The School Funding Thread- Merged

[the 48th regulator]

So are you saying catholic values are better then a jews values or muslims or whatever. Are atheists and agnostics without values? where are you going with this?

No just proving that you are spouting opinion, and want us to accept it as a fact.  I went to public schooling my whole life.  I thought it was an excellent education, and I learned many values. 

So now this gives me the right to tear it apart to suit my arguments here?  I have previously posted that I am appalled that the current state of the Public system is in dire state.  And am even more appalled that people's answer, on this thread, is to Crush the Catholic school system to gain that balance of Money to band aid fix the wrongs of the system.

Look at the system internally and fix the administration.

Well look at Serbia. Many muslims serb were killed. or look at Bosnia, christians were too. and it was called ethnic cleansing... You are going off topic and nit picking. You stated Religion is not an ethnicity, I said it is. Read any definition and you will find religion. And catholism out of most religions is one of the most structured and defined religions with variants non-existant or opposed. Pope benedict even said that catholics must follow the hellenic 'tradition' and tradition is part of one heritage and ethnicity as well.

So it had nothing to do with the other points of your definition of Ethnicity

common genealogy or ancestry or recognition by others as a distinct group, or by common cultural, linguistic, religious, or physical traits.

Yes I am nitpicking your "Broad Stroked" statements.

dileas

tess

 

[eerickso]

And Catholic Taxpayers have a free education?

Thanks for the input....

dileas

tess

You are putting words into my mouth, I am saying that I would have to pay more.

 

[PMedMoe]

Okay.  I have been wading through the posts here, trying to consider everyone's point of view.

Check here for admission requirements to the Toronto Catholic District School Board (for elementary school):

Non-Catholic children of non-Catholic parents are not eligible for admittance to Toronto Catholic District School Board elementary schools.

Let's take a different look at this.  If we were to change the word Catholic to something else (religious, ethnic or whatever), is this practice not discriminatory?

By the way, I am not being anti-Catholic here, I am being anti-discrimination.

 

[the 48th regulator]

You are putting words into my mouth, I am saying that I would have to pay more.

You are losing me here.

How so?

Or maybe what you should be saying is the Ontario Government is overcharging you, to keep it equal to our taxes, so therefore you should get a credit?

Please help me understand your statement.

dileas

tess

 

[eerickso]

I am saying that if I want to send my kids to a protestant school, I would have to pay more than a catholic.

 

[the 48th regulator]

I am saying that if I want to send my kids to a protestant school, I would have to pay more than a catholic.

Why would you?

Okay.  I have been wading through the posts here, trying to consider everyone's point of view.

Check here for admission requirements to the Toronto Catholic District School Board (for elementary school):
Let's take a different look at this.  If we were to change the word Catholic to something else (religious, ethnic or whatever), is this practice not discriminatory?

By the way, I am not being anti-Catholic here, I am being anti-discrimination.

Very good point, what would the valid reason be to attend a Catholic school, as non-Catholic?  And please provide proof that there has been a case for someone not being accepted, that has caused a challenge to the non-Catholic.

Just wondering if protecting the democratic right to do as you please, or to attend an educational institution.

dileas

tess

 

[R.O.S]

No just proving that you are spouting opinion, and want us to accept it as a fact.  I went to public schooling my whole life.  I thought it was an excellent education, and I learned many values. 
So now this gives me the right to tear it apart to suit my arguments here?  I have previously posted that I am appalled that the current state of the Public system is in dire state.  And am even more appalled that people's answer, on this thread, is to Crush the Catholic school system to gain that balance of Money to band aid fix the wrongs of the system.

Wait maybe we are misunderstanding eachother. I believe that catholic values are not better then the values of non-catholics, is that really opinion. But if you want facts here we go.

Fact: Catholics get special treatment
Fact: Non-catholics have to pay for catholic teachings

I do not want people of other religions or no religions to pay for others. Religion is a private choice, and sould not be burdened on others that have not chosen that religion. It is not about the money that drives my opinion, it is the want for every person to be treated fairly and that people who are born from a certain background be punished for it.

 

[the 48th regulator]

Wait maybe we are misunderstanding eachother. I believe that catholic values are not better then the values of non-catholics, is that really opinion. But if you want facts here we go.

Fact: Catholics get special treatment
Fact: Non-catholics have to pay for catholic teachings

I do not want people of other religions or no religions to pay for others. Religion is a private choice, and sould not be burdened on others that have not chosen that religion. It is not about the money that drives my opinion, it is the want for every person to be treated fairly and that people who are born from a certain background be punished for it.

Fact: Catholics get special treatment  What is the special treatment
Fact: Non-catholics have to pay for catholic teachings  And Catholics have to pay for Non Catholic funding.

I have no opinion to catholism, and have not put an opinion forward. I just wrote that "good values" are not better at religious schools.

No I guess your facts are published, please provide links.

dileas

tess

 

[PMedMoe]

Very good point, what would the valid reason be to attend a Catholic school, as non-Catholic?

Because it's closer to home, they offer better education, it's on their bus run? I have no idea.  But they should be able to attend as a Catholic student can attend a non-Catholic school.

And please provide proof that there has been a case for someone not being accepted, that has caused a challenge to the non-Catholic.

Sorry, don't have any.  My daughter attends public school in N.B.

Just wondering if protecting the democratic right to do as you please, or to attend an educational institution.

Huh?

 

[R.O.S]

I am saying that if I want to send my kids to a protestant school, I would have to pay more than a catholic.

Why would you?

Why would he? Why would someone want to send someone to catholic school… same reason. Well, 44th your bouncing around to quickly to understand were you sit. Leftcoaster provides a valid point that it costs more to be a protestant (or whatever) then it does to be a catholic and that is just plain discrimination. If catholics want catholic education then let them pay for it, not others.

