Parental Leave

[Str1k3r]

My wife is 17 weeks pregnant and I am on PAT platoon awaiting SQ. I am wondering if anyone has any information on parental leave such as how the process is done and also when I am eligible to start my leave in relation to her due date which is July 2nd.

 

[dangerboy]

My suggestion is to write a memo outllining all the information that you have and give it to your PAT chain of Comd.  They then will be able to advise you.  If you are unsure on how to write a memo do a search there is a thread with example memo somewhere.

 

[Str1k3r]

Thanks for the info. I've been on PAT for a while and I've gotten quite good at writing memos. I'll definitely write one up and send it up the chain

 

[captloadie]

This a very interesting question, and I am interested in how it turns out. Normally a member only gets to begin official parental leave (LWOP on EI), after the baby is born. Unlike the PS, there is no authorized leave on the books for the actual birth. The CoC normally will give some kind of short leave, or allow you to take one or two "sick days" , but then it is either LWOP or annual. All that being said, the training system is a different beast.

On a related topic, has anyone ever heard of someone getting denied parental leave? 

 

[beach_bum]

You can not take parental leave prior to the birth of the baby. 

Something else to note that many people misunderstand is that both parents can not take parental leave.  It can be split, but both parents do not get the full time off.  I have had several members try to tell me that the wife is taking the year off from a civy job (with EI benefits) and they are going to take the parental as well.  This doesn't work. 

 

[Occam]

You can not take parental leave prior to the birth of the baby. 

Something else to note that many people misunderstand is that both parents can not take parental leave.  It can be split, but both parents do not get the full time off.  I have had several members try to tell me that the wife is taking the year off from a civy job (with EI benefits) and they are going to take the parental as well.  This doesn't work.

Quite a few seem to be unaware that only the mother can take maternity leave (15 weeks), while either or both of the parents can take a total of 35 weeks (combined) for parental leave.

I'm told Quebec has different rules for the father - he gets time specifically allocated to the father, although I don't know how much.

 

[gcclarke]

Parental leave, much like annual leave is an entitlement. While a commanding officer can either defer the start of your parental leave, or order you to return from parental leave, for "imperative military requirements", doing so does not cause you to lose the leave you're entitled to. However, only in the latter case does it extend the 52 week window after the birth / adoption of the child in which you are required to use up your parental leave.

QR&O Chapter 16.

 

[Biohazardxj]

It is true that Parental leave cannot start until the child is born.  However the start date can be deferred, keeping in mind that it must be completed prior the child's first birthday.

 

[Str1k3r]

I have two quick questions... First thing is that since my wife is a "stay at home mom" would I be entitled to the full amount of parental leave? If so what is the approximate amount of time allotted? My stupid question of the day would be since I am going on leave in July and possibly not returning until the next fiscal year would I have to take my allotted annual leave before my parental leave takes effect?

 

[Occam]

I have two quick questions... First thing is that since my wife is a "stay at home mom" would I be entitled to the full amount of parental leave? If so what is the approximate amount of time allotted?

As the father, you would get 37 weeks parental leave (total, combined between both spouses).  The other 15 weeks are maternity benefits and are only available to the mother.

My stupid question of the day would be since I am going on leave in July and possibly not returning until the next fiscal year would I have to take my allotted annual leave before my parental leave takes effect?

Yes.  You would be expected to exhaust any annual leave remaining.  However, you would only have 8 days (assuming you went on leave in July), because I believe you don't earn any while on parental leave.

 

[Str1k3r]

Thank You for your reply... Gives me a good idea of what to expect.

 

[TimBit]

I live in Quebec and just got off parental, but not as a Reg Force soldier though...

In Quebec, there are 5 weeks of father only-leave, 15 weeks of mother-only leave and 32 weeks of parental leave, to be taken by either parents. That is the part of the cake you slice as you wish, with the 5 weeks only for the father.

During that time, you are topped up at 93% by the CF on top of your provincial allocations.

 

[CountDC]

You do not earn leave while on PATA but if you return to work in March you will have 2 days to use up.  Just something to take into account along with all the other planning.

