Order in Council?

[amk81]

Hey everyone...another question...hopefully not a stupid one.
I'm joining the reserves and was wondering in what circumstances (if any) would i be required to deploy overseas?  Keeping in mind I know that there has to be an "order in council" but what does that really mean?  I've also heard a former reg force guy tell me that there's no circumstances where a reservist would be forced to deploy.

Please understand that I'm not saying I wouldn't deploy...I just like to have as much info as possible.

Thanks!

 

[PuckChaser]

Order in Council means the Governor General makes a law on behalf of the Queen with the advice of the Prime Minister. http://www.thecanadianencyclopedia.com/index.cfm?PgNm=TCE&Params=A1ARTA0005968

The only circumstances a Reservist can be forced to deploy is by Order in Council, which would probably have to be a major natural disaster, aide to civil power operation, or global conflict.

 

[Neill McKay]

I've also heard a former reg force guy tell me that there's no circumstances where a reservist would be forced to deploy.

To put it into perspective, I don't believe it's ever happened outside of a world war.

 

[JMesh]

To put it into perspective, I don't believe it's ever happened outside of a world war.

According to Wikipedia, that would likely be correct. (Admittedly not the best source in the world, but here it is anyway):

In case of a severe national emergency, an Order In Council may be signed by the Governor General of Canada acting under the advisement of the federal cabinet to call reserve members of the Canadian Forces into active service. Members of the reserve have not been called to involuntary active service in foreign operations since the Second World War.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_Forces_Primary_Reserve#Deployment

 

[The Bread Guy]

A bit more detail from a 1999 paper on the Reserves (also attached in case link doesn't work) - highlights mine:

.... B. Mobilization Strategies

(....)

  1. Force Generation

The first stage of a response to any crisis of emergency is force generation which includes all measures needed to prepare elements of the Canadian Forces to undertake, sustain and support new operational tasks. These functions will be undertaken within the existing resource framework of the Canadian Forces and will include the training and preparation of volunteer reservists, often on an individual basis, to augment the Regular Force.

      2. Force Enhancement

In the second stage of mobilization, force enhancement, the operational capabilities of the existing forces are improved through the allocation of more resources. Such action will be undertaken without permanent change in the structure or roles of the Canadian Forces, although the formation of temporary units or specialist elements may prove necessary. This level of mobilization would be similar to action taken in response to the 1990 situation in the Persian Gulf and all current peacekeeping commitments. Once again, the Reserve Force is expected to provide personnel, predominantly on an individual basis, to augment Regular Force units.

      3. Force Expansion

The third stage, force expansion, involves the enlargement of the Canadian Forces - and perhaps selected elements of the Department of National Defence - to meet a major crisis or emergency. It would likely involve permanent changes in the roles, structure and taskings of the Canadian Forces and could call for the formation of new units, the enhancement of existing facilities and the procurement of additional equipment. This stage would include structural and role changes similar to those undergone by all elements of the Canadian Forces and the Department of National Defence in 1950-1952 when Canada provided armed forces to the United Nations multinational force in Korea and to the then newly formed NATO in Europe. In stage 3, selective activation of reservists individually and in units would be effected by call-up under the terms of an order in council.

      4. National Mobilization

Finally, while a major global war is highly unlikely at this time, it remains prudent to have "no-cost" plans ready for total national mobilization. This fourth stage could touch all aspects of Canadian society - including reserves, as well as civilians without military training - and would only come into effect with the proclamation by the Governor-in-Council of a war emergency under the Emergencies Act. The SCRR reported that, "surprisingly, there is no detailed plan in existence for a stage 4 national mobilization." ....

 

[Neill McKay]

If I recall correctly (and it's been a good long while since I read that paper) the information quoted above was proposed as a possible scheme for a national call-out or the reserves, as opposed to a description of any existing plan.

 

[Dennis Ruhl]

It is my understanding that reservists were not involuntarily activated to fight overseas even during WWI and WWII.  Conscription caught reservists on the same basis as it did the general population.  Many reservists in these wars may have been in an occupation vital to the war effort and were exempt from conscription.  In our history call-ups for the direct defence of Canada or aid to the civil power were common.  Unless something has changed recently, there is no provision to send reservists overseas without volunteering.  That said, I would guess that at least  90 % of pre-war reservists volunteered.

National Guard units are finding recruiting to be very difficult with the possibility of having to spend multiple tours overseas.  Other than a couple unlucky units the US didn't even call up the Guard during the Vietnam War.  My American relatives spent a lifetime in the Guard without ever seeing a war.

 

[Oldgateboatdriver]

To add to what Dennis says, while you are not "required" to serve, there is definitely an expectation that you will serve if asked as this is part of what you accept when you chose to don the uniform. I am not talking here of general calls for volunteers, as the militia is called upon to assist in Afghanistan, but rather specific request for your service or request to call out your unit.