 

[the 48th regulator]

So your worry is based on heresay, not what has happened.

That is my point.  

Rural Catholic school, without a publice school, yes I agree they should be allowed.  Does this exist?  I don't know, never heard of it though, so my guess is that the situation does not exist.

I will stand correct, if someone can provide me with the proff.

Just wondering if protecting the democratic right to do as you please, or to attend an educational institution.

As you asnwered your question, with regards to locality, my question was in regards tot he fundemental reason behind a Non-Catholic wanting to go to a Catholic school.  Or a denominational school of any kind for that matter.

dileas

tess

 

[Bruce Monkhouse]

Fact: Catholics get special treatment  What is the special treatment

Tess,
I know you, and even though you're about as stubborn as a mule, you really are not this dumb.

Catholic.....gets to go to their  religious themed school with just the tax dollars he/she has put in the system.
Muslim.....must pay out of pocket to go to their religious themed school even though they have payed the same amount of tax dollars as the person above.
Jewish...same
Etc......same

....and both my kids go to Catholic schools and my wife works in one...............hard to say I'm just being "anti- Catholic".

 

[the 48th regulator]

Why would he? Why would someone want to send someone to catholic school… same reason. Well, 44th your bouncing around to quickly to understand were you sit. Leftcoaster provides a valid point that it costs more to be a protestant (or whatever) then it does to be a catholic and that is just plain discrimination. If catholics want catholic education then let them pay for it, not others.

What are you saying ROS??

My question was "Why would you pay more" not why would you want to send them to a protestant school.

If you have nothing to offer but insults, please sit aside and read.

dileas

tess

ps it's 48th, ROS....

 

[the 48th regulator]

Tess,
I know you, and even though you're about as stubborn as a mule, you really are not this dumb.

Catholic.....gets to go to their  religious themed school with just the tax dollars he/she has put in the system.
Muslim.....must pay out of pocket to go to their religious themed school even though they have payed the same amount of tax dollars as the person above.
Jewish...same
Etc......same

....and both my kids go to Catholic schools and my wife works in one...............hard to say I'm just being "anti- Catholic".

Bruce,

Which is why I am for the proposal of John Tory....


People have been targeting the Catholic system, and the Politicians in this thread.  Go after the Public administrators I say.

Stating the Catholic system is "special" or supported by "their" tax dollars.  What about my tax dollars, and disgust with the deterioration of the public system on my dime?

That is why I am stubborn.

dileas

tess

 

[R.O.S]

Fact: Catholics get special treatment  What is the special treatment
Fact: Non-catholics have to pay for catholic teachings  And Catholics have to pay for Non Catholic funding.

Special treatment that they recieve funding from the public while others do not. Why can a Jew not recieve the same treatment as catholics and npt suffer a huge financial burden for being Jewish and wanting to learn the jewish religion alongside normal studies?


And yes everyone HAS to pay towards public schools, and hospitals... its called being a citizen.

No I guess your facts are published, please provide links.

So you believe that as a catholic your values are better then that of a Jews or muslim? Are you saying that people who go the religious schools are better valued people?

 

[the 48th regulator]

Special treatment that they recieve funding from the public while others do not. Why can a Jew not recieve the same treatment as catholics and npt suffer a huge financial burden for being Jewish and wanting to learn the jewish religion alongside normal studies?


And yes everyone HAS to pay towards public schools, and hospitals... its called being a citizen.


So you believe that as a catholic your values are better then that of a Jews or muslim? Are you saying that people who go the religious schools are better valued people?

ROS

Huh??

dileas

tess

 

[R.O.S]

What are you saying ROS??

My question was "Why would you pay more" not why would you want to send them to a protestant school.

You pay more because it is not partially funded from public funds. Private schools are expensive, and a protestant school is a private school.

 

[Bruce Monkhouse]

  Go after the Public administrators I say.

and disgust with the deterioration of the public system on my dime?

Funny thing that, I forgot to mention that my oldest actually now goes to a High school in Hamilton that is public, and my youngest will start there next year as the local Catholic High School in Cambridge is an absolute disaster.
[EDIT; should mention in case someone up on his geography is going "What?"...they go in French]

Any school can suck based on the Principal and his staff................funny how you don't mind insulting the public system with a broad brush, but when others have done the same to the Separate System, its "anti-Catholic".

 

[R.O.S]

Huh??

ME - I have no opinion to catholism, and have not put an opinion forward. I just wrote that "good values" are not better at religious schools.

YOU - No I guess your facts are published, please provide links.

You wanted facts that catholic values are no better then other values. I stated simply that just questioning this makes me question if you believe catholic values are better then others. My comment to put it simply as it seems i must is "the catholic value system is no better or worse then the values of jews, muslims, others, atheists or agnostics". Your questioning of such statements would be as if you said "prove to me that blacks and whites are equal". In this day and age I don't feel I should be proving equality, but sometimes I wonder.

 

[the 48th regulator]

You pay more because it is not partially funded from public funds. Private schools are expensive, and a protestant school is a private school.

Oh okay,

I stand corrected;

Let me see if I understand the ontario premier. If I want my child to have good protestant values,  I need to pay? It is really unfortunate that he made this choice, he had the opportunity to do what a premier should do: lead.

Leftcoaster was talking about private Protestant schools.

I stand corrected, then I would agree with his statement then, hence why I believe in Tory's proposal, read statement above to Bruce M.

Bruce,

Let's face it, anyone I have targeted as being Anti-Catholic, was thinly veiling their own argument.  And if you will notice, I did receive an admission to that.  Remember?

dileas

tess