The end of Kiwi shoe polish?

[brihard]

They also are once force expected to be a expeditionary force that looks after itself, they all take IFT then specialize in trades. We dont do this here.
We are a Navy, Army and Airforce. Three separate entities they tried to combine but non are on the same page as the other.

And yet I’ve been on the ground outside the trucks on a long halt in Kandahar next to an RCAF clerk deployed with the MSE. And I’ve cleaned a transit casket for another RCAF member killed on that same tour.

My experience has been that the other guy isn’t going to ask what colour your hat is, or what the metal thingy on it looks like. I think that’s consistent with the experience of support trades in the one big war that’s actually happening right now. Canada’s military is an expeditionary one too, even if certain parts of it are still hung up thinking that ‘deployment’ means hotels and basing in a different country from where the fight is.

 

[Halifax Tar]

And yet I’ve been on the ground outside the trucks on a long halt in Kandahar next to an RCAF clerk deployed with the MSE. And I’ve cleaned a transit casket for another RCAF member killed on that same tour.

My experience has been that the other guy isn’t going to ask what colour your hat is, or what the metal thingy on it looks like. I think that’s consistent with the experience of support trades in the one big war that’s actually happening right now. Canada’s military is an expeditionary one too, even if certain parts of it are still hung up thinking that ‘deployment’ means hotels and basing in a different country from where the fight is.

And those RCAF pers spent months leading up to the deployment training to be there. Just like I did coming from the RCN.

That doesn't mean we need all things baseline Army. It just shows how short sighted we are. The CAF does much more than wear camo and carry a rifle, we just exist in an Army dominated force, but that can and should be changed.

 

[childs56]

And yet I’ve been on the ground outside the trucks on a long halt in Kandahar next to an RCAF clerk deployed with the MSE. And I’ve cleaned a transit casket for another RCAF member killed on that same tour.

My experience has been that the other guy isn’t going to ask what colour your hat is, or what the metal thingy on it looks like. I think that’s consistent with the experience of support trades in the one big war that’s actually happening right now. Canada’s military is an expeditionary one too, even if certain parts of it are still hung up thinking that ‘deployment’ means hotels and basing in a different country from where the fight is.

The purple trade aspect is funny thing. Send a Navy Clerk to a Army Unit and a Airforce Clerk to a Navy Unit and a Army Clerk to a Airforce Unit. Makes sense

When the Airforce wanted to send Avn Techs to work on the UAVs it wasn't blue enough for them.

 

[brihard]

And those RCAF pers spent months leading up to the deployment training to be there. Just like I did coming from the RCN.

That doesn't mean we need all things baseline Army. It just shows how short sighted we are. The CAF does much more than wear camo and carry a rifle, we just exist in an Army dominated force, but that can and should be changed.

And those RCAF pers spent months leading up to the deployment training to be there. Just like I did coming from the RCN.

That doesn't mean we need all things baseline Army. It just shows how short sighted we are. The CAF does much more than wear camo and carry a rifle, we just exist in an Army dominated force, but that can and should be changed.

Fortunately I’ve already accounted for the real operationally relevant physical risks to RCAF personnel farther upthread, and have related them to actual threats in an actual ongoing war.

 

[Halifax Tar]

Fortunately I’ve already accounted for the real operationally relevant physical risks to RCAF personnel farther upthread, and have related them to actual threats in an actual ongoing war.

Okie dokie my guy.

 

[markppcli]

Okie dokie my

Excellent rebuttals. As it stands the force test was developed by a joint group from a CA, RCN, and RCAF in common tasks. Which task isn’t navy applicable ?

They also are once force expected to be a expeditionary force that looks after itself, they all take IFT then specialize in trades. We dont do this here.

Not at all true. I’m of course assuming IFT stands for infantry here, but the USMC does boot camp, which is not infantry training, and then specialized MOS training after. Another example would be the US Army where the boat operators do the same test as the Chaplains Assistants as the Infantry.

We are a Navy, Army and Airforce. Three separate entities they tried to combine but non are on the same page as the other.

Also not true, we are a unified service with members who get move from place to place.

While work up has become the expectation, it’s a crutch and we are actively trying to shorten that time.

 

[Halifax Tar]

Excellent rebuttals. As it stands the force test was developed by a joint group from a CA, RCN, and RCAF in common tasks. Which task isn’t navy applicable ?

I mean it's a clear difference of opinions. Should I continue to argue for your entertainment ? @brihard has his position and I have mine, I'm happy to leave it at that. Neither one of us is going to change anything either way.

Well we don't do much pepper podding in the Navy for one. You also don't jog or run on a ship unless you're working out, ironically. Nor do we play with sand bags too much.

Like I said previously a version of a Fireman's fitness test would be more practical and applicable for the RCN.

