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The Canadian Peacekeeping Myth (Merged Topics)

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I recall my tours in Cyprus. The contingents were all European and Canadians. Things were pretty stable.

Compare this with 1993. In our sector we had Argies, Nepalese and Jordanians. Things weren't so stable.

I know the political situation didn't help, but allowing poorly trained, poorly equipped, poorly led and corrupt armies to participate in peacekeeping operations proved to be a huge mistake.
 
- Not to mention their adventures in personal and unit hygiene.
;D
 
yes and guess what, you can't sue them when they introduce new and exotic diseases into your country.


http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/01/10/us-un-haiti-lawsuit-idUSKBN0KJ0PX20150110

 
Yes lets send UN blue helmets to Iraq and Yemen.  There is just so much peace waiting to be kept these days.

Yugo, Somalia, Rwanda.  They were all glowing UN mission successes.
 
Interesting statistics buried in an article on Canadian support for the Iraq & Syria mission.  It seems the peacekeeping myth is still alive, but it is fading.
Canadians support the war (for now)
Michael Adams
The Globe and Mail
09 Apr 2015

...

Historically, the public has taken great pride in Canadian peacekeeping efforts, and in Lester Pearson’s role in the development of modern peacekeeping. Even after Canada’s actual peacekeeping activity declined to almost nothing, a plurality of the public has continued to see peacekeeping as their country’s most positive contribution to the world. In 1993, 40 per cent of Canadians saw peacekeeping as their top contribution, the most popular answer by far. Foreign aid came in second at 19 per cent. By 2011, just 18 per cent of Canadians named peacekeeping as Canada’s best contribution to the world, a substantially smaller proportion but still the top answer. Foreign aid still came in second (13 per cent).

...
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-debate/canadians-support-the-war-for-now/article23854659/
 
Maybe we should start by getting people to read these again:

http://www.ruxted.ca/archives/76-The-Truth-About-Peacekeeping.html
http://ruxted.ca/archives/12-Peace-Making,-not-Peacekeeping-is-the-order-of-the-day.html
http://ruxted.ca/archives/37-Changing-the-Guard.html

I'm sure there are plenty of other pieces that lay out the arguments
 
SprCForr said:
I had (successfully) suppressed that memory. Until now.

Gah.

:facepalm:

Yes, the French being but one. Czechs as bad if not worse.

Thucydides said:
Maybe we should start by getting people to read these again:

http://www.ruxted.ca/archives/76-The-Truth-About-Peacekeeping.html
http://ruxted.ca/archives/12-Peace-Making,-not-Peacekeeping-is-the-order-of-the-day.html
http://ruxted.ca/archives/37-Changing-the-Guard.html

I'm sure there are plenty of other pieces that lay out the arguments

I had to write a paper for an OPME. I'll dig out out one day and post it for you.
 
Can Canada's army return to peacekeeping?
For the first time since 9/11 and with the world still aflame, the U.S. is urging allies to revive the concept of United Nations peacekeeping. But is it too late for Canada's combat-focused army, once the best in the blue helmet business, to be part of the new program?
Toronto Star
Mitch Potter
Mar 30 2015

The reason our soldiers were so good at peacekeeping was because at the time we were training for total war with the Soviet Union and her minions. In fact, peacekeeping was only a very small portion of our training, and then usually just prior to units deploying on a peacekeeping mission.
 
- At any given time up to the early seventies, we probably had more people engaged in the secure storage and training for the use/launch of nuclear weapons than we did peacekeeping.
 
Can Canada's army return to peacekeeping?


...... But is it too late for Canada's combat-focused army,


Mitch Potter
Mar 30 2015

That has to be one of the, if not THE, stupidest statements I have read in a long time.  Mitch Potter just showed the informed world his total ignorance of what it takes to make up a "Peacekeeping Force".  Lester Pearson knew that the best "Peacekeepers" would be highly trained, professional combat soldiers and set out with that in mind when he proposed "Peacekeeping".
 
George Wallace said:
That has to be one of the, if not THE, stupidest statements I have read in a long time.  Mitch Potter just showed the informed world his total ignorance of what it takes to make up a "Peacekeeping Force".  Lester Pearson knew that the best "Peacekeepers" would be highly trained, professional combat soldiers and set out with that in mind when he proposed "Peacekeeping".


