Minister Anand announces investment of up to $3.7 billion to supply operational clothing and footwear to the Canadian Armed Forces

[Eye In The Sky]

Just to add, and i know most are famil with this; I want to highlight the responsibility of Officers wrt dress. I for one wish we’d start following our own policies and stop making excuses for failures when we don’t follow them like “it’s always been that way”.

CONTROL​

1. Control is exercised by local commanders who may standardize the dress of subordinates…
2. Commanders shall maintain the standards at all times…
3. Officers cannot delegate their leadership responsibilities. They are assisted by warrant and non- commissioned officers, who control standards and compliance by all of their subordinates.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

I have no idea how the timeline transpired but I wouldn't be surprised if the unit CO hadn't even heard of it in time until:

1. The Reddit post was made
2. Corps staff read said post
3. Corps staff told the Corps CWO

Unit COs are generally pretty busy people and "buttons and bows" stuff is probably delegated to their RSM and/or Adjt. It's totally possible that points 1-3 happened before the CO even caught wind of the RSM pulling this crap.

That highlights another fault in the CT
Concept, to me.

My solution to the “not everyone has collar dogs” problem, if I was the RSM, would be to suggest to the Adjt/DCO/CO “if not everyone has them, no one wears them”. Uniformity issue addressed, decision made by the correct authority. I’ve done my job as one of those Warrant type ranks - advised.

 

[Halifax Tar]

That highlights another fault in the CT
Concept, to me.

My solution to the “not everyone has collar dogs” problem, if I was the RSM, would be to suggest to the Adjt/DCO/CO “if not everyone has them, no one wears them”. Uniformity issue addressed, decision made by the correct authority. I’ve done my job as one of those Warrant type ranks - advised.

This was similar to the unit PT strip shmozzle when I was pretending to be green.

Someone would think they can order people to buy a track suit or some such thing.

 

[rmc_wannabe]

That highlights another fault in the CT
Concept, to me.

My solution to the “not everyone has collar dogs” problem, if I was the RSM, would be to suggest to the Adjt/DCO/CO “if not everyone has them, no one wears them”. Uniformity issue addressed, decision made by the correct authority. I’ve done my job as one of those Warrant type ranks - advised.

I agree. This whole thing was bungled from day one and I wholeheartedly agree that the Command Team structure has caused this kind of ambiguity to persist.

There's the way things should be, the way things shouldn't be, and the way things are. The way things are a usually a combination for the first two, in varying degrees left and right.

 

[rmc_wannabe]

This was similar to the unit PT strip shmozzle when I was pretending to be green.

Someone would think they can order people to buy a track suit or some such thing.

Don't get me started on that. As a Brigade Siggie, every 2 years hopping to a new out det was an expensive endeavor to avoid the ire of the RSM.

I also feel NPF monies are better spent on morale and welfare items than ensuring uniformity of dress for Unit PT.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

This was similar to the unit PT strip shmozzle when I was pretending to be green.

Someone would think they can order people to buy a track suit or some such thing.

I still remember being a young Reserve Jnr rank and “doing what I was told” including spending my own money on garrison dress belt buckles and T shirts.

It’s been going on for far far too long.

 

[Halifax Tar]

Don't get me started on that. As a Brigade Siggie, every 2 years hopping to a new out det was an expensive endeavor to avoid the ire of the RSM.

I also feel NPF monies are better spent on morale and welfare items than ensuring uniformity of dress for Unit PT.

I hear ya.

NPF is highly underused and even more misunderstood.

I keep the NPF manual on my desk top.

 

[FormerHorseGuard]

can fix the PT gear issue

everyone is issued jogging pants, t shirt, and running shoes just like in basic.
regimental funds can be used to issue Regimental T shirts etc.

 

[KevinB]

This was similar to the unit PT strip shmozzle when I was pretending to be green.

Someone would think they can order people to buy a track suit or some such thing.

IIRC We got our initial PPCLI PT gear issued (Regimental Fund?)- follow on items where at ones own expense.
Honestly it really wasn't a source of complaint due to the whole clothing upkeep allowance back then.

I really don't see how PT Gear should be an issue -- but I also don't see ANY point to large group PT either, the CAF would be much better set doing smaller sized PT in fitness level set groups.
BN and higher level PT is just ridiculous - either the CO is a fitness king and drags their unit over hells half acre and they look like crap, or they aren't, and then half the unit doesn't get anything out of the PT -- it's even more inane at Bde level.

 

[daftandbarmy]

IIRC We got our initial PPCLI PT gear issued (Regimental Fund?)- follow on items where at ones own expense.
Honestly it really wasn't a source of complaint due to the whole clothing upkeep allowance back then.

I really don't see how PT Gear should be an issue -- but I also don't see ANY point to large group PT either, the CAF would be much better set doing smaller sized PT in fitness level set groups.
BN and higher level PT is just ridiculous - either the CO is a fitness king and drags their unit over hells half acre and they look like crap, or they aren't, and then half the unit doesn't get anything out of the PT -- it's even more inane at Bde level.

