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I hate the liner. I tried to sleep in it on my first night of basic (which as you all know is VERY uncomfortable) and I ended up putting a HUGE rip in the side of it... so I said ****it and I just use the inner now...
rucksack and sleeping bag
- Thread starter solid1191
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Danny
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Portcullisguy, could you explain how some guys have their buttpacks on wrong? And the proper way of putting it on? Makes me think I have mine on wrong.
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when you put your ruck on, you want to loosen the rear straps as much as possible, and loosen the front straps too, so the valise sits on the top of the buttpack...
the BP should be hangin on yer arse.
the BP should be hangin on yer arse.
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Here are a few examples of what I am talking about (I broke out the digital camera for these... I know, my webbing and ruck are filthy, shhh, don‘t tell my CSM!)
First, here is a properly assembled buttpack...
In the bottom picture, the straps run through the O-ring, which centres takes the weight off the plastic clips that hold the buttpack on to the webbing straps.
Here the O-ring is by-passed. I see this all the time, and actually once had to correct buddy during a brief halt in a ruck march, as he was all messed up and losing his kit, etc. His buttpack was coming off, the plastic clips can‘t support much weight if the strap doesn‘t go through the O-ring.
Now the ruck... it might be hard to explain here...
Ruck with no valise, you can see the straps run through the O-rings on the bottom of the ruck bag, then through the frame and out the holes in the bottom of the frame. When the valise is packed in there, the valise straps hold it tight against the frame, which keeps the weight from shifting around.
Here, the ruck with valise attached incorrectly has the straps NOT going through the frame, just the O-rings and the bottom of the frame. The straps touch the valise on all sides, and there‘s a gap between the frame and valise. This means it shifts around, no matter how tight you make the straps. After a few klicks on the march, this tires you out because the weight shifts around as the valise bobbles to and fro, and it‘s less secure, as the valise slips out of the straps sometimes.
Hope that makes some sense...
First, here is a properly assembled buttpack...
In the bottom picture, the straps run through the O-ring, which centres takes the weight off the plastic clips that hold the buttpack on to the webbing straps.
Here the O-ring is by-passed. I see this all the time, and actually once had to correct buddy during a brief halt in a ruck march, as he was all messed up and losing his kit, etc. His buttpack was coming off, the plastic clips can‘t support much weight if the strap doesn‘t go through the O-ring.
Now the ruck... it might be hard to explain here...
Ruck with no valise, you can see the straps run through the O-rings on the bottom of the ruck bag, then through the frame and out the holes in the bottom of the frame. When the valise is packed in there, the valise straps hold it tight against the frame, which keeps the weight from shifting around.
Here, the ruck with valise attached incorrectly has the straps NOT going through the frame, just the O-rings and the bottom of the frame. The straps touch the valise on all sides, and there‘s a gap between the frame and valise. This means it shifts around, no matter how tight you make the straps. After a few klicks on the march, this tires you out because the weight shifts around as the valise bobbles to and fro, and it‘s less secure, as the valise slips out of the straps sometimes.
Hope that makes some sense...
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sience we are on the topic of webbing i got 2 questions
1.When parachuteing where does the webbing go? ive seen people jump with rucks but i never saw the webbelts
2. is it or will it be easier to walk around with the new tac vest and the ruck on at the same time?
1.When parachuteing where does the webbing go? ive seen people jump with rucks but i never saw the webbelts
2. is it or will it be easier to walk around with the new tac vest and the ruck on at the same time?
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Webbing could go into the valise or into the ruck itself.
The new tac vest does not have any packs on the rear (though it has webbing sewn onto it for attaching small packs and stuff). So theoretically, it should be easier to wear with a ruck (then webbing or the older tac vest, as both have pouches on the back). I never have any problems with the older style tac vest though.
The tac vest still tends to bunch up (same as the old tac vest) when you try to do up your ruck‘s waist belt.
Mind you thats with the 82 pattern rucksack, so they may be straitening that problem out with the new-issued rucks.
Its not a bad system though. The main problem is the lack of mag pouches (though thats not a problem for me yet).
Chris
The new tac vest does not have any packs on the rear (though it has webbing sewn onto it for attaching small packs and stuff). So theoretically, it should be easier to wear with a ruck (then webbing or the older tac vest, as both have pouches on the back). I never have any problems with the older style tac vest though.
