RCMP prevent attack - 10 Aug 2016

[GR66]

The driver is saying he was waiting for 5 minutes for Driver to come out.  The police could have arrived on scene just as the taxi was leaving and no chance to intercept him.

Even if they were there first how could they be certain that the cab wasn't an accomplice instead of a bystander?  Do you risk tipping the suspect off by approaching an unknown vehicle waiting for him?

 

[PuckChaser]

Even if they were there first how could they be certain that the cab wasn't an accomplice instead of a bystander?  Do you risk tipping the suspect off by approaching an unknown vehicle waiting for him?

That's a great point. He became an unknown actor at the point he stopped in the driveway, best case scenario, he ends up face down eating pavement and complaining how he was rough handled.

I'm sure the OPP investigation will shed some light, they'll have all the radio comms and decisions by incident commanders explained to them in far more detail than we'll ever see.

 

[PuckChaser]

I betcha he makes more money and gets more support than some CAF members who have been in much larger explosions in which they picked up their friend's body parts afterwards.

 

[Teager]

I can see why he's a bit upset with the police. Although the police eventually took him to the hospital to get him checked out someone dropped the ball a bit to make sure he was ok medically right away if what he says is true. This article also goes more into depth of what happened from the cab drivers perspective.

A victim of a terrorism attack, Duffield said he had to find his own way from the scene.

He got a ride from his boss’s son to the cab office to get his own car and drove home, Duffield said.

Later that evening, two police officers came to his door and told him the bomb squad advised he go to the hospital to check for internal injuries because of the explosion.

Police took him to hospital, stayed with him and brought him back home with no apparent internal injuries.

http://news.nationalpost.com/news/canada/the-police-put-my-life-in-jeopardy-cabbie-injured-in-aaron-driver-standoff-says

 

[Jarnhamar]

Even if they were there first how could they be certain that the cab wasn't an accomplice instead of a bystander?  Do you risk tipping the suspect off by approaching an unknown vehicle waiting for him?

I don't know, is it SOP to risk putting an innocent bystanders life at risk and giving the suspect a possible hostage?  What if Driver had the detonator and the car is the bomb?

Lots of conjecture of course. I'm just saying given what we do know in lieu of an explanation it seems like the cab driver has a pretty solid reason to be pissed off.

 

[The Bread Guy]

... best case scenario, he ends up face down eating pavement and complaining how he was rough handled.

I'm actually surprised that it sounds like he didn't get exactly that.

I'm the first to admit that we don't hear the whole story via the media, but if it's true the cab driver was left there in the driveway by police after the main threat was neutralized, he may have a case.  After all, am I wrong in thinking that in hostage rescue situations (which I realize this isn't), don't all hostages get some level of positive control until proven non-hostile?

We'll have to see/hear/read what we see/hear/read - and even then ...

 

[PuckChaser]

I'm actually surprised that it sounds like he didn't get exactly that.

I'm the first to admit that we don't hear the whole story via the media, but if it's true the cab driver was left there in the driveway by police after the main threat was neutralized, he may have a case.  After all, am I wrong in thinking that in hostage rescue situations (which I realize this isn't), don't all hostages get some level of positive control until proven non-hostile?

We'll have to see/hear/read what we see/hear/read - and even then ...

100% agree. There's some LEO pers on the board that might be able to offer some insight, but this was an ETF operation so those TTPs might not be readily available.

 

[Old Sweat]

We don't have all the story and this was an impromptu operation without time to set up a cordon and develop a plan to secure and evacuate any civilians in the area.

 

[mariomike]

The OPP has been tasked with investigating the circumstances that led to Driver’s death on Aug. 10, but it is not clear whether they will probe why police decided to go after the terrorism suspect only once he was in the back of Duffield’s cab.
http://www.lfpress.com/2016/08/18/strathroy-cabbie-terry-duffield-caught-in-the-middle-of-the-rcmps-terror-investigation-of-aaron-driver-says-police-put-him-in-danger

"Duffield has gone public with his complaints about police, but is still weighing his legal options, said his lawyer, Kevin Egan."