Don't forget that PATA plays havoc with your income tax and pension payments.  In the old days we could hold a balance on your pay account to cover the pension but they no longer allow us to hold a balance.  You can either bank some money and pay the pension amount in full when you return to work or you can request it to be taken from your pay monthly.  For income tax take into account that EI will only take taxes out based on your EI payments and DND will only take taxes based on their payments.  This usually means that your income tax will be underpaid when you file and the taxman will look for money.  My last PATA left me with a tax bill of just over $1k if memory serves.  Hoping my PATA  coming up doesn't leave me in the same situation as I have more  tax deductions.

 

[Celticgirl]

As the father, you would get 37 weeks parental leave (total, combined between both spouses).  The other 15 weeks are maternity benefits and are only available to the mother.

That combined part is only if she is also a CF member. If she's not, the father can take the full 37 weeks himself at any point in the child's first year of life.

However, you would only have 8 days (assuming you went on leave in July), because I believe you don't earn any while on parental leave.

Correct.

 

[Occam]

That combined part is only if she is also a CF member. If she's not, the father can take the full 37 weeks himself at any point in the child's first year of life.

Huh?

It doesn't matter if she's a CF member, a bricklayer, or an orthodontist.  If she has a job, the parents can only take 37 weeks leave between them, total.  If she's not working, the father can take the entire 37 weeks, but it's still a shared benefit between the parents - hence "parental" leave.

 

[Celticgirl]

Huh?

It doesn't matter if she's a CF member, a bricklayer, or an orthodontist.  If she has a job, the parents can only take 37 weeks leave between them, total.  If she's not working, the father can take the entire 37 weeks, but it's still a shared benefit between the parents - hence "parental" leave.

Just clarifying for the OP. I disagree slightly with your post. If she is not a CF member, he can take the 37 weeks himself. It does not matter what her non-military job is. They don't share in that case. He gets the full 37 weeks, assuming he wants it. If she *is* a CF member, the 37 weeks is divided between them however they like. One of them can take the full 37 weeks, but that would leave the other with 0.

 

[CountDC]

Celticgirl - hope the 3's is going good and Borden is not poisoning you too much.

You are mistaken on the 37 weeks split issue.  It does not matter if she is military or not.  If she works at Timmies and takes 10 week then he can only get the remaining 27 weeks.  Has nothing to do with military policies, this is a EI policy so is the same for all regardless of where they work. PATA is shared between the spouses.

 

[Celticgirl]

Celticgirl - hope the 3's is going good and Borden is not poisoning you too much.

You are mistaken on the 37 weeks split issue.  It does not matter if she is military or not.  If she works at Timmies and takes 10 week then he can only get the remaining 27 weeks.  Has nothing to do with military policies, this is a EI policy so is the same for all regardless of where they work. PATA is shared between the spouses.

The 3's is going well, but your post had me confused as we had not covered the EI issue in class. We were only told that if one parent is CF and the other is not, the CF member can take the whole PATA allowance himself/herself. I would like to ask my instructors about what you said above, but they are not available at the moment (and I'm impatient ), so I went on a pub search to find the answer.

I found it in the MHRRP:

3. Father/mother is a CF mbr.
Civilian spouse eligible for EI
2 weeks may be served by either parent
15 weeks for mother (MATA)
35 weeks can be shared by the parents (PATA)

4. Father is a CF mbr.
civilian spouse (mother) not eligible for EI
2 weeks served by the father.
nil
35 weeks taken by father (PATA)

Source: http://hr.dwan.dnd.ca/DHRIM/mhrrp/Ch17/engraph/ch17_e.pdf

Thanks for the clarification. Good info to know! I'll be passing this along to my course mates as well.  8)

 

[CountDC]

The 2 weeks they mention is the two week waiting period EI imposes in which you will receive no money from them.  Not a concern for members of the CF as our employer pays us 93% of our pay for those 2 weeks.  The other 35 weeks we receive payments from EI and a top up from the CF. 

The way things work (at least last time) I ended up with more take home pay each month but owed for pension and taxes so had to plan accordingly.  For some reason they do not allow our pension payments to continue while on PATA which is a pain - much easier for us if it was instead of remembering to squirrel it away while dealing with a new baby.

I'm scenario 2 starting April/May again.  Really like the PATA leave other than it would be nice if I could start it a month prior to due date.

 

[Zoomie]

It would also be nice if the PATA top-up by the CF was an automated system, vice having to be manually entered each month.  They forgot to pay me one month - luckily I noticed and got a cheque issued by the cashier.