During the cold war (my era), we reservists certainly expected war to break out at any time and at home, most of us kept our gear all packed in our kit bag at all time. When I was asked to serve during OP SALON (the Oka crisis), I said yes and sorted out the details with my employer after the fact. I was ready to find myself unemployed if it came to that because I had accepted to serve if asked. That is how I think most reservists see the duty they agreed to take on. So make sure you don't explore the nuance between required service and requested service to think you can elect which conflict you support or not through your participation in it. 

 

[Blackadder1916]

. . . I know that there has to be an "order in council" but what does that really mean?  . . .

The likelihood of a reservist being involuntarily deployed has already been well addressed - it is very unlikely.  But orders of the Governor in Council placing members of the Canadian Forces (both regular and reserve) on active service are not as uncommon as most think.

Order in Council means the Governor General makes a law on behalf of the Queen with the advice of the Prime Minister. http://www.thecanadianencyclopedia.com/index.cfm?PgNm=TCE&Params=A1ARTA0005968

This is an incorrect explanation of an "order in council".  The only federal entity in Canada that can “make a law” is Parliament and that is done through statute (or regulation).  An “order in council”, on the other hand, is a proclamation of an administrative decision made in accordance with existing law.  In the case of placing elements of the Canadian Forces on “active service” that law is the National Defence Act.  For the OP, it is also the law that governs the requirement to serve for members of the CF, regular and reserve.

National Defence Act

Active Service

Placing forces on active service

31. (1) The Governor in Council may place the Canadian Forces or any component, unit or other element thereof or any officer or non-commissioned member thereof on active service anywhere in or beyond Canada at any time when it appears advisable to do so
(a) by reason of an emergency, for the defence of Canada;
(b) in consequence of any action undertaken by Canada under the United Nations Charter; or
(c) in consequence of any action undertaken by Canada under the North Atlantic Treaty, the North American Aerospace Defence Command Agreement or any other similar instrument to which Canada is a party.

When officers and non-commissioned members deemed on active service

(2) An officer or non-commissioned member who
(a) is a member of, serving with, or attached or seconded to, a component, unit or other element of the Canadian Forces that has been placed on active service,
(b) has been placed on active service, or
(c) pursuant to law has been attached or seconded to a portion of a force that has been placed on active service,
shall be deemed to be on active service for all purposes.
R.S., 1985, c. N-5, s. 31; R.S., 1985, c. 31 (1st Supp.), s. 60; 2004, c. 15, s. 76.

Proclamation for meeting of Parliament

32. Whenever the Governor in Council places the Canadian Forces or any component or unit thereof on active service, if Parliament is then separated by an adjournment or prorogation that will not expire within ten days, a proclamation shall be issued for the meeting of Parliament within ten days, and Parliament shall accordingly meet and sit on the day appointed by the proclamation, and shall continue to sit and act in like manner as if it had stood adjourned or prorogued to the same day.
R.S., c. N-4, s. 32.

Service

Liability in case of regular force

33. (1) The regular force, all units and other elements thereof and all officers and non-commissioned members thereof are at all times liable to perform any lawful duty.

Liability in case of reserve force

(2) The reserve force, all units and other elements thereof and all officers and non-commissioned members thereof
(a) may be ordered to train for such periods as are prescribed in regulations made by the Governor in Council; and
(b) may be called out on service to perform any lawful duty other than training at such times and in such manner as by regulations or otherwise are prescribed by the Governor in Council.

Exception in case of reserve force

(3) Nothing in subsection (2) shall be deemed to impose liability to serve as prescribed therein, without his consent, on an officer or non-commissioned member of the reserve force who is, by virtue of the terms of his enrolment, liable to perform duty on active service only.

Meaning of “duty”
(4) In this section, “duty” means any duty that is military in nature and includes any duty involving public service authorized under section 273.6.
R.S., 1985, c. N-5, s. 33; R.S., 1985, c. 31 (1st Supp.), s. 60; 1998, c. 35, s. 8.

There are also regulations that govern the Canadian Forces called the Queen's Regulations and Orders (QR&Os) which has more detail about liability of service.  Additionally other orders and directives (while not considered to be statutory instruments like the QR&Os) provide further clarification as to how the CF interprets and administers these statutes and regulations.  One such order/directive is:

ADMINISTRATIVE POLICY OF CLASS "A", CLASS "B" AND CLASS "C" RESERVE SERVICE  CF MIL PERS INSTR 20/04

2.18 Active Service

  1. Pursuant to PC 1989-583 and paragraph 31(1)(b) of the National Defence Act, officers and non-commissioned members of the Reserve Component of the CF are on active service anywhere beyond Canada.

