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The Great Gun Control Debate

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josh said:
  Does that make you feel important or something here?  ::)

Personnaly, I don't need to feel important or something here. I just need to feel
that interesting things are post for me to read...

Does living  leaving an empty profil make YOU feel important ?

Feel free to answer once C & P is lift...

ADD : oups, correct a "mispelling", thanks Lone Wolf Quagmire :)
 
josh said:
Wes,

Give me a break also.  ::)  Senior member!?  Life experience!?  You don't even know me!?  Don't judge me by the number of posts I have here, or the cute "verbal warning" some likely-militia-type here had the time-of-day ('cause they're obviously unemployed) to give me, because I disagreed and made a point he didn't like.  If wasting your life with thousands of posts on Army.ca is an indication of anykind of "seniority" then you are a sorry lot indeed.  Otherwise, I'll be happy to disagree with you anytime.

Hehehe.  Way to make Wes' point about life experience.  You are correct that he doesen't know you.  But he figured you out pretty good despite the cyberspace gap. They aren't judging you on your number of posts.  Just your immature rants like this one or your other one about PTSD.
Too bad you don't see it yourself.
 
Perhaps a separate "Josh gets sorted out in a pile on thread" would be helpful.  ::)

The concealed weapon issue is somewhat lockstep with the whole gun control issue.  If you are qualified enough to get one, you likely are not going to be a big threat. 
As for the "lawful gun owners get picked on because they are easy to find" comment by GreyMatter, I disagree.  I personally know of many people whose permits expired, or moved without notifying the Registry and didn't get charged or lose their weapons.  However, it is nice when I am en route to a violent domestic to be able to run a quick check and see if I'm going into a firearm equipped home. 
So far as my opinion on the registry, I can't see any reason to not be able to find out who owns a gun from its serialized information.  I'm sure when a gun owners home gets broken in to they appreciate getting their weapons back when a bad guy gets caught with it. 
FYI, we don't need stronger penalties for firearm offences.  They are pretty harsh now.  What we need are judges that are willing to give them out (or even abide by the mandatory minimum sentences) and that would be a nice start. 
Also IMO there is no reason for the general population to be permitted to carry concealed weapons.  Again, nothing against the legit gun owners.  But imagine a situation where bad guy sees legit gun owner with a piece strapped to his hip.  He waits until buddy goes to the parking lot, smashes him over the head from behind with a bottle and steals his piece.  Now I have yet another gun on the street to worry about.  If your day to day life is so off the rails that you need a gun to defend yourself, perhaps review your life choices or apply for one through the existing laws (ACT III as mentioned)
 
Josh,

If you don't like what I write, don't read it. You'd probably find it just as easy to ignore me, as I find it (very easy) to ignore you.

Thanks guys, but I don't need to be defended from Josh. He's his own worst enemy. He recieved an offer to pay me for my services, but I see he's still quoting me to trigger his rants (and I still haven't received recompense, not even rub & tug rates ;D ). Scream loud enough and people will forget you really did have nothing logical or sensible to say anyway. He's best ignored and forgotten, as he's adding nothing to the discussion anyway.

Wes,

I don't advocate ATC/CCW for just anyone. Education and testing, knowledge and physical should have to take place first. Besides, you don't really need ATC in your own home. For that matter, it doesn't even have to be a pistol. Shotguns will do just fine. Problem being, if you manage to use one effectivley, then you were, almost without a doubt, in violation of the safe storage laws. Then, depending on the political climate and the mood of the Crown, will likely find yourself the focus of the investigation and not the original offender/ intruder, who will likely sue you anyway.........if your a bad shot ;).
 
However, it is nice when I am en route to a violent domestic to be able to run a quick check and see if I'm going into a firearm equipped home

If this was the only reason for the gun registry, I would embrace it. It is not. The Liberals created it as a sop to fearful people and made no bones about it being the first in a number of steps to take the guns away totally. I do not trust the politicians of any stripe to not screw around with the program if it will result in them garnering votes.
 
josh said:
Wes,

Give me a break also.  ::)  Senior member!?  Life experience!?  You don't even know me!?  Don't judge me by the number of posts I have here, or the cute "verbal warning" some likely-militia-type here had the time-of-day ('cause they're obviously unemployed) to give me, because I disagreed and made a point he didn't like.  If wasting your life with thousands of posts on Army.ca is an indication of anykind of "seniority" then you are a sorry lot indeed.  Otherwise, I'll be happy to disagree with you anytime.

