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lost military id card

  The Halifax dockyard, home to over half of the ships in the navy and quite a bit of supporting infrastructure, requires a different level of security from a small-town armoury which contains nothing of strategic value and is home to a unit all of whose members know one another.

Well, to be fair, I have been to ValCartier a lot.  I can't count the number of times the guy at the gate waived me by because I was in uniform.    Valcartier is home to the 3 R22R and the 12 RBC. 

All some terrorist &^$%# has to do is get his hands on a fake CADPAT uniform and beret and drive his way into the base, then it's open season on whatever target he choses is worthy.

The same for Meaford when I was there.  Driving in and out of the base in uniform was a breeze. 

The "no ID check" can not be blamed only on milita units....
 
I work in the US and you can't buy a jug of milk at the PX without an ID Card, let alone access the Base. 

Thats true.  Everytime we left/entered the base at Camp Blanding, our CDN Military ID was required.  They also had an actual soldier with a rifle at the gate.  Not some old guy with a flashlight....*cough* Valcartier *cough*
 
On a SUE in the UK in 2001 ( I think) in Folkestone, we routinely had certain Engineers, having had a few too many, brought home on the pointy end of an SA80, with a grinning Gurkha on the other end.  We'd vouch for him, the Gurkha would smile, and disappear back to his guardhouse.  I worked with some of their medics later in the trip, and apparently their boys thought the drunk Canadians were the high light of otherwise very boring stags at the garrison gate.

We take security far to leniently around DND facilities.

The OP's "Friend" should suck it up and report it ASAP, and I really would like to see a charge or two come out of it, pour encourager les autres.

All it took to get into NDHQ last time I was there was an I Card and a leave pass.  I needed the stamp for my LTA.  Maybe I'll drop by next week, see what it takes to get in these days. 

Now who do I know at the puzzle palace....

DF
 
Lost_Warrior said:
Well, to be fair, I have been to ValCartier a lot.   I can't count the number of times the guy at the gate waived me by because I was in uniform.     Valcartier is home to the 3 R22R and the 12 RBC.   

All some terrorist &^$%# has to do is get his hands on a fake CADPAT uniform and beret and drive his way into the base, then it's open season on whatever target he choses is worthy.

The same for Meaford when I was there.    Driving in and out of the base in uniform was a breeze.  

The "no ID check" can not be blamed only on milita units....

Edmonton has a 100% ID check during silent hours only, (it's a money issue) that's just a wave by from some poor old commissionaire you could have Mickey Mouses' picture on your ID card and get through. Until silent hours time gates are unmanned. In times during heightened security a 100% check is done, however that means stopping 5000 or so troops on their way to morning PT every day and I don't need to tell you what complaints come out of that, the traffic etc. The fact of the matter is (as someone stated previously) the I card is not a pass.  If you want to ensure that everyone getting on the base is allowed there, you would have a member from each unit at the gate with a nominal role who could personally vouch for each member entering the facility. I personally think that in addition to the I card, DND should invest in some sort of pass scanning technology for base access with vehicle and personal/unit information on it.
 
base toronto had no full time guards on it
only after 6 pm i think.
one gate would be locked up and the other gate would a gaurd in it. there were gates off the pmqs were open till midnight i think.
off duty  hours  most times you waved at the guy and he turned the light from red to green.
it should be improved but why bother it works for now
is the old saying
 
it should be improved but why bother it works for now
is the old saying

But that's just it.  It DOESN'T work.  You can say some 60 year commissionaire sitting behind a gate letting any tom, d1ck and Harry in "works"...  ::)
 
Lost_Warrior said:
Thats true.   Everytime we left/entered the base at Camp Blanding, our CDN Military ID was required.   They also had an actual soldier with a rifle at the gate.   Not some old guy with a flashlight....*cough* Valcartier *cough*

Same deal @ Fort Knox... they take things seriously there.

As we should be doing.
 
Same deal @ Fort Knox... they take things seriously there.

As we should be doing.

I was in NYC a couple of weeks ago.  It was late and I wanted to get a quick bite to eat with my girlfriend, so we went into Taco Bell, and what did I see?  A security guard standing there with a BP vext and a pistol straped to his side.    It had me wondering... This guy was better armed than the people who stand guard at our countries military bases....
 