We used to do a battalion 10 miler once a week, and Pl/Coy PT here and there during the week.

That seemed to work well. But the regiment's DNA was programmed for that from the lowest to highest levels, so it was easy to manage.

 

[KevinB]

We used to do a battalion 10 miler once a week, and Pl/Coy PT here and there during the week.

That seemed to work well. But the regiment's DNA was programmed for that from the lowest to highest levels, so it was easy to manage.

Honestly I think even Platoon PT is too large to give most folks a good workout.
It may have changed - but most years I saw (1987-2004) things where focused on Rucksack Marches - or runs.
Very little circuit training, and virtually no upper body work outside Chin Ups's and Push Ups

I always figured the best PT schedule to joining a team that allowed for individual PT.
Run mornings, Swim at noon, Weights / Ruckruns in the evening.

 

[daftandbarmy]

Honestly I think even Platoon PT is too large to give most folks a good workout.
It may have changed - but most years I saw (1987-2004) things where focused on Rucksack Marches - or runs.
Very little circuit training, and virtually no upper body work outside Chin Ups's and Push Ups

I always figured the best PT schedule to joining a team that allowed for individual PT.
Run mornings, Swim at noon, Weights / Ruckruns in the evening.

And, as I recall, if I had allowed 'individual PT' for my platoon that would probably have resulted in me and the Pl 2IC getting some good fitness in running around trying to keep my troops out of the pubs

 

[KevinB]

And, as I recall, if I had allowed 'individual PT' for my platoon that would probably have resulted in me and the Pl 2IC getting some good fitness in running around trying to keep my troops out of the pubs

Yeah, there needs to be repercussions for failure to actually do PT.

 

[Furniture]

Yeah, there needs to be repercussions for failure to actually do PT.

Charge the first few who fail to do it, people will catch on.

In my experience people live up or down to the expectations placed on them. The CAF loves to lower expectations and treat people like children.

 

[daftandbarmy]

Charge the first few who fail to do it, people will catch on.

In my experience people live up or down to the expectations placed on them. The CAF loves to lower expectations and treat people like children.

Anecdotally....

Alot of those I've seen in Class B land, who were treated like adults and given the first hour of the day to do PT before work, did not do PT.

Some got an extra smoke in though...

 

[KevinB]

Anecdotally....

Alot of those I've seen in Class B land, who were treated like adults and given the first hour of the day to do PT before work, did not do PT.

Some got an extra smoke in though...

I have a rather dim view of people on permanent class B as often they are exactly the wrong sort of people for those spots. Generally not the types do you want in any sort of permanent position

 

[daftandbarmy]

I have a rather dim view of people on permanent class B as often they are exactly the wrong sort of people for those spots. Generally not the types do you want in any sort of permanent position

Like anywhere else there's good and not so good. It's the quality of the leadership that makes the difference, of course

 

[KevinB]

Like anywhere else there's good and not so good. It's the quality of the leadership that makes the difference, of course

Which often is the issue itself…

 

[Navy_Pete]

There are 3300 RegF Sigs PYs. At $19.95 a pair someone could just cut a cheque for $70,000 and buy everyone a set. Instead, PSPC will require a SRCL and Disabilities Act statement, as well as argue we can't tell the bidders exactly what colour blue goes in the flags. It's not a broken supply system, its a broken procurement system that treats $70K of metals badges the same as buying 90 F35s.

Don't forget an Indigenous procurement assessment, and a GBA+ analysis (sadly not kidding). 90 F35s would also have a lot more, as you also need to do a sustainment business case assessment (SBCA), IRB/ITBs/VP, treasuy board submissions and then have it run through the monthly DPS gauntlet.

And then there is always the chance of literally anyone submitting a CITT claim which shuts down procurement (valid complaint or not).

But as long as it's a 'fair, open and transparent' RFP process boxes are checked.

 

[rmc_wannabe]

Don't forget an Indigenous procurement assessment, and a GBA+ analysis (sadly not kidding). 90 F35s would also have a lot more, as you also need to do a sustainment business case assessment (SBCA), IRB/ITBs/VP, treasuy board submissions and then have it run through the monthly DPS gauntlet.

And then there is always the chance of literally anyone submitting a CITT claim which shuts down procurement (valid complaint or not).

But as long as it's a 'fair, open and transparent' RFP process boxes are checked.

This post right here explains why we need to bring back a separate Ordinance organization within DND that is out of arms reach of PSPC and TBS.

We're not sourcing office furniture for a Fisheries workplace. Most military items we buy cannot be sourced from Canadian, Indigenous, or Green companies, and I would love to see a GBA+ Assessment on an NLAW or Javelin.

This is what happens when you let burecrats rule by committee