A militia basher too!

I would suggest you read Gap's profile, I don't care if you read mine, but do read his, and then you can take your foot out of your mouth.

Your profile is empty.

Its your integrity, not ours, and its obvious that you do not care anyways.

Nice attitude for a regular soldier, that is if you are even that, which I doubt very much.

So, let the meltdown commence.


Wes
 
zipperhead_cop said:
Perhaps a separate "Josh gets sorted out in a pile on thread" would be helpful.   ::)

However, it is nice when I am en route to a violent domestic to be able to run a quick check and see if I'm going into a firearm equipped home. 

Should not every home or situation be taken as if they could be armed, as crims don't register their guns, and there is plenty of edged potential weapons in any home anyways. However if there is registered guns in the house, thats nice to know too.

My CCW issue is I would not John Q Public to have one, and why should he, however legitiment reasons and circumstances may dictate (Judges and certain occupations out of the LEO industry). Allowing anyone to have one for 'protection' is insane. I see we agree here, and thats good, ha!


Cheers,

Wes
 
josh said:
Wes,

Give me a break also.  ::)  Senior member!?  Life experience!?  You don't even know me!?  Don't judge me by the number of posts I have here, or the cute "verbal warning" some likely-militia-type here had the time-of-day ('cause they're obviously unemployed) to give me, because I disagreed and made a point he didn't like.  If wasting your life with thousands of posts on Army.ca is an indication of anykind of "seniority" then you are a sorry lot indeed.  Otherwise, I'll be happy to disagree with you anytime.

Bwahahaha,

Only thing regular about you is the verbal diary from too much mental metamucil!

Most of the people on this thread have forgotten what you will never grasp, specifically the "Likely-militia-type here had the time-of-day ('cause they're obviously unemployed) to give me the cute "verbal warning", because I disagreed and made a point he didn't like. 

josh said:
PTSD from Bosnia???

HAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You have the balls to mouth off about me here and make comments above, but had none to respond for the assinine statement that got you the Verbal.  Being employed, like you know what that actually means...hehehe...

Now Trundle off troll.

Sorry folks, for taking this off the rails again...

dileas

tess
 
Wes, you make a similar point that the Swiss are making.  All swiss citizens are in the army and they all get government issued weapons and ammo to take home.  Whenever the media latches onto stories about those guns being used in domestic abuse/murder, they always say that the same crimes could have been committed with other weapons.  I'm not sure that I completely agree with it, but it does have some validity. 

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/5355582.stm
 
the 48th regulator said:
Bwahahaha,

Only thing regular about you is the verbal diary from too much mental metamucil!


dileas

tess

Hy I had to use your 'meltdown commence' line, ha!


Cheers,

Wes
 
chris06 said:
Wes, you make a similar point that the Swiss are making.  All swiss citizens are in the army and they all get government issued weapons and ammo to take home.  Whenever the media latches onto stories about those guns being used in domestic abuse/murder, they always say that the same crimes could have been committed with other weapons.  I'm not sure that I completely agree with it, but it does have some validity.   

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/5355582.stm

Thats part of the Swiss culture and accepted, and won't happen here in Australia, yet alone Canada. The Swiss have always done that, as its part of rapidly mobilising 1,000,000 men in 24 hrs. Good plan considereing what they could be up against, but not so much now, but in the Cold war days.

Cheers,

Wes
 
>However, it is nice when I am en route to a violent domestic to be able to run a quick check and see if I'm going into a firearm equipped home

What is different about the SOP from entering a home when you don't know one way or the other?  Is a bit of caution thrown to the winds based on the accuracy of what is in the registry's computer memory banks?
 
You know the funny thing about him Wes?  I bet Josh is a photographer.

Dunno, I jus have that feeling, franky is that you?

Tell us Joshy washy, what is your military experience?  Or is it all make believe....

dileas

tess
 
Oh....Great!  Another Stan and Ollie story......"Stanley!"

This topic will definitely need some cleaning up......Lots of work too, as many have mixed nonessential drivel in with very valid points.  Perhaps it is time now to warn everyone to record their valid points for reposting later, after we clean out the trash. 
 
Shyte, you guys are up late, its 2105 Wed here, so that means like 0-dark-thirty Wed am in Canuckistan.

