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... and there is very little similarity between the Arselanian issue and Plourde's issue. In fact, I would go so far as to say there are no similarities.
Plourde blames military for his decision to resign
- Thread starter formerarmybrat23
- Start date
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I would also caution 3rd Horseman to chose his words wisely. His insinuations regarding Faye Tidd are uncalled for and border on libelous. Vern is correct. Faye Tidd is very dedicated to the Town of Oromocto. As Vern can likely attest, I too have known her for many many years and count her as a friend of my family.
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GAP said:
Nope. Mel Vance was elected to a public office by Canadian taxpayers. He also happens to serve in the CF. Nothing wrong with that. These are not facts that are unknown to the community, the council or the CF and are publicly available.
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Olga Chekhova said:
On the issue we are talking about (the interference of the Comd staff in day to day activities on town council of military members) the issues are very similar.
Olga - we could have a whole separate thread on pro/ con on the mayors seat and issue in Oromocto over the past 20 years. I too have known her for 20 years and don't hold the same view that's what a democracy is. She got the votes and obviously impressed you with what she said and promised. I am not easily lead and she has disappointed me in all three terms she has held. I was disappointed not for the main issues that she achieved for any mayor would have achieved it during her term. It was the back door patronage deals that occurred and the lack of support for the military council members who ran against the Comdrs wishes for the betterment of the residents.
- Reaction score
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3rd Horseman said:
Give me a break. They are not. Vatche tried to have his posting changed...it didn't happen. He tried then for a 'compassionate' status and it didn't happen. He was told to report to his new place of duty. He refused.
He used his posn on council to take the CFs refusal to the media. His actions did that. Then the military stepped in. That is not interferance by the CF...it was them stepping in AFTER Vatche had repeatedly refused to acknowledge that his primary responsibility of duty was to the CF and to report to the posns they posted him to. He WAS AWOL. There is NO correlation between the two incidents.
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I am not talking about the posting issue that is and was the red herring to the real problem. I'm talking about the interference in the duties as councilor. As I said the posting issue was not the real issue. That is why he got such a large money payoff from the CF over the issue. Same with Capt P the issue is not his slip of the tongue on the news, its bigger than that.
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Vern:
You know what they say about wrestling with pigs? You just get dirty and the pigs like it. 3rd Horseman has his opinion and providing him with facts is not going to change a thing.
3rd Horseman:
You are absolutely right. I was absolutely wrong. I am clearly uninformed about democratic principles and far more easily swayed by savvy politicos like Ms. Tidd. Moreover, unlike your good self, I am incapable of detecting corruption and graft.
Happy? Will you now stop speaking on topics as the font of all knowledge when you clearly have no first hand knowledge? :
You know what they say about wrestling with pigs? You just get dirty and the pigs like it. 3rd Horseman has his opinion and providing him with facts is not going to change a thing.
3rd Horseman:
You are absolutely right. I was absolutely wrong. I am clearly uninformed about democratic principles and far more easily swayed by savvy politicos like Ms. Tidd. Moreover, unlike your good self, I am incapable of detecting corruption and graft.
Happy? Will you now stop speaking on topics as the font of all knowledge when you clearly have no first hand knowledge? :
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:rofl:
A
aesop081
Guest
3rd Horseman said:
:
Back to your old tricks i see
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People,People, What happened to Capt. Plourde?
This thread took a turn somewhere. To try a get this thread back on track, I ask this.
If Capt.Plourde had broken one of the rules of being a Municipal Councillor, would his treatment have been any different?
This thread took a turn somewhere. To try a get this thread back on track, I ask this.
If Capt.Plourde had broken one of the rules of being a Municipal Councillor, would his treatment have been any different?
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Quite likely it would have been, a politician makes a slip they just outright appologize for it, lay low for a week or two (or until the media frenzy blows over) and then it's back to life as we know it. Capt Plourde has now used the press to demean his CoC full stop. As an officer he must know all to well that he has to keep those two lives seperate, his first obligation is to the Canadian Forces. In his statements he violates many principles that we hold dear. Firstly Insubordination (in the press no less) should be no surprise that ones coming (like 3rd horseman said might have needed to be said but take your licks like a man). Secondly Loyalty up and down, not real loyal to be slamming the military you serve in the press, either to the institution, his superiors, or his subordinates. And Service before Self, it seems from his statements he is more concerned about vindicating his own feelings of wrongdoing than his dedication the to service. If he wants to complain, we have an ombudsman, the press just makes things nasty.
