after two years of not even as much as a chit or TCAT; I was hoping with me prodding the CDU for some kind of limitations and a request to be removed from the environment would be a good start towards getting more help. Unfortunately I've landed myself into a zone where it seems no one cares; and now the clock is ticking towards my release.

If I had my time back I would have not bothered contacting the UMS.

 

CountDC

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hmmmm - now I smell something.  Seems the unit became involved in deciding your medical care which shouldn't happen (yes I know it does, been there myself and it wasn't pleasant, I lost the battle but it worked out good for me in the end.  Sometimes the meddling works out despite their evil intentions  ;)  ).    You're doc at the CDU is your primary care giver and should be determing your periods. If he can not approve longer than 14 days but believes it should be 30 days then he should go to the next level for approval.  I would check with him on that.  It may be though that the unit already got to his boss and that is why he is restricted to the 14 days now.

You were right to stick to the 30 days  - the Maj does not have the authority to revoke sick leave you are granted.  The CDU didn't contact you with an amendment so it was still valid.

heat rash - fungal infection, 9 years?  Wow.

Chin up and keep your powder dry.
 

dogger1936

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CountDC said:
hmmmm - now I smell something.  Seems the unit became involved in deciding your medical care which shouldn't happen (yes I know it does, been there myself and it wasn't pleasant, I lost the battle but it worked out good for me in the end.  Sometimes the meddling works out despite their evil intentions  ;)  ).    You're doc at the CDU is your primary care giver and should be determing your periods. If he can not approve longer than 14 days but believes it should be 30 days then he should go to the next level for approval.  I would check with him on that.  It may be though that the unit already got to his boss and that is why he is restricted to the 14 days now.

You were right to stick to the 30 days  - the Maj does not have the authority to revoke sick leave you are granted.  The CDU didn't contact you with an amendment so it was still valid.

heat rash - fungal infection, 9 years?  Wow.

Chin up and keep your powder dry.

Yep something reeks here indeed! I've been writing all this sorta stuff down since I started treatment. I'm happy to say back at my reg force unit I was treated awesome by CoC. Partly I guess because of my previous reputation. Outside of the unit I've only met roadblocks, issues, and a very very broken health system.

Currently my primary care provider is basically writing me 14 day chits for the next 6-7 months.

I have a very very bad taste in my mouth from the ISPC thus far as well. More on that after I talk to the ombudsmen; currently submitting to our PAFFO to make sure everything I'm writing is within my "lanes".

Needless to say I will still be my only advocate as per since my posting. These people don't understand or get it. The majority of my meeting with the ISPC has been about a 2 year release....which is quite the different story that I know of on other bases. The 14 days issue mentioned were defended as correct by this ISPC instead of providing assistance. Disclosure of my personal medical information was communicated to the person who did it as "may not seem like a big deal to us"; I'll deal with that one again through other means on my own.

Honestly folks this forum is the ONLY reason I'm getting any help what so ever. This CFS seems keen on doing the least amount of work possible; and getting me out of the army as quick as possible without knowing my requirements. Talking about me going to school....and I can't even read a magazine without getting confused. 

Asked the ISPC about the complex release that many of my injured brothers from our tour are currently on for PTSD. They told me it's only for people awaiting surgery and max I would get is 9 months to a year extra.....yet I know my guys getting signed on for a extra 3 years.

Care is not being provided as is the case on other CFB's. Worst thing I ever did was get posted here.
 

Staff Weenie

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Any talk of release is premature at this point! You haven't received a solid diagnosis yet or even a TCAT yet. You're only just beginning treatment.

From my own experience and questioning:  it took me almost a year to actually get a diagnosis on paper of moderate to severe PTSD with anxiety disorder and major depressive disorder brought about by the PTSD.  Then, it was a process of initiating the meds and getting stable and receptive to treatment, and starting in with the therapy. Months later I received my first TCAT for 6 months. More therapy followed. I've just started my second 6 month TCAT. After two TCATs, they will decide if they need to proceed to a PCAT. However, with OSI issues, where the member is in treatment, they can actually issue a third 6 month TCAT. So, that gives a member at least 18 months of treatment before they can even consider a 3B release. Don't let them push you faster than the timelines.

I'm not sure about the Sick Leave issue still. I still wonder if they are going with the 14 day periods so that they can actually see you and assess how the meds are working.

PM me about the possible wrongful disclosure of medical info - it's an issue I deal with on almost a weekly basis. Clinicians are bound by law on what info can be released without your personal consent. Most physicians I've dealt with in the CF H Svcs are very strict about this - it's their license on the line.

Most importantly - Hang on brother. You are going to get better! Believe in yourself, and believe in your future. Lean on us if you need to.  You've got my contact info, and I'm available to talk 24/7.

