RC Manager Delegation fo Authorities

[Lumber]

My authorities as RC Administrator have been designated to me by my RC Manager.

If my RC Manager's qualifications (EMC, CSPS) lapse, he will no longer be able to exercise his own signing authority. This is pretty clear.

However, should this happen, do the people he has designated as RC Administrators all lose their signing authorities until the RC Manager re-certifies?

The FAM doesn't cover this particular scenario very well.

Cheers

 

[George Wallace]

My authorities as RC Administrator have been designated to me by my RC Manager.

If my RC Manager's qualifications (EMC, CSPS) lapse, he will no longer be able to exercise his own signing authority. This is pretty clear.

However, should this happen, do the people he has designated as RC Administrators all lose their signing authorities until the RC Manager re-certifies?

The FAM doesn't cover this particular scenario very well.

Cheers

I suppose you could look at it as a similar case to where the RC Manager is replaced on posting by a new RC Manager.  Would you as a RC Administrator lose your signing authority in the interim?  There has to be some need for continuity.

 

[MJP]

I suppose you could look at it as a similar case to where the RC Manager is replaced on posting by a new RC Manager.  Would you as a RC Administrator lose your signing authority in the interim?  There has to be some need for continuity.

That is apples and oranges in this case.  The change of an incumbent that delegates financial authority assumes that the incoming person is qualified and able to exercise their delegation.  That and the previous incumbent was fully qualified to delegate.  Those combined see that financial chain isn't broken and is allowable up to 8 weeks

FAM Chapter 1014-4-1 – Control of Financial Signing Authorities

35. When a superior leaves a position permanently, newly appointed superiors shall ensure that new forms are prepared as soon as possible and no later than eight weeks following their appointment.



In this case, if a person in a posn has a delegation and their crse expires than their DOA is invalid and ergo any delegation they have done is invalid until they rectify the issue.

FAM Chapter 1014-4-1 – Control of Financial Signing Authorities

29. Incumbents may only exercise authorities delegated to their position if they have the necessary knowledge and training to do so.   

&

Responsibilities of the Incumbent

b. Understanding the authorities and responsibilities he/she is authorized to exercise by way of the DoA form and maintaining up to date knowledge of applicable policy and procedures;
c. Certifying that he/she has the necessary knowledge and applicable training to exercise these authorities and maintaining valid training certifications as per the required training indicated in Annex A;
.

 

[Lumber]

That is apples and oranges in this case.  The change of an incumbent that delegates financial authority assumes that the incoming person is qualified and able to exercise their delegation.  That and the previous incumbent was fully qualified to delegate.  Those combined see that financial chain isn't broken and is allowable up to 8 weeks

FAM Chapter 1014-4-1 – Control of Financial Signing Authorities

35. When a superior leaves a position permanently, newly appointed superiors shall ensure that new forms are prepared as soon as possible and no later than eight weeks following their appointment.



In this case, if a person in a posn has a delegation and their crse expires than their DOA is invalid and ergo any delegation they have done is invalid until they rectify the issue.

FAM Chapter 1014-4-1 – Control of Financial Signing Authorities

29. Incumbents may only exercise authorities delegated to their position if they have the necessary knowledge and training to do so.   

&

Responsibilities of the Incumbent

b. Understanding the authorities and responsibilities he/she is authorized to exercise by way of the DoA form and maintaining up to date knowledge of applicable policy and procedures;
c. Certifying that he/she has the necessary knowledge and applicable training to exercise these authorities and maintaining valid training certifications as per the required training indicated in Annex A;
.

So, if my RC Manager's qualification lapses, our unit basically loses any ability to sign any financial documents until he rectifies the situation. Correct?

 

[DAA]

So, if my RC Manager's qualification lapses, our unit basically any ability to sign any financial documents until he rectifies the situation. Correct?

In an "Orwellian" world, you're technically correct.  However, even the Compt/RDAO people within your CoC recognize that this type of situation may occur from time to time, so they will exercise some discretion to allow for you to complete your day to day duties.  They aren't about to come out and cut you or anyone else off at the drop of a hat.  But they will get on the arse of the designated RC Manager to have them recertify and obtain current qualifications necessary to perform those functions.

 

[Lumber]

In an "Orwellian" world, you're technically correct.  However, even the Compt/RDAO people within your CoC recognize that this type of situation may occur from time to time, so they will exercise some discretion to allow for you to complete your day to day duties.  They aren't about to come out and cut you or anyone else off at the drop of a hat.  But they will get on the arse of the designated RC Manager to have them recertify and obtain current qualifications necessary to perform those functions.

Thanks again, DAA.

Sad that I have more confidence looking for answers to questions like these on here, then by trying to contact my RDAO, who's identity and location I am unaware of...

 

[DAA]

Sad that I have more confidence looking for answers to questions like these on here, then by trying to contact my RDAO, who's identity and location I am unaware of...

With time and experience, you'll some day know where to turn for your answers and it may not be here.  Army.ca is a good starting point, plenty of wealth and knowledge and opinions abound.  Nevertheless, it's always incumbent upon yourself to take this information and put it to good use but only after doing your homework.

You just need to find the right person in your area who is willing to not only entertain your questions but actually give you a hand in finding the answers.  That's how I learned, being on the receiving end of questions.   

 

[MJP]

So, if my RC Manager's qualification lapses, our unit basically loses any ability to sign any financial documents until he rectifies the situation. Correct?

Technically yes but as DAA pointed out it depends on the RDAO.  At the end of the day though if something goes through on an expired DOA it could be contracting irregularity and dependant on when it is caught has serious implications .