Except he, Mike Pearson, didn't 'propose peacekeeping,' it, including the notion of UN forces, was already there, since the 1940s. Pearson stick-handled a sneaky, tricky resolution through the UN's political system, foiling the USSR and, simultaneously, rescuing Britain, France and Israel from President Eisenhower's wrath. He earned his Nobel Peace Prize, just not for "inventing" peacekeeping.
 
Have a look:

The Peacekeeping Mythology That Will Not Die
http://www.cdfai.org.previewmysite.com/the3dsblog/?p=1084

Canadian Suez Policy was not About the Middle East
http://www.cdfai.org.previewmysite.com/the3dsblog/?p=105

Mark
Ottawa
 
Had to see THIS coming ...
The Liberals are facing calls to reopen a new peacekeeping training centre three years after the demise of Canada's former school, The Canadian Press has learned.

The new centre would be located in Kingston, Ont., near the Canadian Forces base and military college, but would be a civilian-led operation, essentially a revitalization of the Pearson Centre, which was shuttered in 2013.

The proposal comes from the Canadian non-governmental organization Canadem, a contractor that has established a reputation for staffing United Nations missions with civilian experts in security reform, election monitoring and building democratic institutions.

One of the Liberal government's major foreign policy planks is to return the country to UN peacekeeping missions after Canada's contribution dwindled to an all-time low of a few dozen.

Prime Minister Justin Trudeau told a UN audience recently that Canada would be recommitting itself to peacekeeping as part of its bid to win a temporary seat on the world body's Security Council in 2020.

But the capacity of Canada's military to conduct peacekeeping operations has largely disappeared after a decade of war-fighting in Afghanistan, a recent report suggests, amplifying the need for a new training centre.

"Many of the senior command recognize their need to re-invigorate their training for UN peace operations and recognize the advantages of drawing upon civilian trainers," said Paul LaRose-Edwards, Canadem's executive director.

LaRose-Edwards said his agency maintains a list of experts who can fill that void ...
More via link
 
From the same article:
milnews.ca said:
Had to see THIS coming ...More via link

"Many of the senior command recognize their need to re-invigorate their training for UN peace operations.... [Name two. OK, name one, but who isn't either: retiring in the next 6 months looking for post-CAF employment and/or isn't associated with PSTC (gee, already in Kingston; wouldn't have to move) ]

The Pearson Centre in Cornwallis, N.S., was closed in 2013, after its government funding dried up. Its demise came after the Canadian Forces refocused itself on the Afghan war in the years following the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks on the United States.
Gee, only 12 years to realize that it was merely a cash-cow from some specific individuals

LaRose-Edwards said civilians have a lot to learn from the military, such as mine awareness and personal protection.< note, those are specific skills] Meanwhile, military personnel would benefit from training that civilians would receive on how UN operations actually work.].< note, that is generic waffling -- which is how UN operations actually  work  (unless you also want to use big words, like "sinecure" when referring to UN staffers) ]
  Yep, we couldn't do Ch 6 peacekeeping anymore (without the benefit of civilians with their hands' out) because many spent time in Afghanistan -- clearly a "lost generation."

Back to the trough, piggies.  ::)
 
Canadem has never seen a Government of Canada cheque it didn't like - they're positively Senatorial in their view of the public purse.

And the article quotes an academic from the Canadian Forces College in Toronto on Peacekeeping, without the context that his PhD is in Chemistry...
 
To be fair, Dataperson, Dr. Dorn has done a lot more than chemistry, particularly on the UN peace operations side of things, since getting his PhD. He is, however, one of the most vocal Blue-Beret-Peaceniks in Canada, but just happens to have found employment within DND (which is fine: top brass has to be exposed to different ideas to be able to learn to think these things through for themselves). However, using his name to support your view on the need to "train" in UN peace operations is akin to the CBC saying it's views on the environment are right because they are endorsed by their very own Dr. Suzuki.  :nod:

On the other hand, IMHO, all these years the Canadian Army just spent in Afghanistan has actually improved their readiness for any peace operation - not decreased it. They have better training, readiness and equipment for it now than they have had for along time before that.
 
Oldgateboatdriver said:
On the other hand, IMHO, all these years the Canadian Army just spent in Afghanistan has actually improved their readiness for any peace operation - not decreased it. They have better training, readiness and equipment for it now than they have had for along time before that.

Did we not jettison most of that "specialized" equipment that we purchased for Afghanistan?
 
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