 

Wookilar

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:goodpost:

I'm on my 3rd TCat, waiting for the PCat to be approved by DMedPol (been waiting 11 months now while on 3rd TCat). While release has been mentioned, it is only in passing as "it may happen" and to "prepare" me if it comes to that.

They can't even begin release proceedings without a PCat that puts you in violation of your trade specs and that is literally years away (DMedPol takes about 9-12 months to respond usually and that is after 2 TCat's).

On the off chance that someone up there has no idea what they are doing  ::) don't sign ANYTHING unless you are very clear on what it is.

I would also have an open and frank discussion with your Med staff about your fears or confidential medical information reaching your CoC improperly. Get them to tell you to your face.

Wook
 

S.Stewart

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I know of a few malingers went and claimed PTSD after getting admin seperated from the CF. I know both inviduals well, they were pumps, never actually employed in their trade,, never were promoted, never deployed (one of them spent sometime in club ed) spent years on and off the lame and lazy lists until the CF finally got sick and rid of them. Because they are slack and idle individuals surprise surprise can't get or hold a real job, so the went to the VAC and ended up in the end with a sizable payout, their post secondary education retraining and the whole bit. Which I think is absolutely disgusting. However these two idiots I speak of are not the majority nor do they represent in any manner those who actually suffer. It just tells me that the VAC obviously needs to look into things vs boosting their numbers for their own gain as obviously payouts are better suited to those that actually need it.
 

the 48th regulator

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S.Stewart said:
It just tells me that the VAC obviously needs to look into things vs boosting their numbers for their own gain as obviously payouts are better suited to those that actually need it.

VAC had nothing to do with it.  Their (Your two members that you are talking about) clinicians made the recommendation to VAC, and that is what VAC goes by. 

dileas

tess
 

S.Stewart

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the 48th regulator said:
VAC had nothing to do with it.  Their (Your two members that you are talking about) clinicians made the recommendation to VAC, and that is what VAC goes by. 

dileas

tess

Seen. Makes sense, yeah I don't know how the process totally works...I just know what he claimed and what the payout was in one inviduals case, needless to say, his actions disgusting in my books, but again not the norm.
 

the 48th regulator

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S.Stewart said:
Seen. Makes sense, yeah I don't know how the process totally works...I just know what he claimed and what the payout was in one inviduals case, needless to say, his actions disgusting in my books, but again not the norm.

Roger that,

However, let us not perpetuate the myth that VAC hands out cheques to people because the claim PTSD or any other OSI, to hide that htey are shitpumps.  I can almost guess there is a whole heck a lot more to the history of these two people that either you are not adding or do not know.

Trust me, a professional Psychologist can separate the wheat from the chaff, when it comes to those trying to get a "PTSD" pay off from VAC.

dileas

tess
 

S.Stewart

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the 48th regulator said:
Roger that,

However, let us not perpetuate the myth that VAC hands out cheques to people because the claim PTSD or any other OSI, to hide that htey are shitpumps.  I can almost guess there is a whole heck a lot more to the history of these two people that either you are not adding or do not know.

Trust me, a professional Psychologist can separate the wheat from the chaff, when it comes to those trying to get a "PTSD" pay off from VAC.

dileas

tess

Oh I know the whole story, seen the paperwork (CF and VAC), and the payout, and I know it's not the norm. This person I was speaking from did this all after they were adminstratively discharged, needless to say we don't speak anymore because of this incident. Trust me this person I am speaking of is a snake and brags about his VAC payout because of his "ptsd" (I've known this person 15 years, and by chance I was in gagetown are when he got his walking papers). Again said indivdual is just a shitty human being, and if you want I can explain it all down to the detail via PM's but I am not about to lay out all the gritty details here, but I pretty much consider it to be flat out fraud from my stand point. He was coached and milked the system, again not the norm said invidual is a very very small drop in the bucket.
 

dogger1936

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A update from someone still living through this nightmare.

The 14 day sick leave for me right now is Kosher. I was lucky enough to see the uniformed Dr today. (civilian dr has been great but couldn't really answer stuff as a officer could) 14 day sick leave is to keep things in check, make sure I`m alive. There was many many questions answered this morning and I was glad to have finally some answers to these questions. I was blunt and requested the same and got a very open and frank discussion on my situation. It was a welcomed change to the lack of answers I`ve been getting. Any future questions regarding any of this quagmire of medical stuff I`ve never dealt with I now have a direct line; which is very relieving. Thank you.

On the other side of the coin the ISPC. There is no reason I should have been asking these questions after posing them to my CoC to help find answers. Their answers to me made me look like a bumbling fool really. Their answers just didn't sit kosher with me; and I was right to feel the way I did. I ran into b/s answers to questions I needed answered. Something I never would have done to my troops when I had a role and responsibility. And I am very disappointed with the ISPC.