Lost_Warrior said:
I was in NYC a couple of weeks ago.   It was late and I wanted to get a quick bite to eat with my girlfriend, so we went into Taco Bell, and what did I see?   A security guard standing there with a BP vext and a pistol straped to his side.      It had me wondering... This guy was better armed than the people who stand guard at our countries military bases....

Man you don't want to know what the security guards at fast food joints in Latin America carry, same as the banks down there and it's enough to make Kev B weep with envy.

Amazing the different standards. When I went to West Germany the gates at CBE Baden Soellingen had real guards with real weapons who stopped and scrutinized everyone including young troopies staggering back from a night on the town in Hugelshiem or Baden Baden with too much good German beer imbibed. Bit of a culture shock after being used to the Commissionaire wave through.
   
 
That is if you even get a commissionaire waive through! I have yet to lay eyes on a commissionaire here in Gagetown. I have been stopped by the MPs on a random day of 100% ID checks....I always have my Military Family ID with me...which has hubby's svc # and signature on it. But mostly everyone here knows that the only big security checks here is during the Base Auxillary Security Force ex in September of every year... I have actually heard members complain that they had to go home to get thier id when they were just going to play squash...

As far as I am concerned, there should be 100% security checks at all times. And members and families should not get complaicent and not carry the proper identification.

Just my 2 cents.
 
Man you don't want to know what the security guards at fast food joints in Latin America carry

Thats what happens when you have cartels and criminals armed better than some NATO countries...
 
i know it does not, you know it does not work but till the system realizes it does not work, it works for them

toronto had a public bus that  ran thru the base, ring bell and get off at any  stop every day monday  to friday
it was number shepard west 84 a or 84 b,  ran every  30 minutes I thinkj

canadians do not know what  secuirty is , because they have never needed. so they  get by  with the bare minimum
 
CdnArtyWife said:
As far as I am concerned, there should be 100% security checks at all times. And members and families should not get complaicent and not carry the proper identification.

Everyone should carry proper identification any time they're on any base, but I can't see any good coming from 100% checks at Gagetown.  Anyone could just walk 100 feet down the road and enter the base on foot.  How do you secure endless miles of forest?
 
Neill McKay said:
Everyone should carry proper identification any time they're on any base, but I can't see any good coming from 100% checks at Gagetown.   Anyone could just walk 100 feet down the road and enter the base on foot.   How do you secure endless miles of forest?

good point...and that reminds me of something my mom always used to say "locks are for honest people, if someone wants to break in bad enough, they will"

but at least more checks, more often will maybe deter the average trouble maker...and possibly make the general public more aware of the possibility of threat...or am I just being naive?
JMHO
 
CdnArtyWife said:
good point...and that reminds me of something my mom always used to say "locks are for honest people, if someone wants to break in bad enough, they will"

but at least more checks, more often will maybe deter the average trouble maker...and possibly make the general public more aware of the possibility of threat...or am I just being naive?

It would certainly make the public more aware (and cause a bit of grumbling among them as the traffic backs up into Oromocto), but I would think some kind of threat assessment should me made before deciding on security measures.  I'm not an expert in security, but I am familiar with risk assessment as used in design (of structures, etc.).  The idea is to consider the likelihood of an "incident", and the severity of the "incident" should it happen.  In civil engineering this means we take more care to avoid more serious failures, and are less concerned about less serious failures.  As an example, hospitals are designed to a higher standard of resistance to earthquakes than office buildings because the consequences of a hospital being severely damaged in an earthquake are more serious than those of an office building being damaged (not least because the earthquake is likely to cause the hospital to get a lot of business!).

So applying the same thinking to military base security, the likelihood of hard-core terrorists striking any given CF installation would seem to be fairly small, but if they should be attacked, some installations would result in more trouble for the Forces than others.  It's well known that the Halifax dockyard contains more than half of the navy's pointy-end in a fairly small space, and security at the dockyard is correspondingly tight (heavy gates, fences, etc., all visible to anyone who happens by on the street).  CFB Gagetown, on the other hand, doesn't seem quite so juicy, being spread out over a huge area, so the severity of an "incident" would probably be somewhat less than the Dockyard and the same level of security might not be appropriate there.

As others have pointed out, there is a symbolic value to attacking any military target, so that would probably skew the issue somewhat.  How much is a question I'll leave to wiser minds than mine.
 
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