Monthly Pay after deductions - Questions [Merged]

[Disenchantedsailor]

It is indeed situation dependant and is spelled out on the offer/aceptance msg I should have been a little more clear and said that in MY CASE (all being different with the entry plans and previous service and so on and so on) the msg stated commsioning upon completion of botp ph ii (botc) with effective date of the day of my appt to OCdt. but as for catherine your best bet indeed is to speak to your recruiter, I gave you my BEST GUESS and that is all it is. Cheers

 

[Quag]

I can say that ROTP is backpayed to the EPZ....

 

[Astrodog]

Arty, will I being seeing you at the mega come sept? You can guide a new fish like me through the process!

 

[Disenchantedsailor]

I'll be there on 25 Aug first thing in the morn, what srl are you loaded on I'm on 0072e

 

[mudrecceman]

Now...REMEMBER this is DEO pay.

I can tell you that the DEO Nursing Officer's, as an example, do NOT come in at OCdt pay level as for ROTP types...

Small detail but very important...it depends on the MOC the original poster is going for and her qual's....

Catherine what MOC are you shooting for?

 

[shorinsakka]

Call your recruitment centre.  I am entering the army as a DEO, and my letter of enrolment has the following two lines in it:

Pay rate - 2Lt Incentive Pay Level 2
Rank worn - OCdt (until BMOQ is successfully passed)

I suspect every situation will vary.

 

[Disenchantedsailor]

My situation is simaler,

Appointed OCdt, Commissioning to 2Lt upon completion of BMOQ with an effective date of 15 April (2Lt Level D IPC 4) Current rate of pay as an OCdt - CPL IPC 4 (Vested right to pay and all) which I suspect is the same in your case, unless of course you already have your commissioning scroll from the Governor General, if thats the case however I'm way out in left field.

 

[Meridian]

This CEOTP confusion is really starting to annoy me. In the end, Im basically going through the motions to get a letter to see what it says, since Recruiting seems unable to be entirely certain.

The old OCTP program commissioned following MOC training, but effective date of Commission was 9 months after enrollment OR end MOC, which ever was earliest.  So you get most (not all, unless BOMQ takes 9 months for you for some reason) of the pay back and most (not all) of the time-in-rank.

CEOTP replaces OCTP.  The Adm (mil) direction states that CEOTP commissions following completion of basic officer training.  No more specificity.
I wish I could figure out who to ask for a formal answer on this, because the CFRC seems to believe in all cases it is as it was for OCTP, but clearly this is not the case.

 

[PO2FinClk]

CBI 204.211(9): http://www.dnd.ca/dgcb/cbi/engraph/home_e.asp?sidesection=6&Section=204.211&sidecat=21&Chapter=204#204.211

CBI 204.211(9): Tables A, B & C

 

[shorinsakka]

My situation is simaler,

Appointed OCdt, Commissioning to 2Lt upon completion of BMOQ with an effective date of 15 April (2Lt Level D IPC 4) Current rate of pay as an OCdt - CPL IPC 4 (Vested right to pay and all) which I suspect is the same in your case, unless of course you already have your commissioning scroll from the Governor General, if thats the case however I'm way out in left field.

I have no comission as of yet, but was sworn in today and confirmed I will be paid exactly as I mentioned.  In the room were several different cases who were all being paid at different levels, confirming that the only pay statement to trust is the one which comes from the recruiting centre.  I was quite impressed at the variety of fields of life people came from.  Anyway, good luck to us all.

 

[Meridian]

shorinsakka,

All DEO candidates are commissioned following BOTP/BOMQ. I've yet to hear any stories where someone wasn't.

The difference is for those without a degree.. it seems, at least from reading here, that those with former service via CEOTP receive commission the same as DEO.  ROTP and everyone else wait until MOC qualified, though ROTP only receive once their degree is complete.

