The General Hillier Years. The Merged Superthread

[geo]

To some, a CDS should be like a child:  "Seen but not heard" - and the CDS does not fit that mold.
Those inside DND who don't like him?...
functionaries who liked the old way of doing things (7 year procurment process) don't like to have people tell them to get it done in 6 mths to 1 year)
soldiers who liked it the old fashioned way... ineffective leadership accepting excuses for not getting things done
I could go on and on....

 

[Greymatters]

I think its just that many politicians dont like the military (as they've been taught in poli-sci), and are offended that a senior officer is more popular than they area... it seems to be the nature of national-level politicians to tear down whosoever is above them regardless of whether that person is doing a good thing or not...

 

[geo]

... People will trust the  soldier
- and they won't trust the politician

 

[Steve 1 RNFLDR]

I think it's funny that he didn't mention the Duke of Wellington among the popular military figures who went on to public office.

 

[CougarKing]

I think its just that many politicians dont like the military (as they've been taught in poli-sci),

Here we go again generalizing Poli Sci grads. Not all political science majors/grads are military-hating peaceniks. And on that same note, not all politicians and bureaucrats have a degree in Political Science; the politicians have to be elected, as you well know, and the career bureaucrats are just as likely to get their job regardless of whether they were Business or Poli Sci majors or whatever liberal arts major. 

 

[IN HOC SIGNO]

I think Worthington has done a pretty acurate piece here. He's certainly correct that there is concern among those in the Air Force and Navy about concentration on things Army. I've heard the rumours of the "them and us" rift between those who worked outside the wire and those inside the wire, this is pretty normal I think for Armies who are engaged in fighting war. I'm not sure why he's connecting that to Hillier or blaming him for it...it doesn't make a lot of sense to me. The feeling that some have of thinking that those who don't deploy right into country are second class has been evident to me by some on this forum. I'm not sure that those attitudes can be blamed on the CDS or that there is any cure for it. There will always be a chasm between those who get shot at and those who are in a support role back at KAF or back in Canada or at sea or in the air doing a different aspect of security.
I think personally the CDS himself might be wondering if after three years of a pretty tough and tiring job it might be time to move on.

 

[Bruce Monkhouse]

Ruxted has a little to say again on this topic.
http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/67739.0.html

 

[Bigmac]

Alexander Panetta, THE CANADIAN PRESS


Canada's top soldier is unapologetic about his outspoken style and vows to keep talking publicly despite suggestions his political bosses want him to tone it down.

Chief of defence staff Gen. Rick Hillier says he works for his troops as much as he does for the government - and says he's proud to act as their voice.

He has also suggested that promoting their work is an essential part of his job - so essential that anyone who can't perform that duty should be replaced.

"I will be the public champion of those brave men and women," Hillier told a group of broadcasters.

"They are Canada's sons and daughters, ladies and gentlemen. If we can't market Canada's sons and daughters back to Canada's moms and dads, we need to find somebody to replace us to do the job.

"Because that's what needs to be done."

Officials for the Conservative government have been quoted in news reports saying that Hillier was given his marching orders and told that his job is not to be chief spokesman for the military.

The government was annoyed when Hillier publicly suggested that it might take a decade to stabilize Afghanistan - after the government declared it was feasible by 2011.

But Hillier has said nobody's told him to tone it down.

http://www.recorder.ca/cp/National/071106/n1106113A.html

Gen. Hillier is the best CDS we have ever had! Good on you, Sir! 

 

[geo]

bigmac

Gen Hillier is good, he may even be great but, only time will tell if (after Hillier) he was the best that we have ever had.

The Canadian military has had chiefs of the Defense staff (or Militia) for some some 140 years (2007-1867). 
Neither you nor I are adequately qualified to definitively determine who was the best we have ever had.

 

[Bigmac]

bigmac

Gen Hillier is good, he may even be great but, only time will tell if (after Hillier) he was the best that we have ever had.

The Canadian military has had chiefs of the Defense staff (or Militia) for some some 140 years (2007-1867). 
Neither you nor I are adequately qualified to definitively determine who was the best we have ever had.