Weinie
Army.ca Veteran
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This is not capt Plourde's first dust up with the C of C that he tried to resolve through the media. As a former Public Affairs Officer, Luc sometimes relied on the media too much to try to put pressure to resolve things without making sure he was on solid ground. For those who know Luc, and I have for 15 years, he is passionate, but stubborn. The two traits have sometimes led him into where, on old mariners charts, it was declaimed "Here be monsters."
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Folks,
A reminder what Vatche Arslanian did or didn't do has nothing to do with this conversation and I think we can let a fallen former member rest in peace.
Thanks
A reminder what Vatche Arslanian did or didn't do has nothing to do with this conversation and I think we can let a fallen former member rest in peace.
Thanks
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By GILLIAN CHRISTIE
from the post gazette
http://www.canadaeast.com/weeklies/postgazette/20070428/A01.pdf - sprry for the formating
from the post gazette
http://www.canadaeast.com/weeklies/postgazette/20070428/A01.pdf - sprry for the formating
This Week
Oromocto town council remains a
group of five following the resignation
of Luc Plourde at the April 19 regular
session of council.
A military Captain based at CFB Gagetown,
Plourde was elected as a councillor
in Ward 4 in the 2004 election.
Following a Summary Trial two weeks
ago at CFB Gagetown, where Plourde
was found guilty of insulting a superior
officer and was reprimanded, he said he
has also learned he is currently under
investigation for two more similar incidents.
“In passing judgment upon me, General
Parsons wanted to send a clear
message to me and others, his sentence
for my crime: a simple reprimand. No
$4,500 fine. No severe reprimand. No
immediate release from the [Canadian
Forces]. In fact, the General refused to
accept many of the arguments against
me,” Plourde said in his statement to
council just before he resigned.
“I was locked in a very bitter and
shameful battle against a select few
‘band of criminals’. I make this sarcastic
remark because in my 18 years plus
in the military, I have never witnessed
such a disgusting and shameful performance
as was displayed by two Lieutenant-
Colonels of the Canadian Armed
Forces.”
Military rules state that a member
may hold public office so long as they
not identify him or herself as being a
member of the Armed Forces while performing
municipal duties.
Plourde said all of the difficulty he
has faced has come directly from his
service to the town in a councillor capacity.
He said he has been threatened by
his superiors and said he is no longer
able to perform municipal duties safely
and without fear of reprisals.
“If you are not aware, all of my battles
with these officers were directly related
to my official duties as town councillor
for Ward 4 and [it is] my determination
to no longer allow unelected military
officers [to] abuse their office and position
to try to control the actions of military
councillors,” Plourde said.
“I want to make it clear, in my three
years as councillor, I always put the interests
of the community and citizens
ahead of my own personal interests and,
unfortunately, I have paid a very high
personal cost,” he said.
“I have lost my job, my career, my
health, my family and my reputation
over this criminal conduct.”
With this sixth council seat now vacant,
it is too late for the municipality to
have a by-election. The deadline for the
term has passed. The last by-election
registration took place on April 20, only
one day after Plourde’s resignation.
“We haven’t officially reported it because
we have to take it to council and
accept his resignation and it was even
too late at the time the resignation
came in for us to call for a by-election,”
Mayor Fay Tidd said.
“We’ll have to get by with five councillors,”
she said. “We don’t have a
choice.”
“It’s made it awkward but it’s one of
those things you have to deal with every
now and again,” Tidd said. “You just do
your best.”
Oromocto town council remains a
group of five following the resignation
of Luc Plourde at the April 19 regular
session of council.
A military Captain based at CFB Gagetown,
Plourde was elected as a councillor
in Ward 4 in the 2004 election.
Following a Summary Trial two weeks
ago at CFB Gagetown, where Plourde
was found guilty of insulting a superior
officer and was reprimanded, he said he
has also learned he is currently under
investigation for two more similar incidents.
“In passing judgment upon me, General
Parsons wanted to send a clear
message to me and others, his sentence
for my crime: a simple reprimand. No
$4,500 fine. No severe reprimand. No
immediate release from the [Canadian
Forces]. In fact, the General refused to
accept many of the arguments against
me,” Plourde said in his statement to
council just before he resigned.
“I was locked in a very bitter and
shameful battle against a select few
‘band of criminals’. I make this sarcastic
remark because in my 18 years plus
in the military, I have never witnessed
such a disgusting and shameful performance
as was displayed by two Lieutenant-
Colonels of the Canadian Armed
Forces.”
Military rules state that a member
may hold public office so long as they
not identify him or herself as being a
member of the Armed Forces while performing
municipal duties.