 

[Lumber]

Technically yes but as DAA pointed out it depends on the RDAO.  At the end of the day though if something goes through on an expired DOA it could be contracting irregularity and dependant on when it is caught has serious implications .

We don't do much contracting with the exception of ordering PP&S through Staples. Can't really screw that one up. Otherwise, the biggest issue is signing off Class-A pay (reserve unit), and approving travel.

 

[CountDC]

You could always send everything to the CO for approval.  I imagine once he/she is aware that everything financial will need to go to them until the RC Mgr completes the course that there would be some pressure applied. 

 

[MJP]

You could always send everything to the CO for approval.  I imagine once he/she is aware that everything financial will need to go to them until the RC Mgr completes the course that there would be some pressure applied.

The kicker on that is if they only have 1 cost center then the CO is suppose to be the RC Manager.

On that note a few years back I had to go get the CO to sign off on a $1.28 hose that was HPR. The Base Sup O's EMC expired the day previous and therefore all his pers under him didn't have valid DOAs.  He was redoing it that day but the hose was super ultra important and the entire world would have ended if it wasn't bought that morning, so off I went cap in hand to the CO. 

 

[Lumber]

The kicker on that is if they only have 1 cost center then the CO is suppose to be the RC Manager.

Yea, I didn't want to say it before, but there's only one RC Manager at my unit; the CO.

 

[CountDC]

For DOA the CO has Base Commander and other Equivalants (DND 2334). He can (and usually does) assign someone else as RC Mgr by approving their DOA.  As CO they still maintain ultimate authority on the finances but the RC Mgr does the day to day running of things.  happy to say I am no longer an RC Mgr as I was posted.  At a reserve unit the RC Mgr would normally be the Adjt, CC or Fin NCO depending on your staffing and bde/div policy so that you have someone full time taking care of the unit finances. 

 

[Lumber]

For DOA the CO has Base Commander and other Equivalants (DND 2334). He can (and usually does) assign someone else as RC Mgr by approving their DOA.  As CO they still maintain ultimate authority on the finances but the RC Mgr does the day to day running of things.  happy to say I am no longer an RC Mgr as I was posted.  At a reserve unit the RC Mgr would normally be the Adjt, CC or Fin NCO depending on your staffing and bde/div policy so that you have someone full time taking care of the unit finances.

Definitely not the way we've been doing things in NAVRES. The CO is the RC Mgr, the AdminO, TrgO, CC and SHO Sup are all RC Administrators. However, with regard to pay, and pay only, the AdminO is designated as the MPAO (military pay admin officer), with CC as Pay Manager, and only those two can sign off on pay documents.

 

[CountDC]

but does he actually function as an RC Mgr or is it just on paper.

 

[Oldgateboatdriver]

In my days, the CO of a Naval Reserve Unit certainly functioned as the RC Mgr. So much so, in fact that anything RC usually went straight up to him/her from the (then Unit's Supply Officer, now, I guess) Admin O without ever passing through the X.O's hands, who was completely out of the RC loop.

 

[DAA]

For DOA the CO has Base Commander and other Equivalants (DND 2334). He can (and usually does) assign someone else as RC Mgr by approving their DOA.  As CO they still maintain ultimate authority on the finances but the RC Mgr does the day to day running of things.  happy to say I am no longer an RC Mgr as I was posted.  At a reserve unit the RC Mgr would normally be the Adjt, CC or Fin NCO depending on your staffing and bde/div policy so that you have someone full time taking care of the unit finances.

You're not suppose to have more than one RC Manager against a Cost Centre, it just doesn't work that way anymore.  Anyone delegated these days, is usually done as an RC Adminstrator (ie; the day to day operations person).  RC Managers can only delegate spending authority "downwards" and no individual DoA item will be "equivalent" to what the RC Manager was originally authorized and will always be less.

I learned that one first hand, after being an RC Manager across 9 individual Cost Centres.  Then suddenly one year, I became an RC Admin and the CO was the only RC Mgr.  Never impacted on my day to day duties, it merely required me to obtain his personal approval on purchases over $5K.

 

[CountDC]

Correct and we didn't - CO's are that - CO's not RC Mgrs and have different authorities than RC Mgrs.  For example a CO can authorize travel on TD over 100km while an RC Mgr is restricted to travel of 100km or less.  If your CO does not have a DOA for Base Commander and Equivalants vice an RC Mgr DOA then who is approving the units travel over 100km as no one in the unit has the authority. There are other differences such as CO can write off debt, RC Mgrs can't, CO can write off material up to 250k, RC Mgrs are at 5k. 

We just went through a DMPAP Policy Compliance this year and the DOA's were done correctly.  CO's are ultimately responsible for all the unit finances but can designate someone as the RC Mgr. That RC Mgr can in turn assign RC Admins that perform certain parts for them such as 32/34 of Financial Documentation. 

 

[dapaterson]

Only non-NCR COs can auth travel over 100km; an NCR CO cannot.  They require the authority of the commander of a command to send anyone on TD over 100km.

Welcome to Ottawa...

 

[Lumber]

but does he actually function as an RC Mgr or is it just on paper.

Pretty much just on paper, but that's really dependant on which unit you are at.

At my unit, I've basically been delegated everything except travel approval, and even then my CO would probably be happy to give it to me if there wasn't a directive saying RC Managers shall not delegate travel authority.

Otherwise, I sign every financial related document at the unit, with the except of the budget. For procurement, I have some arcs of fire as to how much I can spend and what I can spend it on, and I always consult with the XO (DCO) whenever in doubt.

For matters of pay, however, the XO isn't in the loop at all. In fact, the CO's not even really in the loop either now that I think about it...