OK, my politically correct disclaimer: I base my "opinion" upon only the CDS's I have seen in my 23 years of service. There may have been better ones in history but I leave that to the historians. So to rephrase; Gen Hillier is, in my opinion, the best CDS I have seen in my 23 years of service. This is "my opinion" and does not reflect the opinion of the CF or all it's personnel presently or previously serving. 

 

[geo]

Don't get me wrong, I like the man, I will go so far as to say "I love the man" (platonic)
A down homer with a huge heart.  Willing to stand up for his men & women and who has singlehandedly brought back pride and esprit de corps where it had withered away and dissapeared.

 

[MikeM]

+1 to the big man, he's got my support.

 

[MG34]

He's doing much better than the political shills we had before, about as good as we could get considering who they had to pick from.

 

[geo]

MG34
We have to consider that, if the Gov't isn't willing to listen to what the CDS has to say, all they have to do is replace him...
So does he spout off & get canned OR does he "heel" and try to get his licks in when an oportunity presents itself?

In the days of Trudeau, Mulroney & Chrétien, the CDS had to kowtow to the Politicos if they had any hope of providing some protection for their soldiers, sailors & airmen.

Not making excusses for them but, I can visualise the problem

 

[GUNS]

Have to agree with geo here.

It would be better for the CDS to rein himself in a bit here and remain in command rather than continue his out-spoken manner and view the military from the sidelines.

 

[Edward Campbell]

I disagree, GUNS. I think he's doing a great communications job, even when he oversteps the bounds a bit. I'm fairly sure that he and his media advisers understand when he's going to cross a line but, generally, they are lines that need a bit of crossing. Some civil servants, a few more politicians and a whole boat load of political staffers are unhappy: Tough! He's not breaking any rules. he may be writing a few new ones and reshaping (bending) a few old ones but I don't think he's broken any important ones. No one with the brains the gods gave a green pepper should give a damn about anything Sandra Buckler says. D'ya hear me, Mr. Harper?

He is approaching the end of his tour as CDS. There is no magic time limit: three years has been about the norm, some have served four. I suggest that more than four is hard on the individual and not too good for the service, either - no matter how popular and effective the incumbent CDS might be. Change is almost always a good thing.

So let's have more of Hillier being Hillier while he still has the bully pulpit.

 

[geo]

Edward,
Hillier is doing a great job - no taking away from his accomplishments.

However, do you think he would have survived very long, acting the way he does, under Trudeau, Mulroney or Chrétien?

 

[Reccesoldier]

Well said Edward.

Another aspect of the Generals outspoken method is that it might encourage the Government specifically the PMO and Foreign Affairs to step up their game with regard to the message and their communication of it, which as we all know has been lacklustre at best.

 

[Greymatters]

Dont know if he's the best ever, but he's certainly a far cry better than anybody else in quite a while.  Hard to tell if he's better than General MacKenzie was without the two of them being side-by-side for comparison. 

 

[Edward Campbell]

Edward,
Hillier is doing a great job - no taking away from his accomplishments.

However, do you think he would have survived very long, acting the way he does, under Trudeau, Mulroney or Chrétien?

I doubt someone like him would have been a flag/general officer in the '60s, '70s and '80s. The system was different: admirals and generals were seen but not heard. But, of course, neither was anyone else: ministers spoke for their departments and, until Trudeau, were accountable for their departments. Government got a lot more complicated in the '60s and '70s (not Trudeau's fault) - as did business and everything else. Trudeau's ministry system changed with the times.

Further (see Clarkson and McCall, et al) Trudeau actively disliked the military - and that's not a strong enough word. He disliked and mistrusted soldiers and just wanted them (us) all to go away, quietly. The military didn't much like the government, either - not after Hellyer vs. Landymore and Moncel (another of the best CDS we never had).

Mulroney didn't dislike the military but he didn't care about it either. It simply was never a priority during the Mulroney years. The infamous and strategically blind white paper with nuclear submarines wasn't even written in NDHQ. The work was farmed out to a bunch of Tory insiders in Toronto - so called defence experts (just like we have now) who completely and utterly missed the mark and were technological and financial illiterates to boot.

Chrétien was in the Trudeau mould, but he understood the need to 'sell' his government and he picked Hillier because of his public face, not despite it.