 

[Eye In The Sky]

Not sure how much 'knowledge' a cab driver has on anti-terrorist SOPs/TTPs with law enforcement to be criticizing the actions they took.  However, its a little disconcerting some here are willing to take his (and his lawyers) word on 'things happened that shouldn't have'; what is their motivation?  Certainly not monetary compensation.  ^-^

I'd say if anyone risked his life, it was Driver.  Maybe he should sue him.

 

[Lightguns]

I betcha he makes more money and gets more support than some CAF members who have been in much larger explosions in which they picked up their friend's body parts afterwards.

Depends on the quality of the Workplace safety organization and it's level of experience with OSI in Ontario.  Here in NB, unlikely, as this just started a program for first responders in the last few months. 

 

[jollyjacktar]

I listened to his interview last night while driving back from Halifax.  As with anything,  hindsight is 20/20.  Things could always be done this way or that and could have been done better or worse.  That's life and as the saying goes, a plan survives to the first contact with the enemy.

My take away smile from his story was what he heard a team member say after the first volley, "he's still twitching", before they put another set into him.  Good ending for me.

 

[mariomike]

My take away smile from his story was what he heard a team member say after the first volley, "he's still twitching", before they put another set into him.  Good ending for me.

 

[jollyjacktar]

;D

 

[Good2Golf]

After all, am I wrong in thinking that in hostage rescue situations (which I realize this isn't), don't all hostages get some level of positive control until proven non-hostile?

I've seen that in movies and heard it's a done thing.

That said, we don't know specifically what ETF did in terms of clearing the scene.  As with others' thoughts and in lieu of anything else known, the taxi guy should probably have been attended to on scene afterwards.. Assuming the were paramedics in scene afterwards?

Regards
G2G

 

[mariomike]

That said, we don't know specifically what ETF did in terms of clearing the scene.  As with others' thoughts and in lieu of anything else known, the taxi guy should probably have been attended to on scene afterwards.. Assuming the were paramedics in scene afterwards?

It's possible,
https://www.opp.ca/index.php?lng=en&id=115&entryid=5707ea198f94acd56d9b9a2f
"Advanced Care Paramedics provide emergency medical care during OPP tactical incidents."

 

[Teager]

I would guess it likely,
https://www.opp.ca/index.php?lng=en&id=115&entryid=5707ea198f94acd56d9b9a2f
"Advanced Care Paramedics provide emergency medical care during OPP tactical incidents.
Emergency Response Teams (ERT), the Urban Search and Rescue, Chemical, Biological, Radiological, Nuclear and Explosives Response Team (UCRT) and Tactics and Rescue Unit (TRU) teams all have access to these paramedics.
Training is based on the techniques of TRU and UCRT, enabling them to function within the OPP's programs as tactical medics. During training, teams are exposed to the kind of high-risk scenarios they might encounter in the field, and are able to learn what their roles are within them.  They become certified under this program as Advanced Care Paramedics."

I'm wondering if he was only treated for his cuts and sent on his way or possibly refused to go to hospital? It does say police later came to his house because bomb squad wanted him checked for internal injuries.

 

[Jarnhamar]

Sandy Hook families are suing Remington. Maybe the cab driver should try suing Islam.

 

[mariomike]

I'm wondering if he was only treated for his cuts and sent on his way or possibly refused to go to hospital? It does say police later came to his house because bomb squad wanted him checked for internal injuries.

For sure Paramedics would have been on scene for the deceased.

"An officer later brought him to paramedics, who treated him for cuts and scrapes on one of his arms."

http://www.cp24.com/news/taxi-driver-who-picked-up-aaron-driver-credits-cigarettes-for-saving-his-life-1.3033944

If he refused to go, I hope the crew got a signature. 

 

[The Bread Guy]

I've seen that in movies and heard it's a done thing.

I've seen the same flicks (at least some I'm guessing) and even if it makes sense, one likes to check, as much as OPSEC allows

That said, we don't know specifically what ETF did in terms of clearing the scene.  As with others' thoughts and in lieu of anything else known, the taxi guy should probably have been attended to on scene afterwards.. Assuming the were paramedics in scene afterwards?

I concur, with the caveat of knowing what we read is barely the tip of the info iceberg.