 

[Disenchantedsailor]

Good plan shorinsakka, although I have found the only pay statement to trust is the one that comes in the mail (or email nowadays) and even then it can sometimes be sketchy. See you in the Mega

 

[Quag]

shorinsakka,

All DEO candidates are commissioned following BOTP/BOMQ. I've yet to hear any stories where someone wasn't.

The difference is for those without a degree.. it seems, at least from reading here, that those with former service via CEOTP receive commission the same as DEO.   ROTP and everyone else wait until MOC qualified, though ROTP only receive once their degree is complete.

ROTP receive their commission once degree is complete, not after MOC qualified...

 

[Meridian]

QUAG,

That's what I said...

 

[Quag]

ROTP and everyone else wait until MOC qualified...

Sorry, I must have misinterpreted this part...

 

[Inch]

Catherine,

You will be sworn in and appointed OCdt and paid at that rate (monthly alloted bi-weekly) approx 1273/Month less rations and quarters and other good old mandatory deductions CPP/QPP (thats right QPP for the time you are in Que) and son on, upon completion of whichever Phase DEO Candidates are commissioned (I'm honestly not too sure if its the end of IAP/BOTC as CEOTP applicants or different for some reason) you will be commisoned 2lt and paid as a 2lt and backpaid from the day you swear in (if it states the effective date of commsioning to be your swearing in date on the offer/msg) I am assuming you have no previous service so you would be paid as 2Lt Cat C pay incentive 0, if however you do have previous service in the rank of Cpl or above you will be paid as 2Lt Cat D IPC 0, I could be of the mark a little as our situations a different but CBI 204.211 (linked below) Refers, feel free to pm me if some of this is unclear.

John


http://www.dnd.ca/dgcb/cbi/engraph/home_e.asp?sidesection=6&Section=204.211&sidecat=21&Chapter=204#204.211

Actually, we're paid semi-monthly, not bi-weekly. The difference is 24 paychecks a year vs the 26 paychecks that biweekly yields.

 

[I_am_John_Galt]

Catherine,

You will be sworn in and appointed OCdt and paid at that rate (monthly alloted bi-weekly) approx 1273/Month less rations and quarters and other good old mandatory deductions CPP/QPP (thats right QPP for the time you are in Que) and son on, upon completion of whichever Phase DEO Candidates are commissioned (I'm honestly not too sure if its the end of IAP/BOTC as CEOTP applicants or different for some reason) you will be commisoned 2lt and paid as a 2lt and backpaid from the day you swear in (if it states the effective date of commsioning to be your swearing in date on the offer/msg) I am assuming you have no previous service so you would be paid as 2Lt Cat C pay incentive 0, if however you do have previous service in the rank of Cpl or above you will be paid as 2Lt Cat D IPC 0, I could be of the mark a little as our situations a different but CBI 204.211 (linked below) Refers, feel free to pm me if some of this is unclear.

John http://www.dnd.ca/dgcb/cbi/engraph/home_e.asp?sidesection=6&Section=204.211&sidecat=21&Chapter=204#204.211

As a DEO you should be paid as a 2Lt from Day 1 ... after you are sworn-in you are on LWOP (leave without pay) until you arrive in St Jean: you are not paid during that period (but it is pensionable, IIRC).  Once you are in St. Jean they only pay you something like $1,000 the first month as they holdback the balance to cover the cost of unreturnable kit, etc. in the case of early VWs.  IIRC, you are back-paid the balance in the second month ...

Bottom line: as a DEO, if you are receiving OCdt pay at any time, someone has made an error.

 

[I_am_John_Galt]

P.S> IPC level on enrolment also seems to be related to education, though I'm not sure exactly how (I don't know of any DEOs that started at 2Lt IPC 0 ... from what I've seen undergrad degrees start at IPC 2 and Master's at IPC 3).