The tac vest still tends to bunch up (same as the old tac vest) when you try to do up your ruck‘s waist belt.
Mind you thats with the 82 pattern rucksack, so they may be straitening that problem out with the new-issued rucks.
Its not a bad system though. The main problem is the lack of mag pouches (though thats not a problem for me yet).
Chris
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That‘s what I was taught on my BIQ... that the main pouch of the ruck belongs to the platoon. You put all your personal kit in the valise, the 3 side pouches on ruck and the top pouch. Actually, 3 side pouches usually end up carrying C6 ammo.
My set up for spring/summer/fall is
-1 set spare uniform
-ranger blanket
-bivy bag
-fleece top
-bug net (head portion)
-gitch/socks
Never been really cold yet.
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RHF, they never told me how to pack my ruck on BIQ, except that I had to have room for all the extra crap they gave me in the event I needed it. But on our FTX we barely used the rucks.
Some of the kit lists I see are amazing, and the Meaford standards are certainly exceptional -- mostly everything is supposed to be in the rucksack main compartment. For the winter order, it‘s even worse.
I would hate to have to find room for a couple Carl G rounds and a box or four of C6 ammo after packing "as per" the ATC Meaford kit list.
Even more reason to ditch the extra sleeping bag and numerous other tidbits of kit (I use the collapsible wash basin now, not the aluminum one, and I rarely take the melmac anywhere). In fact, I am trying to find a good Brit mess kit and pouch for my belt so that I never have to worry about the melmac again, the goal is to have KFS, plate and cup all in one pouch on the belt.
On the plus side, you can usually fit quite a bit in to the ruck‘s main comp. I surprise myself sometimes when I stuff things in there I wouldn‘t think would fit. Even after it‘s "full" I manage to get the Camelbak and Gortex coat in there no probs.
But I‘ve had to figure this stuff out on my own, the instructors on my BIQ didn‘t show me jack.
Some of the kit lists I see are amazing, and the Meaford standards are certainly exceptional -- mostly everything is supposed to be in the rucksack main compartment. For the winter order, it‘s even worse.
I would hate to have to find room for a couple Carl G rounds and a box or four of C6 ammo after packing "as per" the ATC Meaford kit list.
Even more reason to ditch the extra sleeping bag and numerous other tidbits of kit (I use the collapsible wash basin now, not the aluminum one, and I rarely take the melmac anywhere). In fact, I am trying to find a good Brit mess kit and pouch for my belt so that I never have to worry about the melmac again, the goal is to have KFS, plate and cup all in one pouch on the belt.
On the plus side, you can usually fit quite a bit in to the ruck‘s main comp. I surprise myself sometimes when I stuff things in there I wouldn‘t think would fit. Even after it‘s "full" I manage to get the Camelbak and Gortex coat in there no probs.
But I‘ve had to figure this stuff out on my own, the instructors on my BIQ didn‘t show me jack.
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I‘ve also seen a few ridiculous kit lists. You should have seen the kit list for OP PALLADIUM. I think each soldier had his ruck, an IPE bag, a duffel bag, and three barrack boxes full of stuff. WAY to much stuff to be hauling around. I felt kind of sheepish with my wardrobe watching the Brits show up with webbing and bergan (MAYBE a sea-bag as well). The CF needs to get to the "fight light" mentality, otherwise were just going to have a retardedly large "tail" following whatever "tooth" we can put out.
I‘m not really a fan of uniform packing within the section or platoon (IE, your half-shelter WILL be at the top of your valise!). I‘ve seen arguments for and against it, and I figure if everyone packs smart (ie, brings what is required, packs commonly used items in an easy to access manner) there shouldn‘t be a problem.
I usually try and avoid bringing snivel kit. As a private, I was a one-man QM, carrying all this extra garbage into the field (cam net, stove, boots, bug screen, yadayadayada). That all changed the day my section commander started dumping Mission essential kit on me for a week long company ex for workup. I‘m constantly trying to perfect the minimalist yet most efficent kit list. Here is Infanteer‘s attempt so far....
Webbing:
- couple pairs of light gloves (I have a pair of Hatch that act as my workhorses, I also like the issue anti contact gloves)
- spare pair of socks (New issue ones are the cat‘s meow)
- toque (I‘m partial to the fleece ones myself; green please, I am not a commando)
- My Schmagh, for some reason, I‘m happy when my head isn‘t radiating all my body heat on those morning stand-tos.
