promotions and time frame

[mack333]

I was just wondering.  How long does it take the average guy in the military to become a Sargeant?

 

[Roy Harding]

When I first got in, a bunch of us Privates were sitting around discussing this very topic.

The RSM overheard us - and delivered this little speech:

"Most of you little twits are going to be lucky to see more than ONE promotion - some of you will be extremely lucky and see two or three.  One of you may see the miracle of receiving six promotions.  That's all that's possible in this Army, unless you CFR.  If you're basing your happiness on promotions, most of you will only be happy once or twice in your careers, which is a lousy way to spend a life - think about that."

I thought about it.  And took it to heart.  I set myself to get the most satisfaction I could out of each rank I found myself in.  And I was happy far more often than the four promotions I did receive might indicate.

The others here have pointed out that this is a question impossible to answer.  It depends on your trade, your element, your postings, your opportunities to "show your stuff" - amongst many other factors.  Don't worry about it - just be the best damned Pte/Cpl/MCpl you can be, discover the immense satisfaction possible in each rank, and if one day you are promoted to Sgt - do the same in that rank, without worrying about how fast you can get to WO.

Good luck to you - enjoy yourself.

 

[Stupor]

Thanks for sharing that insightful quote, Mr. Harding. I will take it to heart.

As for the original question, take a look at the appropriate CFAOs:
http://www.admfincs.forces.gc.ca/admfincs/subjects/cfao/049-05_e.asp (Reserve NCMs)
For non-musician trades, it takes a minimum of 6 years to become sergeant.

http://www.admfincs.forces.gc.ca/admfincs/subjects/cfao/049-04_e.asp (Reg Force NCMs)
For non-musician, dental and Mar Eng (no idea what this is), it takes a minimum of ~11 years to become sergeant.

Note that these are the minimum time requirements. An excellent soldier in a unit that is short on talent may be promoted as soon as s/he reaches 6 years (or even earlier under accelerated promotion, as noted in the two CFAOs). In units with a glut of leadership, the sergeant track would be more congested and people would have to wait longer. Note also that sergeant is not just a time-in rank. Some people never become sergeants, either because they do not possess the leadership potential or they do not want the responsibility that comes with being senior leadership (whether the latter indicates the former is debatable).

 

[aesop081]

In units with a glut of leadership, the sergeant track would be more congested and people would have to wait longer.

Speaking for the regular force, your comment is not entirely true.  If a member has been selected for promotion and no position for that rank is vacant at the member's unit, He/She will most likely be posted to another unit with a vacant position at that rank level.

 

[Stupor]

Speaking for the regular force, your comment is not entirely true.  If a member has been selected for promotion and no position for that rank is vacant at the member's unit, He/She will most likely be posted to another unit with a vacant position at that rank level.

Thank you for pointing that out. I speak as a reservist with only 2 years in, so any clarification of the actual time frame for promotions (i.e. not purely CFAO-based speculations) from those with real world experience would be appreciated.

 

[medicineman]

Thank you for pointing that out. I speak as a reservist with only 2 years in, so any clarification of the actual time frame for promotions (i.e. not purely CFAO-based speculations) from those with real world experience would be appreciated.

It's not merely CFAO based "speculation" - there are minimum time in rank requirements before promotion.  It also varies with MOS - some have more vacancies or move faster than others due to attrition and others move slower due to freezes or no vacancies.  I took 16 years to get to Sgt - partly because there was a state in my trade where we were promoting very few Cpl's to MCpl a year (and of course I had a habit of telling people stuff they didn't want to hear - another story altogether).  Barring mishaps or complications, I'll have my crown at just about 20.  Let's not forget something else - Sgt isn't a "gimme" rank - you have to prove yourself and earn it.  I do believe that times in rank vary between the Reg Force and PRes though - at least it did when I was a Reservist many years back.  However, it still isn't a gimme - there are career Cpl's even in the Reserves.

MM

 

[dimsum]

http://www.admfincs.forces.gc.ca/admfincs/subjects/cfao/049-04_e.asp (Reg Force NCMs)
For non-musician, dental and Mar Eng (no idea what this is), it takes a minimum of ~11 years to become sergeant.

Just an aside, MAR ENG refers to Marine Engineering Mechanic.

 

[armyvern]

Thanks for sharing that insightful quote, Mr. Harding. I will take it to heart.

As for the original question, take a look at the appropriate CFAOs:
http://www.admfincs.forces.gc.ca/admfincs/subjects/cfao/049-05_e.asp (Reserve NCMs)
For non-musician trades, it takes a minimum of 6 years to become sergeant.

http://www.admfincs.forces.gc.ca/admfincs/subjects/cfao/049-04_e.asp (Reg Force NCMs)
For non-musician, dental and Mar Eng (no idea what this is), it takes a minimum of ~11 years to become sergeant.

Note that these are the minimum time requirements. An excellent soldier in a unit that is short on talent may be promoted as soon as s/he reaches 6 years (or even earlier under accelerated promotion, as noted in the two CFAOs). In units with a glut of leadership, the sergeant track would be more congested and people would have to wait longer. Note also that sergeant is not just a time-in rank. Some people never become sergeants, either because they do not possess the leadership potential or they do not want the responsibility that comes with being senior leadership (whether the latter indicates the former is debatable).