 

[Disenchantedsailor]

204.211(9) (Rate of pay – DEO) An officer to whom the DEO plan applies shall be paid, for each month after the month and year specified in the table, at the rate of pay for the officer’s rank and pay increment as follows:

(a) in the rank of lieutenant or second lieutenant
(i) with no former non-commissioned member service, in pay level C of Table “B” or “C” to this instruction, or

http://www.forces.gc.ca/hr/dgcb/cbi/engraph/home_e.asp?sidesection=6&Section=204.211&sidecat=21&Chapter=204#204.211
(link included because I can't get the table to paste nicely)

It's not linked to level of education but entry plan and former service. (all deo officers regardless of education are enrolled at Pay level C IPC 0 unless they have previous service) A wee comparison a CEOTP Cpl will enter at 2Lt lvl D Pay incentive to match or exceed the one in the previous trade to preserve vested right to pay. In my case 2Lt Lvl D IPC 5 as IPC 4 is below that of Cpl 4

As for the number of pay periods I've checked twice with my BOR as I felt not enough taxes were being remitted, once it was explained to me using the CRA deduction tables that we are inded paid Monthly/alloted bi-monthy I stopped bugging them (if you look at your pay stub it shows 1 tax payment per month (along with all the other deductions) match that single payment per month against the corresponding table from the CRA Deduction guide for your province and you will find it works out to the penny, however if you look at the tables for bi monthly they numbers just don't jive)

 

[I_am_John_Galt]

204.211(9) (Rate of pay – DEO) An officer to whom the DEO plan applies shall be paid, for each month after the month and year specified in the table, at the rate of pay for the officer’s rank and pay increment as follows:

(a) in the rank of lieutenant or second lieutenant
(i) with no former non-commissioned member service, in pay level C of Table “B” or “C” to this instruction, or

http://www.forces.gc.ca/hr/dgcb/cbi/engraph/home_e.asp?sidesection=6&Section=204.211&sidecat=21&Chapter=204#204.211
(link included because I can't get the table to paste nicely)

No, that just tells you which line on which table to use.

It's not linked to level of education but entry plan and former service. (all deo officers regardless of education are enrolled at Pay level C IPC 0 unless they have previous service) A wee comparison a CEOTP Cpl will enter at 2Lt lvl D Pay incentive to match or exceed the one in the previous trade to preserve vested right to pay. In my case 2Lt Lvl D IPC 5 as IPC 4 is below that of Cpl 4

No; CBI 204.015 - PAY INCREMENTS

(1) (Purpose) Pay increments as set out in the tables to the CBIs in this chapter serve two purposes:

  1. to determine the rate of pay on enrolment, transfer or change in class of Reserve Force service based on pay credits that, in accordance with orders or instructions issued by the Chief of Defence Staff, reflect the amount of qualifying service, academic or other special qualifications possessed by an applicant that are determined to be of military value; and
  2. to provide a means of progression through the pay range for each rank.

I don't know if there is anything more specific, hence my earlier comment.

As for the number of pay periods I've checked twice with my BOR as I felt not enough taxes were being remitted, once it was explained to me using the CRA deduction tables that we are inded paid Monthly/alloted bi-monthy I stopped bugging them (if you look at your pay stub it shows 1 tax payment per month (along with all the other deductions) match that single payment per month against the corresponding table from the CRA Deduction guide for your province and you will find it works out to the penny, however if you look at the tables for bi monthly they numbers just don't jive)

I've never seen a "bi-monthly" pay table: AFAIK, they are always stated in monthly amounts; I'm not sure how you could *not* know how often you are getting paid, but it is right here: CBI 203.03 - ISSUE OF PAY AND ALLOWANCE

(1) (Payment) Subject to paragraphs (2), (3) and (6), pay and allowances shall be issued in arrears to an officer or non-commissioned member. Payment shall be made on the fifteenth and last days of each month or on any other day that the Chief of the Defence Staff determines is required to meet the needs of the Canadian Forces, except that when the day is not a full banking day, pay and allowances may be issued on the preceding full banking day.