Words I really don't like hearing from a ISPC is "they shouldn't have posted you here...we don't have the same resources as the bigger bases. Call me a "go getter" but if you don't have it....get it. if I was running low on ammo I would get my admin guys in to resup. If I was getting hit from a spot I couldn't shoot I'd call in arty to kill it. Same thing in my eyes. Get the resources you need.

I want to thank the people who have come forward and offered help. I am truly blessed to be able to contact people via this site for sounding boards and even action when needed. I've also come into contact with an ombudsmen group studying OSI treatment. I am going in facts checked and guns blazing and giving credit to where credit is due. I know it will never help my current situation but I hope and pray it will help someone else someday. I hope someday I can be a ear to listen to others and help with every piece of my heart to those who are injured. however right now this ombudsmen thingy is about all I have the energy and ability to do.



edit to add: if some of this doesnt make sense I apologize. I'm into day 2 of no sleep and wanted to get this written down before I forget to offer my thanks for those who help.

 

OldSolduer

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dogger1936 said:
On the other side of the coin the ISPC. There is no reason I should have been asking these questions after posing them to my CoC to help find answers. Their answers to me made me look like a bumbling fool really. Their answers just didn't sit kosher with me; and I was right to feel the way I did. I ran into b/s answers to questions I needed answered. Something I never would have done to my troops when I had a role and responsibility. And I am very disappointed with the ISPC.

Words I really don't like hearing from a ISPC is "they shouldn't have posted you here...we don't have the same resources as the bigger bases.

edit to add: if some of this doesnt make sense I apologize. I'm into day 2 of no sleep and wanted to get this written down before I forget to offer my thanks for those who help.

They actually told you this? Take it higher....they need an @$$ kicking.
 

dogger1936

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Jim Seggie said:
They actually told you this? Take it higher....they need an @$$ kicking.

Word for word. Minor stuff Jim. I've had a CIC Maj look over at the "witness" during the poorest excuse for an investigation and said " We have to make sure we talk to career managers and ensure we don't get any more people like this posted here" or words to that effect.

Situation no change. I'm writing this all down and will attack once I get released.
 

OldSolduer

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dogger1936 said:
Word for word. Minor stuff Jim. I've had a CIC Maj look over at the "witness" during the poorest excuse for an investigation and said " We have to make sure we talk to career managers and ensure we don't get any more people like this posted here" or words to that effect.

Situation no change. I'm writing this all down and will attack once I get released.

Hmmmm.....OK.
 

wildman0101

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Ethier you have it or you dont. The professional's both Civvy and Military will know. this OSI-PTSD has
been around since J/C was a lance jack, Just my 2C's. A fellow Jack is trying to start a Group/Clinic here
in BC. Got a meet and greet with him 20th this month. Been out here in BC 25 Yrs no such support. And
this Group/Clinic will be open to all Vet's past,,present and future. So if anyone in Vernon BC or surroud-
ing area's  call me. 250-542-0266. Or private this mean's or my E-mail leigh111655@yahoo.com
Cheer's Scoty B  :salute:  :cdn:  :yellow:
 

dogger1936

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I figured I'd drop back for a update and pose a few questions to try and ease my mind. Having anxiety issues with this whole finally moving towards a medical release.

I have met a few times now with the MO who seems to honestly want to help. I have been placed on my first TCAT and may move directly to PCAT as the medical system failed to do so when I was first diagnosed 2 years ago. This has me now looking towards the almighty dollar and how I am going to support my family.

I recently got my final assessment and was told I was 65% disabled. This of course does not come close to receive exceptional impairment allowance or Permanent impairment allowance. I was very angry most of the day that I can be 65% messed up according to them; but need to be 98% to get these benefits. While if I had messed my leg up a little more or the shrapnel damage had been a little more I could have added them up to 98%. Alas I am very far from getting to that magical percentage.

I was also wondering about the rehabilitation 2 year 75% thing. I really cannot see me able to go to school and sit in a classroom with people etc. I really cannot see it happening. What happens if I don't take the rehabilitation. I am very certain I will not be able to do it.

Looking forward I bought another house for very very cheap and will be working on fixing it up now to remove a bill from my life. I currently only owe a mortgage to the house I currently live in which will hopefully be sold long before I release. I believe I have always been smart with my money and once this place is sold i am walking away with my very tiny home in the middle of no where and zero bills aside from utilities and food gas etc to support my family.

I began crunching the numbers tonight and if I get released in my 13 year (which is how it looks) as a sgt 4 I will clear about 1000 a month pension. Do I get earning loss benifits if I can't go to school and partake in the "rehabilitation" program?

I am a little worried how I am going to afford food,clothing, vehicle etc for my family upon medical release. Infact it's really darn scary once I start crunching the numbers.
 
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