- I also have the Arktis Stowaway shirt packed in the webbing, worn under the Combat Shirt, it is the definiton of Gucci kit.
- Cam paint, bug dope, foot powder and all that crap.
In the ruck:
Valise:
- Sleeping bag
- Biv Bag (A must, sometimes you can get away with no fart sack (I wouldn‘t recommend it) but this is essential)
- Issue long underwear (top and bottom)
- Norge Sweater (Wool is still the best in the game)
- Gortex socks (If you boots get soaked)
- Spare ginch and socks
In the bag (A modified jump bag I got from the 1VP kitshop)
- Toiletries in a MEC bag in side pouch
- Two quart in the other side pouch
- Can fit two days rats in the center pouch
- I usually throw the good old gummy rain suit in the bottom of the bag in case things go south.
I brought a spare pair of combats on OP GRIZZLY because I knew it was going to be an Admin hide. Usually I just change underwear if my uniform is wet, because the fresh one would just get wet anyways.
I am a convert to polypro. Only if it is frigging hot do you see me without the long underwear and top. Its one of those things your always kicking yourself for not having on when you do the 0300-0400 shift on the C-6. Definately good issue from the CF.
I hate the gortex jacket, and have never used the thing short of winter parades.
Two things I am currently eyeing up:
DropZone‘s "Recce Smock" - Seen some pretty good comments on it from some BTDT‘s.
American Poncho - Thing is probably the handiest little piece of kit I‘ve ever seen.
As you can tell, I‘m a bit of a kit slut. To each his own, as long as you look Canadian.
Of course, winter ops is a completely different story.
I‘m not really a fan of uniform packing within the section or platoon (IE, your half-shelter WILL be at the top of your valise!). I‘ve seen arguments for and against it, and I figure if everyone packs smart (ie, brings what is required, packs commonly used items in an easy to access manner) there shouldn‘t be a problem.
I usually try and avoid bringing snivel kit. As a private, I was a one-man QM, carrying all this extra garbage into the field (cam net, stove, boots, bug screen, yadayadayada). That all changed the day my section commander started dumping Mission essential kit on me for a week long company ex for workup. I‘m constantly trying to perfect the minimalist yet most efficent kit list. Here is Infanteer‘s attempt so far....
Webbing:
- couple pairs of light gloves (I have a pair of Hatch that act as my workhorses, I also like the issue anti contact gloves)
- spare pair of socks (New issue ones are the cat‘s meow)
- toque (I‘m partial to the fleece ones myself; green please, I am not a commando)
- My Schmagh, for some reason, I‘m happy when my head isn‘t radiating all my body heat on those morning stand-tos.
- I also have the Arktis Stowaway shirt packed in the webbing, worn under the Combat Shirt, it is the definiton of Gucci kit.
- Cam paint, bug dope, foot powder and all that crap.
In the ruck:
Valise:
- Sleeping bag
- Biv Bag (A must, sometimes you can get away with no fart sack (I wouldn‘t recommend it) but this is essential)
- Issue long underwear (top and bottom)
- Norge Sweater (Wool is still the best in the game)
- Gortex socks (If you boots get soaked)
- Spare ginch and socks
In the bag (A modified jump bag I got from the 1VP kitshop)
- Toiletries in a MEC bag in side pouch
- Two quart in the other side pouch
- Can fit two days rats in the center pouch
- I usually throw the good old gummy rain suit in the bottom of the bag in case things go south.
I brought a spare pair of combats on OP GRIZZLY because I knew it was going to be an Admin hide. Usually I just change underwear if my uniform is wet, because the fresh one would just get wet anyways.
I am a convert to polypro. Only if it is frigging hot do you see me without the long underwear and top. Its one of those things your always kicking yourself for not having on when you do the 0300-0400 shift on the C-6. Definately good issue from the CF.
I hate the gortex jacket, and have never used the thing short of winter parades.
Two things I am currently eyeing up:
DropZone‘s "Recce Smock" - Seen some pretty good comments on it from some BTDT‘s.
American Poncho - Thing is probably the handiest little piece of kit I‘ve ever seen.
As you can tell, I‘m a bit of a kit slut. To each his own, as long as you look Canadian.
Of course, winter ops is a completely different story.
S
Superman
Guest
I wanna be a kit slut.... beats being cold...
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