On prison populations

[zipperhead_cop]

Yes, I do vote Liberal, I use my guaranteed right to vote for any party or candidate I want. I vote for the one which best reflects my personal views, as do most Canadians. So therefore I suppose for the last 25 years, most Canadians have supported the views? (and right now, the Conservatives are a minority)

I guess we all have our own opinions, and my self favour Canada and European law enforcement and justice over American style any day.

But you of course have your opinions, and can vote how ever you want. I guess in the end, democracy and the Canadian people will decide eh?

Canadians by and large don't have a clue about what is going on in the legal system, an IMO would be horrified to see what was going on under their noses.  The most insidious thing now is the "pre sentance report".  It is supposed to take into consideration all of the mitigating "factors" in order to determine the appropriate sentace.  However, what it does is provides the criminal with a chance to lob out a bunch of BS (I have a job lined up, I'm going back to school this fall, I am in counselling, my mom is so sick and no one takes care of her, blah, blah, blah) that never gets verified and is generally bullshit.  But the main thing that it does is gets the civilian witnesses and victims out of the court.  They get to be there to see a guilty plea or verdict, but then they don't come back for the sentacing.  Dates are set in courts just strictly for sentancing cases, so the only people in the court room are the criminal, his lawyer, the judge and the Crown (also a lawyer).  Nobody gets to see the donkey show in progress, unless the liberal media chose to publish it. 

BTW, I recommend you use cold water to get the stains out of your flag before they set in.

 

[George Wallace]

Yes, I do vote Liberal, I use my guaranteed right to vote for any party or candidate I want. I vote for the one which best reflects my personal views, as do most Canadians. So therefore I suppose for the last 25 years, most Canadians have supported the views? (and right now, the Conservatives are a minority)

I guess we all have our own opinions, and my self favour Canada and European law enforcement and justice over American style any day.

So you are in favour of this Judicial System that is 'soft' on Hardened Criminals?  You agree whole heartedly with the release of incurable Pedophiles into the community?  The problems we have with our Legal and Judicial Systems is a result of your Liberal Parties policies over the years.  It is time we got tough on Hardened Criminals and Major Crime.

Yes!  I do have an opinion.  It is that the Liberal Party and all its social engineering and 'Goody Two Shoes - Feel Good' Policies have destroyed my country.

 

[rz350]

I don't see the liberals as a stain on Canada. I seem them as a mark of what makes us Canadian.  We are a Liberal nation, sort of like the other the 3 major countries who have HM Elizabeth as their Queen.

However, I do think mitigation factors should be looked into, and things like "I have a job coming up" or "I have school" should not be an excuse. But a few factors should be considered, and I support the right of Judges to make sentencing decisions based on factors, not minimum mandatory.

That said, I still do not agree with stronger laws on drugs, prostitution and gambling, and I'll use my vote to match my own views.

So you are in favour of this Judicial System that is 'soft' on Hardened Criminals?  You agree whole heartedly with the release of incurable Pedophiles into the community?  The problems we have with our Legal and Judicial Systems is a result of your Liberal Parties policies over the years.  It is time we got tough on Hardened Criminals and Major Crime.

Yes!  I do have an opinion.  It is that the Liberal Party and all its social engineering and 'Goody Two Shoes - Feel Good' Policies have destroyed my country.

Your entitled to that opinion, and I am sure you used your vote to vote for who you feel best. Hey, you guys won this time for hecks sake.

I would support execution for paedophiles.(sign me up to the do the honor) But I would not support 10 years in the slammer for smoking pot.

 

[Torlyn]

I would support execution for paedophiles.(sign me up to the do the honor) But I would not support 10 years in the slammer for smoking pot.

So, you're not liberal then.  Their mandate is 100% against capital punishment regardless.  Also I would *LOVE* to see you provide one Canadian example of a person getting 10 years for SMOKING pot.

T

 

[rz350]

I know, its not a Canadian example, it would be more a USA example. I am thankful I can not find a Canadian example of it.

Hey, everyone disagrees with their party a bit, But I agree with the Lib's more then the Con's or the NDP. (I'm a total give money to the poor after taking it from me sucker, nor do I want to ban gay marriage, make wire taps easier and send more people to jail for minor crimes) so I pick the middle.

 

[HDE]

Always amazed at the number of guys who get killed just as they're "turning their lives around" :'(

 

[zipperhead_cop]

Your entitled to that opinion, and I am sure you used your vote to vote for who you feel best. Hey, you guys won this time for hecks sake.

And I'm sure that at the ripe old age of 19, you have done some serious culture shaping.  :  So the one time you got to vote, your party lost? 
To be sure the GTA will be a liberal socialist paradise for some time to come, but you people need to stop mewling about violent crime when it was YOUR peoples soft policies that allowed Toronto to turn into a junkpile.  You made your bed, lie in it. 
I hope you get a chance to share your views with your DS during your basic with the QYRang if you get in.

 

[rz350]

Yes, I voted once. That's it. I don't think I will be sharing my political views with my DS in BMQ, since I am sure a) he or she wont want to hear it. b) I'l be to busy trying  be the best solider I can be. I won't be worrying about politics. I'll save that for the Internet and conversations with people.


I do sleep in my bed here in the GTA. I feel safe here, I've never been mugged, shot at, stabbed, or anything else, and I live in a crummy area. (Down by Regent park if you must know) I've been assaulted a few times at work, but that's different.

