Questions & Advice about work out routine.

[Jarnhamar]

I'm taking another crack at a work out schedule again and just looking for some feedback and advice.  Goals are to increase running/rucking and put on some  (a lot of) upper body size and power. (More chin ups push ups pull ups and bench press). Not interested in being toned/looks.

I'm working out twice a day.
In the am running 4 days a week (5km, 9km and a slow 16km&21km) and rucking 1 day,  6 to 12 km with 75-84 lbs weight.

In the PM I'm torn between doing P90X and straight weights.  (I know there was one P90x thread here but it turned to shit). I like doing P90X but I have a feeling for larger size and power weights are the way to go?

And regarding a weight routine a question.
Is it better to isolate muscle groups? For example Day 1 back and biceps, day 2 chest and triceps, 3 shoulders and arms, 4 legs and abs?  etc..?

I ask because I was looking thought the JTF2 Selection fitness manual (for some ideas) and it has  in one evening, for example, the person doing upperbody and lower body with an ab workout. When I looked at the 4 various upper body routines it has each of the 4 routines with a little bit of everything.
Routine 1- Bench press, lat pull downs, back extentions, shoulder press, triceps extentions, bicep curls + ab work out.

It makes me wonder why they are not isolating muscle groups and why they suggest working everything. Is it safe to assume it's because for someone to be actually following their fitness manual that the person is already in incredible shape and the routines are designed as maintenance of what's already there with some improvement overall instead of building muscle being the main focus?

 

[Nostix]

If you want to build size and power in your upper body, weights are the way to go. Don't isolate small muscle groups, it's not an efficient way to reach your stated goals. Heavy weight, lower (5-8) rep sets. Make sure to balance your training. IE: match a horizontal push (Bench Press), with a horizontal pull (Inverted or barbell rows). Match a vertical pull (Chin-ups) with a vertical push (Press).

Make sure to eat enough, and get plenty of rest. Lots of running and heavy weight training is incredibly taxing on your body. If you find that the work-load is messing with your recovery times, try to scale back on one or the other.

Edit: I realize my reply was rather brief, but I'm making an effort to only give solid general principles so that this doesn't turn into an argument about specific routines.

 

[Jarnhamar]

Thanks for the reply Nostix.
Gonna PM you about your ideas on a routine.

How does eating enough factor in to weight training if you are on a reduced calorie diet? 
I started watching my calorie intake (With an Iphone ap "lose it") and recorded what i was taking in for food and using in exercise. Before hand I was probably taking in 3000+ calories a day with all the junk and shit. Now I'm budgeting for 1700 calories a day (+food -exercise) and in 12 days I dropped 13 pounds and it's continuing to drop.  (Should note I cut out Sugar, pop, fast food, dairy, reduced breads). I'm sure that's not THAT healthy but I'm figuring that first chuck is just fat and crap that I'm loosing, it'll slow down.

Still, I've upped the amount of protein I'm taking in quite a bit, do you think I'll still gain sized with the reduced calorie intake?

 

[Nostix]

Are you specifically trying to lose weight? 13 pounds in 12 days is a lot of weight to be dropping so fast.

Yes, a restricted calorie diet will have an effect on your weight training. Losing weight and putting on muscle are opposing goals. The two will almost never happen simultaneously. You need to be running a caloric surplus to build muscle mass. The good news, however, is that you can still get stronger on a reduced calorie diet. You can lose fat and increase your strength quite effectively, just don't expect a huge size difference.

If you want to lose weight, just make sure that you're eating at a reasonable calorie deficit. With the amount of work you say you're going to be doing, it would be very easy to underestimate your food needs, and start handicapping your progress. Again, you need to balance your goal of weight loss with the need to fully feed your muscles so that they can recover.

 

[wildman0101]

Grim,
:
Cheer's

 

[Mike92]

Nostix is right. If youre training for real world-strength and power for the military, you should be doing heavy compound movements. If youre training for mass, then feel free to throw in some isolation work.