 

[TacticalTea]

It’s been far longer than that. But, what is “informal” for one generation becomes “formal” for one 2-3 generations later. There is a great Terminal Lance comic about that.

I personally have no issue with “Athleisure” wear, as long as people don’t wear it in outrageously inappropriate times, like a funeral. Daily life though? Sure.

I’m pretty sure that if G-strings become formal evening wear, peer pressure would make them self-selecting.

Last funeral I went to I was the only one in a suit n tie.

A shocking non-zero amount wore athleisure.

 

[Bruce Monkhouse]

SHOE POLISH THREAD
The fitness swerve is here.

Somehow a Fitness Thread from a "Kiwi shoe polish" Thread

That’s because it’s usually the old and the bold complaining about the loss of what they perceived to be very important in 1975 Hell ya, relaxed fitness and dress standards, I like where the new CAF is going.

www.army.ca

 

[childs56]

To go along with Kiwi Shoe polish being gone, Easy on Starch is also discontinued.

 

[dimsum]

To go along with Kiwi Shoe polish being gone, Easy on Starch is also discontinued.

I can almost hear the screams of Drill Staff everywhere.

 

[Halifax Tar]

SHOE POLISH THREAD
The fitness swerve is here.

Somehow a Fitness Thread from a "Kiwi shoe polish" Thread

That’s because it’s usually the old and the bold complaining about the loss of what they perceived to be very important in 1975 Hell ya, relaxed fitness and dress standards, I like where the new CAF is going.

www.army.ca

Ok ok ok... sorry Bruce

 

[OldSolduer]

I can almost hear the screams of Drill Staff everywhere.

Not from this one. Well former anyways. Done with that but I still polish my boots....kinda.

 

[rmc_wannabe]

Does the dress manual say anywhere that leather footwear must be shone?

Keep your RCAF heresy to yourself.

Canadian Army Dress Instructions Chapter 5 Section 3 General Guidelines- Army Service Dress- Para 21:

Footwear. Leather shoes, Oxfords, pumps, flats (heel height not to exceed 5 cm, but no ballerina slipper styles) and ankle boots may be worn, they shall be clean and shone at all times. Overshoes, cold weather boots, or black toe rubbers (optional) may be worn as required, but shall not be worn on parade and shall be kept clean. Ankle boots shall be the normal footwear ordered worn on parade by NCMs; officers and CWOs shall wear Oxford shoes; pumps/flats shall not be worn on parade

 

[dapaterson]

I think the 5cm maximum height is not consistently enforced. I have seen DEU with four inch stiletto heel patent leather ...

 

[rmc_wannabe]

I think the 5cm maximum height is not consistently enforced. I have seen DEU with four inch stiletto heel patent leather ...

To venture into the fashion lessons learned having an older sister/wife/teenage daughter:

-Pumps have a defined heel (usually square, stilletos are a different beast all together) with some molding/support for the wearer

-Flats appear similar to pumps but have a significantly smaller heel, so hence aren't entirely "flat". Flats dont have the same level of support as pumps as the angle of the foot is different.

In this case, the NMT 5 cm direction for flats is most likely to ensure the wearer doesn't break an ankle.

 

[Furniture]

On topic, I've found that the

I think the 5cm maximum height is not consistently enforced. I have seen DEU with four inch stiletto heel patent leather ...

The 5cm height applies to "flats", not "pumps". I'm not an expert on shoes(though my ex made me watch a lot of "What Not to Wear"), but I suspect the high heels you're seeing are "pumps"...

 

[GR66]

I think the 5cm maximum height is not consistently enforced. I have seen DEU with four inch stiletto heel patent leather ...

Shouldn't this be in the Russel Williams thread?

 

[rmc_wannabe]

Shouldn't this be in the Russel Williams thread?

What do you mean?

 

[Oldgateboatdriver]

Just a small personal comment on the idea that we should dispense with the DEU altogether: It is a very army centric idea.

While in the Navy we wear operational clothing on more and more occasions, there remains (and I suggest always will remain) a need for dress up clothing (the DEU) because we carry on a frequent and ongoing basis diplomatic functions on behalf of the country - something the other elements don't.

You may have noticed that when foreign warships visit the country, they enter harbour with the deck personnel nicely dressed up in their DEU equivalent. We are expected to show the same curtesy when visiting foreign harbour - a frequent occurence. When in those foreign harbours - and some times in our own harbours - we frequently host, on behalf of the government of Canada, diplomatic functions attended by anyone from the Head of State or Head of Government all the way down to the local mayor, including all possible officials and diplomats of all ranks in between. That can only be done with personnel dressed up to the T's. We also frequently participate in military ceremonies and receptions ashore on such occasions where, again, DEU is the proper dress.