Cheers,

Wes
 
zipperhead_cop said:
Perhaps a separate "Josh gets sorted out in a pile on thread" would be helpful.   ::)

The concealed weapon issue is somewhat lockstep with the whole gun control issue.  If you are qualified enough to get one, you likely are not going to be a big threat. 
As for the "lawful gun owners get picked on because they are easy to find" comment by GreyMatter, I disagree.  I personally know of many people whose permits expired, or moved without notifying the Registry and didn't get charged or lose their weapons.  However, it is nice when I am en route to a violent domestic to be able to run a quick check and see if I'm going into a firearm equipped home. 
So far as my opinion on the registry, I can't see any reason to not be able to find out who owns a gun from its serialized information.  I'm sure when a gun owners home gets broken in to they appreciate getting their weapons back when a bad guy gets caught with it. 

ZC

I certainly agree with your comments about the lack of judges who deal properly with firearm offences. As for the registry, it is a waste of time because it is wildly inaccurate. 2 years to register my .22 and .303!!

All lawfully gun owners are required to have a PAL, therefore that information should pop up when you type in an address, giving you enough information to do your job. If the guns are stolen and the owner has the serial numbers in the report, then they should be traceable if recovered. The only purpose of the registry is for the eventual confiscation of the firearms. Allan Rock made it clear that firearm ownership was not for us common folk.

As for CCW the stats do not support your fears, it is rare for a firearm to be taken from a CCW holder. Anyone in Canada who is interested in getting their CCW will be someone who has a lot of interest and will take the training needed. Is their a possibility that a CCW holder may go bad? Yes there is, but the same applies to police officers, yet I don’t see the need to disarm them. Sad to say but most Police Officers have very poor gun handling skills and no interest in improving them beyond the basic requirements. I also believe that Police Officers should have to get their PAL, so they will at least have a basic knowledge of the Firearms Act. (I have met Officers who incredibility good with their firearms, but they seem to be the minority)

The courts her have recently confirmed the right of self defense still exists in Canada, also the fact that the police departments have no legal obligation to protect the private citizen has also been made clear, why then should a lawful citizen who is willing to take the training be barred from being able to exercise their right of self–defense?     

FYI, we don't need stronger penalties for firearm offences.  They are pretty harsh now.  What we need are judges that are willing to give them out (or even abide by the mandatory minimum sentences) and that would be a nice start. 
Also IMO there is no reason for the general population to be permitted to carry concealed weapons.  Again, nothing against the legit gun owners.  But imagine a situation where bad guy sees legit gun owner with a piece strapped to his hip.  He waits until buddy goes to the parking lot, smashes him over the head from behind with a bottle and steals his piece.  Now I have yet another gun on the street to worry about.  If your day to day life is so off the rails that you need a gun to defend yourself, perhaps review your life choices or apply for one through the existing laws (ACT III as mentioned)
 
Speaking of Allan Rock:

Allan Rock Admits His Registry Cost to Much

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

He finally admits the cost were to high, but takes no responsibility for the fiasco, by passing the buck, and claiming ignorance. However, he's still not above twisting the stats to absolve himself of the total mess he created, so he can sleep at night after he screwed millions of the Canadian public with his puritanical, heavy handed policies. Just another case of out of control, power tripping politicians that push their personal agenda, to garner votes and points, over the true facts and wishes of the general population.

http://shopping.windsorstar.canada.com/SS/Page.aspx?secid=30490&pagenum=39&sstarg=&facing=false&

Excerpt from the article

“As minister of justice, Rock was thrust front and centre into the media spotlight when he introduced the controversial – and some would say disastrous – gun control legislation to a skeptical nation.
But he’d taken over as health minister by the time the problems became apparent and the numbers started adding up, and it was very much someone else’s jurisdiction.
His verdict today? “Gun control costs too much,” he says flatly. “I’m not sure what went wrong. Honestly, I don’t know.”“But in its defence, I have to remind people that the police had been calling for this for 10 years. Don’t forget, in 1995-96, every six days a woman was shot to death, almost always in her home, almost always by someone she knew, almost always with a legally owned rifle or shotgun.”
In 2002, Statistics Canada reported the number of women killed had dropped by 67%, and for that Rock thanks the legislation.
“That’s a two-thirds reduction,” says Rock. “Two-thirds. It was the right thing to do.”

The stats don't stand up to  scrutiny. The reduction can't be tied to the Registry.


edit to fix link
 
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