The Great Gun Control Debate- 2.0

[Eaglelord17]

I predict this ban shall result in the old Canadian tradition of non-compliance to a large degree.

Before the long gun registry was put into effect there was a estimated 20-30 million firearms in Canada. After the long gun registry was put into effect there was magically about 8 million firearms.

I also predict much like New Zealand, the government is going to learn how ineffective a ban is when the firearms aren't registered to begin with. Confiscation is a two step process, 1 register the firearms, and 2 come and take them away. If you fail to do #1 you end up failing to do #2.

 

[Jarnhamar]

Don't forget to register all your firearms online first in order to qualify for the buy back.

That way if you don't like getting $900 for your $3400 rifle they'll just come to your house after the buy back is over and take it for free  ;D

 

[mariomike]

Saw this in Radio Chatter. I'll reply in gun politics.

But gun owners aren't on the fringe. Ideologically, they (those who base their political action on this single issue) are firmly entrenched in the middle of the Conservative camp. 

I'm a gun owner. But, not obsessed with them.

My voting priority has always been non-partisan and based on who is best for my career, and retirement. Not my hobbies.

 

[Furniture]

I have always voted - based on the advice of my union and pension association -what is best for my career, and retirement. Not my hobbies.

YMMV. 

At least you're honest, most would try to hide the selfish motivation behind their vote.

I suspect the Liberal ban plan will create further urban/rural divide, as well as increased East/West divide.

 

[Jarnhamar]

Public Safety Minister Bill Blair has pegged the figure at close to 250,000 with an average retail price of $1,500 each, pushing the total cost of a buyback program to between $400-million and $600-million.

10-20 million estimated firearms in Canada and only 250,000 estimated "military assault style weapons" which will probably be anything semiautomatic and/or with a magazine?

I think Mr Blair is being disingenuous in order to not scare the public a out how much this will cost.

There's 75,634 AR15s alone registered in Canada. Tens of thousands of ruger mini 14s, maybe even 100,000+

Tons of "assault style weapons" have been approved by the RCMP, many non restricted, important and sold in the last decade or two.

Easy 2 billion for the buy back.

 

[mariomike]

At least you're honest, most would try to hide the selfish motivation behind their vote.

I don't feel it's "selfish" for working people to feel motivated about wages, health and safety, benefits, pensions and so many other things they worked hard for all their lives.

Our union supported the politicians who supported us.

Sneering at "materialism" was a luxury for idealists, not realists.

 

[Haggis]

I think Mr Blair is being disingenuous in order to not scare the public a out how much this will cost.

I'm sure the Minster will explain how the costs of the buyback will be offset by, for example, making the reimbursement taxable.

There's 75,634 AR15s alone registered in Canada. Tens of thousands of ruger mini 14s, maybe even 100,000+

Easy 2 billion for the buy back.

At a average retail price of $1500, the cost to buy back just the ARs exceeds $113 M.

 

[Jarnhamar]

Are accessories included?

I have a $2500 scope on top a $2400 AR15. Another $600 in upgrades.

 

[NavyShooter]

You are assuming 'fair market value' will be paid...

I have no such expectation.

The fact that in the 90's, the prohibitions resulted in two classes - grandfathered, or non-grandfathered meant that the non-grandfathered class were required to be handed over...with no compensation.

I am a 'grandfathered' owner of type 12(5) firearms, banned by OIC 13 back in 1992. 

I am not looking forward to the next round...and I fear it's coming soon.

If they do come for my AR's...but leave me with my FN's...that'll be...odd.

NS

 

[Furniture]

I don't feel it's "selfish" for working people to feel motivated about wages, health and safety, benefits, pensions and so many other things they worked hard for all their lives.

Our union supported the politicians who supported us.

Sneering at "materialism" was a luxury for idealists, not realists.

I wasn't sneering, I was pointing out that it's nice to see someone be honest about a selfish motivation. Wages, pensions, and benefits fall under selfish. They don't work toward the greater good of the electorate, they enhance your lifestyle.

I vote for people that don't try to take away my legally purchased private property(selfish), on the basis that taking my stuff from may help shore up their weak vote numbers.

 

[Halifax Tar]

I bet we see a spike of sales for PVC tubing, end caps and durrable plactic bags in the future...

 

[mariomike]

Wages, pensions, and benefits fall under selfish. They don't work toward the greater good of the electorate, they enhance your lifestyle.

Politicians who vote to improve wages, pensions, benefits, working conditions, health and safety etc. are good things for all working people.

Guns may be the favorite political chew toy for some people. For others it may be reproductive rights, the environment, or other social issues they hold firm beliefs about.

The point is, nobody - including a union or people on the internet - has a right to tell anyone how to vote.

 

[Jarnhamar]

Correct me if I'm wrong but don't unions take money (earned from members union dues?) and decide which political party *they* feel should be supported/that best supports their members interest and support that party?  Without bothering to ask their membership? Essentially you could be a card carrying conservative member but your union decides they will support and donate to the Liberals. So your union dues go towards a party you're possibly 100% opposed to.

 

[Jarnhamar]

I bet we see a spike of sales for PVC tubing, end caps and durrable plactic bags in the future...

Thinking the police will decide to search known firearm owners houses just to look for banned items?

I honestly think the last thing the Liberals want us for us to is actually take part in the buy back.

They're guessing many firearm owners will whether down and hide their guns away. Maybe to just keep them, maybe to hope the Conservatives reverse it.
Liberals get liberal points for banning guns but don't have to actually pay for them to be bought.
Win win

 

[mariomike]

Correct me if I'm wrong but don't unions take money (earned from members union dues?) and decide which political party *they* feel should be supported/that best supports their members interest and support that party?

Unions have elections. That's when members vote for the representatives they feel best supports their intersts on employment related issues.

This explains the non partisan endorsement philosophy,
https://www.iaff.org/my-resources/programs/politics-legislation/iaff-endorsement-philosophy/
No one, including your union, and especially people / bots on the internet, has a right to tell you how to vote.

 

[suffolkowner]

https://ipolitics.ca/2019/12/10/gun-owners-wanted-buy-back-plan-for-prohibited-rifles-says-blair/

The above article seems to suggest that the government looks to follow the NZ example much more closely than indicated

 

[Halifax Tar]

Thinking the police will decide to search known firearm owners houses just to look for banned items?

I honestly think the last thing the Liberals want us for us to is actually take part in the buy back.

They're guessing many firearm owners will whether down and hide their guns away. Maybe to just keep them, maybe to hope the Conservatives reverse it.
Liberals get liberal points for banning guns but don't have to actually pay for them to be bought.
Win win

Who knows what will happen.  Might be worth it to disregard and hope the Cons get in and reverse it.

 

[Jonezy76]

https://ipolitics.ca/2019/12/10/gun-owners-wanted-buy-back-plan-for-prohibited-rifles-says-blair/

The above article seems to suggest that the government looks to follow the NZ example much more closely than indicated

New Zealand is sitting at about a 10% compliance rate right now.

Word on the street is that Canadians may follow suit.

 

[Haggis]

A Sun editorial yesterday estimated that the Liberals will almost spend twice as much money ($600M over two years) buying back legal firearms than they will spend on fighting gangs and illegal guns ($327 M over five years) ten times more than they will spend to combat smuggling ($60M over five years).

 

[Brad Sallows]

Everyone works hard for all the things in their lives, and everything done at public expense draws from a finite pool.  It's long-established that politics is partly a spoils system.  I don't know of any measures of how much people vote for themselves, versus voting for the general good of society.