>

Is it just me or does anyone else find it amusing that a member with 2 years in is professing to advise a former Chief Clerk about min TIR reqs for promotion?

Read some more threads young 'un. 1 accelerated promotion in your career -- that's it ... and you must be deserving of it and be recommended and approved for it by your CoC.

Cpl isn't even a gimme for everyone these days in the Reg F. I see evidence of that daily right down the hall from me. 5 years and counting now.

You have to earn promotions. And even if you make it to the top of your merit list to become #1 (the next in line), there needs to be a position OPEN for that rank for them to promote you into. In the RegF, it's a little easier -- that's why pers find themselves "promoted & posted" if no spots are available locally. There's a new CANFORGEN out as well and that promotion is contingent upon the member RFD at that new location.

By the same token, as noted by others previously -- some trades went through a spell where there were ZERO promotion years back to back to back. And it just didn't matter if you were #1 on your merit list or not -- ZERO promotions means -- zero promotions.  I know -- I was one of them.

But then, all of a sudden, if the release rate in your trade picks up ... one may find themselves promoted to the next rank with the min TIR again and again and again, but, they still had to make it to the top of their merit list to do so. I also know a RegF Cpl with 24 years in -- not by their own personal choice either. 

The CFAOs are never speculation. They are just the "minimum" requisites ...

 

[Stupor]

>

Is it just me or does anyone else find it amusing that a member with 2 years in is professing to advise a former Chief Clerk about min TIR reqs for promotion?.

Heh. I assume the former Chief Clerk in question is Mr. Harding, not mack333.

I was simply trying to give some general guidelines that I can infer from CFAOs. It was not meant to "advise" Mr. Harding on any level. Mr. Harding shared a very helpful and insightful quote, which is that excessive focus on promotion time frame is not productive, without giving hard fact. Since mac333 wanted some hard facts, I tried to give them as best as I can, given the limitations of my knowledge as 2-year-in reservist. What little I know is of course insufficient to qualify me to advise people as experienced as Mr. Harding, but it should be helpful to visitors (which I assume mack333, a member with very few posts here, is). By giving the facts, I was NOT trying to say "Mr. Harding here doesn't know anything about promotions, so let me, a two-year-in reservist, tell you". ;D

I do indeed have much more to learn as a young 'un. Thanks for sharing what you know.

 

[Nfld Sapper]

Here's a story, I got 8+ years in the Reserves and just made MCpl this year and it wasn't for the lack of trying. So like Vern said promotions are not guaranteed.

 

[X-mo-1979]

Ive got 7 years in the regs.I will get my Mcpl here shortly.
I have a friend who was a sgt in 9 years.

As recent as 6 years ago it was unheard of in my trade.12 years was the normal,16 not unheard of.It will slow down again in a few years,when all the older guys are out.However once they/we start retiring it will open up again.

All depends mostly on the baby boomers retiring.

Reservisit I dont quite understand how they get promoted as I didnt think they got PER's or had merit boards.I can say however that a guy I went on tour with a 3 years ago was a cpl without a PLQ and is now a sgt.

 

[Blackadder1916]

I was just wondering.  How long does it take the average guy in the military to become a Sargeant?

Often the average guy doesn't, you have to be better than average.

 

[Nfld Sapper]

I know that in my unit the 2 year TIR (min) is strictly enforced.

Reservist I don't quite understand how they get promoted as I didn't think they got PER's or had merit boards.I can say however that a guy I went on tour with a 3 years ago was a cpl without a PLQ and is now a Sgt.

Well we do get PER's after summer taskings, and we do have semiannual and annual evaluations. Also if you can get away and do the course will get promoted faster.

As for the guy you knew on tour maybe when he got back he was loaded on a PLQ course and assuming that he had more than 2 years as a Cpl then was immediately appointed to MCpl and the next year he went away and did his 6A's .... bamn.... Sgt in 3 years.

 

[George Wallace]

Pte's don't usually get PERs.  Therefore there would be none, in the majority of cases, to put forward for promotions to Cpl. 

 

[armyvern]

Here's a story, I got 8+ years in the Reserves and just made MCpl this year and it wasn't for the lack of trying. So like Vern said promotions are not guaranteed.

I think I may know why it took you so long ...

"Can not read route cards."  >

If you read a map or a route card as "well" (I use the term loosely!!) as you managed to follow that map out to my cottage May 24 weekend ...

>

(Crap ... my beer was warm when I got back from hunting you down!!)

 

[Nfld Sapper]

I think I may know why it took you so long ...

"Can not read route cards."  >

If you read a map or a route card as "well" (I use the term loosely!!) as you managed to follow that map out to my cottage May 24 weekend ...

>

(Crap ... my beer was warm when I got back from hunting you down!!)

Doh! Told you to keep that on the down low there Vern.  >

Now where did I put that route card to your house  ;D

 

[Rowshambow]

I was lucky, In my trade, the ranks opened up quickly. I was 10 years from TQ3 to Sgt, then I CFR'd! Oh, thats Reg force time too! I have some friends that were promoted today to Sgt who have been in the Military for about 9 years, and another promoted today who has 18 years! The latter got stuck in that rut in the early to mid 90's! Some of you might remember it as the Promotion freeze!