But may I ask what unit I am joining (and btw I've been told that I am accepted, and that I'll be on course this fall) has to do with this?

Or my age? I though suffrage was 18, meaning at 18, I was fully entitled to vote and take part in the political system of this great nation.

 

[zipperhead_cop]

But may I ask what unit I am joining (and btw I've been told that I am accepted, and that I'l be on course this fall) has to do with this?
Or my age? I though suffrage was 18, meaning at 18, I was fully entitled to vote and take part in the political system of this great nation.

The unit has nothing to do with it.  It was referenced because you indicate you are enrolling in the military.
The fact that you are 19 is in reference to the fact that you have not had much in the way of life experience, despite what you may think.  Have some fun.  Cut and paste your posts to a file and try to sit on it for twenty years.  Then open it and see if you are the same person. 
There is a reason so much hippie crap stems from universities.  Age+idealism+no experience= jr hippie.  And what happens to most of those jr hippies?  They grow up, get a job, house, family and a clue and realize that the pie in the sky crap is just that--crap.  Just seems that different regions take longer than others to figure it out.  GTA and BC being the slowest, Alberta probably being the fastest in general.

 

[rz350]

Well, I think joining the military should help counter some so called hippiness? I'm a firm supporter of the mission in Afghanistan, and the war on terror in general. Not a trait normally shared with hippies.

So I'll grow up and change to a conservative, just like the Liberal MP's did? Just like jack Layton of the NDP did(I dont like him, but he is a good example)? He's in his 60's isn't he? So was the Rt. Hon Mr.Martin. He was also a wealthy business man, not a dope smoking hippy.

Is it really so evil and bad of me to say I support death for pedophiles, murder, rape. Heavy jail for assault, armed robbery, ect.

Medium jail for property crimes.

And light sentences for moral crimes like drugs and prostitution?

Will I have my opinion, it won't be changed by you, nor will I chage your's, so I think I'l leave it be at this point.

Fun thread tho. I like political debate.

 

[Torlyn]

Fun thread tho. I like political debate.

Then perhaps you should try and have one.  Nothing you have said has shown any evidence supporting your position that the US is heavy handed in the number of criminals behind bars...  Do they have more criminals behind bars?  Yes.  And a variety of members have shown that there could be statistical anomolies with this reporting, ergo, the onus is on you to attempt to back up what you are purportedly debating.  Bonne chance.

T

 

[zipperhead_cop]

Fun thread tho. I like political debate.

Feh.  Seems you just like to argue.  Not the same thing. 

 

[rz350]

Feh.  Seems you just like to argue.  Not the same thing. 

You like to argue too then, since you didn't provide any more evidence then me. (in fact I was one of two people who gave evidence, the other someone other then you)

my evidence is as follows. The USA has per population a prison population nearly 7 times that of Canada, and of the rest of the western, free, democratic world.

It is the highest in the world, with its closest followers being countries like Belarus, Russia and Turkmenistan.

I embrace the ideals of western democracy. Seeing as all the other western democracys have a lower rate of imprisonment the the USA.The USA actually has a rate higher then, but close to the eastern and central Asian authoritarian regimes, I conclude the USA is being heavy handed in the dealing out of prison sentences.

That's my final argument/debate/etc/.

I gave my evidence at the start of this thread, it is from the British Government. It is up to you to refute this data as incorrect, by showing me another credible study which disagrees.

 

[zipperhead_cop]

Don't care, not interested.  You win.  I'm done.

 

[Nemo888]

I've always been a lttle confused by that statistic. With seven times our rate of incarceration the USA still has a higher crime rate. We must be doing something right.

 

[Bruce Monkhouse]

DO NOT let our *cough* "lower crime" rate fool ya......... these are the same people who bring you the budgets, etc.

TODAYS FOOD FOR YOUR THOUGHTS
If someone walks on a technical did a crime actually happen?

 

[GAP]

DO NOT let our *cough* "lower crime" rate fool ya......... these are the same people who bring you the budgets, etc.

TODAYS FOOD FOR YOUR THOUGHTS
If someone walks on a technical did a crime actually happen?

We need a point system...OK...technically you can't be punished for crime because of issue A and C, but we find you guilty of the crime so you get a 10 year sentence less one year for A and one year for C, now go serve the full 8 years. 

 

[Brad Sallows]

>I've always been a lttle confused by that statistic. With seven times our rate of incarceration the USA still has a higher crime rate. We must be doing something right.

If crimes aren't reported or logged they don't show up in the statistics.  Without knowing how the respective police agencies - and there are many of them - deal with various crimes (prosecute, ignore), it's impossible to usefully compare statistics.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

The thread was started with a partisan eye against the US. It is clear throughout the posts that the originator's sole reasoning is that the US is bad compared to the rest of the world. Clear contradictory points were supplied by Law Enforcement, Corrections and people from the US, but the originator fails to concede. It's his prerogative. However, we don't have to beat our heads against the wall trying to convince him and listen to lame, unresearched dogma. This is locked. Anybody that has something solid and beneficial to add (heaven knows what that would be) knows the drill.

rz350,

In future, you would be well advised to formulate a proper question or argument, back by solid research and references, before launching on another debacle like the one you just created. Credit goes to the other posters for humouring you. Don't expect it to be the norm.