  2. When on active service Res F members:
    1. are subject to the Code of Service Discipline at all times;
    2. are subject to increased punishments when convicted of offences under the Code of Service Discipline;
    3. may be required to serve on continuous full time service;
    4. are subject to be called out;
    5. may be retained on continuous full-time service for up to one year after the cessation of hostilities or period of active service.

  3. Res F members on Cl "B" and Cl "C" Reserve Service serving outside Canada are on active service, and as such, are required to complete the period of Reserve Service for which they volunteered. Voluntary requests to cease that period of Reserve Service will be subject to a case by case review.

  4. Res F members who volunteer for positions or operations being performed outside Canada must be made aware of the fact that they are on active service and of the increased liabilities listed above.

3. Class “A” Reserve Service (Cl “A” Reserve Service)

3.1 Cl “A” Reserve Service

Cl "A" Reserve Service as defined in QR&O 9.06 shall be used for short periods of service to a maximum of 12 consecutive days. Reserve Force members shall not be placed on consecutive periods of Cl "A" Reserve Service in order to avoid the requirement to place the reservist on a period of Cl "B" Reserve Service. For example, a Reserve Force member serving on consecutive five-day periods of Cl "A" Reserve Service with a one or two day break between periods over extended periods.

In the context of this discussion, i.e. deployment overseas on operations, historically the term “active service” had been taken to mean service of a war-like nature beyond the territorial limits of the country or if the nation was in a state of declared war with another nation.  The term has, especially in the years since World War 2, evolve to encompass a wider range of military operational activities.  All members of the regular force of the Canadian Forces and some members of the reserve force are currently on active service due to such an order in council as this.

http://www.canlii.org/en/ca/laws/regu/si-89-103/latest/si-89-103.html

Order Placing Members of the Canadian Forces on Active Service for the Purpose of Fulfilling Canada’s Obligations Under the North Atlantic Treaty  SI/89-103
NATIONAL DEFENCE ACT

Whereas it is desirable, in consequence of action undertaken by Canada to provide forces for collective defence under the North Atlantic Treaty, to place officers and non-commissioned members of the Canadian Forces on active service;
Therefore, Her Excellency the Governor General in Council, on the recommendation of the Minister of National Defence, pursuant to paragraph 31(1)(b)* of the National Defence Act, is pleased hereby, for the purpose of fulfilling Canada's obligations under the North Atlantic Treaty, to place
(a) officers and non-commissioned members of the regular force of the Canadian Forces on active service anywhere in or beyond Canada; and
(b) officers and non-commissioned members of the reserve force of the Canadian Forces on active service anywhere beyond Canada.
* R.S. 1985, c. 31 (1st Supp.), s. 60 (Sch. I, item 14)

This order is just one iteration of similar instruments placing the CF on active service for the purpose of fulfilling obligations under the North Atlantic Treaty and was not unique.  Some of the other orders in council placing CF members on active service have been:

Order Placing Members of the Canadian Forces on Active Service (Arabian Peninsula)  SI/90-111

Order Placing Members of the Canadian Force on Active Service (Western Sahara)  SI/91-146

Order No. 2 Placing Members of the Canadian Forces on Active Service (Somalia), SI/92-222

Order Placing Members of the Canadian Forces on Active Service (Cambodia), SI/92-43

Order Placing Members of the Canadian Forces on Active Service (Iran-Iraq), SI/88-129

Order Placing Members of the Canadian Forces on Active Service (ONUCA—Central America), SI/90-15

Order Placing Members of the Canadian Forces on Active Service (Somalia) SI/92-169

Order Placing Members of the Canadian Forces on Active Service (UNTAG-Namibia), SI/89-104

Order Placing Members of the Canadian Forces on Active Service (Yugoslavia)  SI/92-42

All these Orders in Council were similarly worded and include a paragraph such as this:

. . .
Therefore, His Excellency the Governor General in Council, on the recommendation of the Minister of National Defence, pursuant to paragraph 31(1)(b)* of the National Defence Act, is pleased hereby to place on active service beyond Canada those
(a) officers and non-commissioned members of the regular force of the Canadian Forces, and
(b) officers and non-commissioned members of the reserve force of the Canadian Forces
who are part of, or serve in immediate support of, the United Nations Protection Force.

This means reservists are on active service when they are employed beyond the territorial boundaries of  Canada, however some reserve members are deemed to be on active service within Canada.  As an odd factoid, there were a few Class A primary reservists and even CICs (performing Class A duties at their reserve unit and CIC officers similarly part-time at their cadet corps) on active service at one time.

 

[pfinlayson]

I am in the process of applying to join the Primary Reserves and was discussing with my wife the requirements for being a member and a question came up that I could answer.

"When was the last time the Primary Reserve faced obligatory service?"

I can take some educated guests from my history classes in University (WWII, possibly Korea, FLQ Crisis) but am not sure where to start a look for that kind of info.

Any leads from the history buffs out there?

Thanks.