Shotguns in the CF

[Colin Parkinson]

I have seen pictures of LAV‘s in Kabul with a rear guard in the hatch carrying a shotgun, couldn‘t tell you the type though.

 

[Ex-Dragoon]

If you can post a URL with the LAV/shotgun combo Colin we might be able to help you out.

 

[MG34]

It‘s a Remington 870,7shot magazine,Surefire Flashlight Forend.

 

[Enzo]

CFL - M203 w/ 40mm Flechettes would be like firing a large grouping of needles, what would be armed?

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

Well I wasn‘t sure how it would deploy. With the grenade it needs a certain amount of revolutions (apporx. 50m) to be armed and then blow up.

 

[Enzo]

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/library/budget/fy1999/dot-e/army/99xm100140mm.html

Should provide a basis for clarification

http://www.btselem.org/English/Legal_Documents/HC8990_02_flechette_Verdict.asp

 

[Michael OLeary]

There is a 40 mm flechette round ( M1001 Canister Cartridge (Infantry) ) but the pages that mention it only appear to describe it as used in the MK19 40mm Machine Gun, MOD 3 and not the M203. It may or may not also be currently available as single rounds for the M203. It is not described as having an arming distance.

40 mm ammunition (Global Security page)

FM 23-31 40-MM GRENADE LAUNCHER, M203

 

[Thompson_JM]

I was under the belief the flechette rounds were banned by the geneva convention

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

So are snipers and .50 shots against people. (I believe).

 

[MJP]

The .50 cal thing was debated at another site I look at. I poached this from the site, as it lays out the law of the land quite well.

".50 is perfectly legal to use, and it breaks no conventions. The next time someone tells you that, ask him to cite the part of the GC, or any convention, that says that. Check it out for yourself below

Here

There are restrictions on certain types of ammunition, e.g. expanding, fragmenting, and poisoned bullets, or explosive rounds under 400 grams, but none on size as such."

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

Is it legal to shot people with armour piercing trace (Apahce).

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

Saw a vid of one shoting up 3 pers who didn‘t appear to be armed.

 

[MJP]

actually I think the whole discussion over on the other site revolved around that exact video you are talking about.

Here‘s the discussion here;

Discussion

Some valid points on both sides, and it gets pretty heated as most things of this nature do.

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

That wasn‘t the vid in question but oh well. The one I was referring to was shot from the camera of an Apache.

 

[MJP]

they talk about that one too......somewhere on that site is a discussion of the apache one

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

ah I see. Too much beotching for me to wade through.

 

[Enzo]

Are they concerned with the fire from the Apache being ‘tracers?‘ or are they concerned that a 30mm cannon round is being applied to ‘soft‘ targets?

Having said that, dead is dead. 30mm, 12.7mm, 5.56mm. What‘s the difference? Conventional munitions, I do not have a problem with. NBC, that bothers me. I can wrap my head around getting my *** shot, but walking along and beginning to cough due to something in the air, that just pisses me off.

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

The GC states no tracer can be used to kill someone. I couldn‘t find any info on a 30mm cannon although its probabley deemed excessive against people.

 

[scm77]

Originally posted by CFL:
[qb] The GC states no tracer can be used to kill someone.[/qb]

Aren‘t you supposed to have three or four bullets and then a tracer in each magazine? If they were illegal that would mean that every forth (or fifth) shot you would have to miss on purpose.

I think there was some sort of mix up in how you understood it.

 

[George Wallace]

Originally posted by scm77:
Aren‘t you supposed to have three or four bullets and then a tracer in each magazine? If they were illegal that would mean that every forth (or fifth) shot you would have to miss on purpose.

I think there was some sort of mix up in how you understood it. [/QB]

We do not load magazines in this fashion. You are thinking of belted ammo for MGs. The only time that you may find Tracer fired single shot is as a spotting round to direct the fire of other weapons.

There is nothing to prevent a tracer round from wounding or killing a combatant in battle.

GW