Plourde said all of the difficulty he
has faced has come directly from his
service to the town in a councillor capacity.
He said he has been threatened by
his superiors and said he is no longer
able to perform municipal duties safely
and without fear of reprisals.
“If you are not aware, all of my battles
with these officers were directly related
to my official duties as town councillor
for Ward 4 and [it is] my determination
to no longer allow unelected military
officers [to] abuse their office and position
to try to control the actions of military
councillors,” Plourde said.
“I want to make it clear, in my three
years as councillor, I always put the interests
of the community and citizens
ahead of my own personal interests and,
unfortunately, I have paid a very high
personal cost,” he said.
“I have lost my job, my career, my
health, my family and my reputation
over this criminal conduct.”
With this sixth council seat now vacant,
it is too late for the municipality to
have a by-election. The deadline for the
term has passed. The last by-election
registration took place on April 20, only
one day after Plourde’s resignation.
“We haven’t officially reported it because
we have to take it to council and
accept his resignation and it was even
too late at the time the resignation
came in for us to call for a by-election,”
Mayor Fay Tidd said.
“We’ll have to get by with five councillors,”
she said. “We don’t have a
choice.”
“It’s made it awkward but it’s one of
those things you have to deal with every
now and again,” Tidd said. “You just do
your best.”
- Reaction score
- 6,300
- Points
- 1,360
“I was locked in a very bitter and shameful battle against a select few‘band of criminals’. I make this sarcastic
remark because in my 18 years plusin the military, I have never witnessed such a disgusting and shameful performance
as was displayed by two Lieutenant-Colonels of the Canadian Armed F orces.”
Please tell me he has legal representation close-by.......
remark because in my 18 years plusin the military, I have never witnessed such a disgusting and shameful performance
as was displayed by two Lieutenant-Colonels of the Canadian Armed F orces.”
Please tell me he has legal representation close-by.......
Bottom line is I can see where he is comming from. Some times the COC will try to sway local goverment with tactics that are not always in the best interest of everybody. But in their own.
Is this the case here? I do not know. But I can see where being an officer and being a council member could be a very difficult position to be in at a small community.
High ranking officers in the CF have for a long time tried to pull rank in locla communties so to speak in the outcomes of projects. Some times this has lead to great things for a commuinity, at other times it has lead them down the road of poor relationships.
Did this officer do his job in the best interest of the town? Did he do his work in the best interest of the Military?
In both cases I think not.
A military member should not become part of a goverment council, be it local, provincial, or federal. It can lead to many problems as seen here.
Unfortunatly I can see no good to come of this on either side of the discussion. Did he make a descsion that the Cols did not like in reguards to the town? During that process did the Cols try to intimidate him into changing his position on the situation?
Did he react properly? Did he refer the matter to the MP's on the base for a conflict of interest by his superiors?
At the end of the Day I am more then sure that he did what he thought was in the best interest of the town and the Military. Why he quit over the whole situation will hopefully come out in court or some other means.
Is this the case here? I do not know. But I can see where being an officer and being a council member could be a very difficult position to be in at a small community.
High ranking officers in the CF have for a long time tried to pull rank in locla communties so to speak in the outcomes of projects. Some times this has lead to great things for a commuinity, at other times it has lead them down the road of poor relationships.
Did this officer do his job in the best interest of the town? Did he do his work in the best interest of the Military?
In both cases I think not.
A military member should not become part of a goverment council, be it local, provincial, or federal. It can lead to many problems as seen here.
Unfortunatly I can see no good to come of this on either side of the discussion. Did he make a descsion that the Cols did not like in reguards to the town? During that process did the Cols try to intimidate him into changing his position on the situation?
Did he react properly? Did he refer the matter to the MP's on the base for a conflict of interest by his superiors?
At the end of the Day I am more then sure that he did what he thought was in the best interest of the town and the Military. Why he quit over the whole situation will hopefully come out in court or some other means.
Of course there are two sides of the story. Are both sides equal to blame here. I would think so.
Both sides more then likely made a few mistakes. Did this mean he had to resign from the Military, of course not, He could have asked for a transfer due to conflict of interest.
The question now is, will he sue for damages for his benifits. If so then will they give them to him. If they do then there would have been some level of hush hush that we do not hear about.
Both sides more then likely made a few mistakes. Did this mean he had to resign from the Military, of course not, He could have asked for a transfer due to conflict of interest.
The question now is, will he sue for damages for his benifits. If so then will they give them to him. If they do then there would have been some level of hush hush that we do not hear about.
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