Vision Questions Megathread, Categories, Problems etc.

[SeanPaul_031]

To qualify for sniper you need V1 as well I assume?

 

[LL]

Thanks a lot.

 

[fir_na_tine]

Combat units accept as poor as V3.

Just out of curiosity, and sorry to bother you, do you by chance know what are the eyesight numbers are for V3?

 

[Jamphone]

The prescription required to pass seems to vary. Two people with -4 eyesight do not nessacarily see the same without glasses, one could qualify as V3 and the other could not. However, as a rule of thumb from what I've been told by those who've been accepted/rejected: If you're better than -4, nothing to worry about, you'll make V3. I'm -5 and I made it in. However, I only know of one other person with eyesight as poor as mine who made the cut. I know of -4.5 who have failed the test. However, if you're like a friend of mine who has -8, you might want to look at another trade.

 

[fir_na_tine]

Thanks for all of your help!

I don't think that I'm to bad off in regards to my eyesight, I just wanted to make sure that I wasn't going to be severely limiting myself in regards to trades and the like.

Thanks again!

 

[BDG.CalgHighrs]

Whatever happened to the  /20 and /8 systems?

 

[SeanPaul_031]

Why would you presume that and say it like you know something?Ears open mouth off.

WTF is wrong with you? Could you not see that I was posting that as a question? I wrote "I assume" for the same reasons why I would assume that you need V1 eyesight to be a pilot. Again, it was a QUESTION hence the QUESTION MARK.

Ears open mouth off? Here Ill rearrange that for you. Brain on.

 

[Jamphone]

The big E on the chart should be 6/60. They want 6/120, so I'm not sure how the doctor figures that part out, but I'm sure they have some system. If you can see the big E, squinting or not, you'll pass. (I squinted   )

Roughly 6/120 is -4, but like I explained before, perscription is relative and does not translate to the /20 feet /6 metres system well.

 

[fir_na_tine]

The big E on the chart should be 6/60. They want 6/120, so I'm not sure how the doctor figures that part out, but I'm sure they have some system. If you can see the big E, squinting or not, you'll pass. (I squinted   )

Roughly 6/120 is -4, but like I explained before, perscription is relative and does not translate to the /20 feet /6 metres system well.

Sweet! I can read all the way to the 4th line! I'm so passing that!   ;D

 

[dearryan]

hi there guys,

In response to Jamphone's post of:"However, if you're like a friend of mine who has -8, you might want to look at another trade". I believe you might not want to find another trade, but more so another career. Or consider some refractive surgery. I had my /PT/interview yesterday. I was also supposed to complete the medical at the same time. However the med staff PO looked at my persciption and said."we have a problem". This is due to the fact that I have a -7.25 persription. He clearly showed me the policy that states anything over -7.00 diopters (something like that) is V5. No enrollment in ANY trade. I decided not to do my medical at that time, but to get the refractive surgery done ASAP (scheduled for end of month as on this morn). The wait time assuming that there is no complications is 3 months not 6. Your doc will have to sign off on a form (Request for Medical Information, refractive Surgery) stating that there are no restrictions or follow-up requirement, at the 3 month point...no sooner or they (CF) will not even look at you. Currently there are (according to the Med staff) only two trades that are NOT available to persons having had laser surgery, they are PILOT, and COMBAT DIVER. I was informed this is due to the pressures on the eye at these two pretty extreme MOCS. After talking to 3 very credible surgeons, the omission of these two jobs doesn't make a whole lot of sense due to the fact that refractive surgery does not change the structural integrity of the eye what so ever. When laser eye surgery first came out the CF did not recognize it at all, in fact you could be found unfit if you had had it done prior to applying. Of coarse they had no solid research on the subject as it was a new technology. Now they not only will allow it, but many of the black listed MOCs are now eligible (Air Navigator). Maybe one day Pilots will be allowed as well.

Hope this helps anyone considering refractive surgery.

Later

Ryan

 

[scottyeH?]

I'm forsure going into SigOp or Infantry. I was wonder I don't know how bad my eyes are acording to the V Scales, I think I -1 in both eyes.
I was just wondering if you can go to BMQ and after your BMQ is completed get LASIK surgery or will the recruiters just tell you to come back after your surgery and the required 6month wait?

Thanks.

 

[dearryan]

SottyeH,

If you have permission from your CO you can have laser eye correction done after you have completed Basic (as I was informed by CF med staff). However -1 is not very much of a perscription. I am pretty certain that you would be acceptable for both of those trades w/ your vision. I saw your age in your profile....as I have researched this surgery extensively (having it done at end of month) your age might hamper you getting LASIK done for a few more years yet. Many docs like to wait (suggested) until your early 20's. The chart is available somewhere on this site (i used it)do a search, check your trades requirements, and have your civi eye doc match it to the V scale. Thats what I did. Found out I'm V5.

FYI....the required wait/recovery period is 3 months (minimum). But if you wanted to wait 6 go nuts. I sure as heck wouldn't you wait long enough as is.

Later

Ryan

 

[scottyeH?]

Yes, I know your supposed to wait till your the age of 18(turning 18 in Oct) and going to an eye doctor to make sure your eyes have matured fully(the most important part), before getting the surgery. I'm handing in my application on Monday, and all going well and IF get selected for BMQ for the Fall, It wouldn't be till about December/January when I would go ahead with surgery.

btw: I'm required to wear my glasses/contacts when I drive. And know i think of it I'm almost nearing a -1.8, if that gives anyone an idea.

Thanks.


P.S. Good Luck with the surgery. I hear it's worth every penny!

 

[aesop081]

..... Currently there are (according to the Med staff) only two trades that are NOT available to persons having had laser surgery, they are PILOT, and COMBAT DIVER.

Combat diver is not a trade.....just so there is no confusion.

Also, whoever told you that the restriction is due to pressure on the eye ( speaking for pilots) is out to lunch IMHO.   The pressure on the pilot's eye up front in a CP-140 is no different than the pressure on my eyes and i'm 8 feet behind the pilot ( i require only V3 and i can get laser eye surgery with certain short-term restrictions afterwards).   The vision standards are the same for all pilots ( as it stands now) wether they fly fast jets, helicopters or multi-engine types.

This has been dicussed at lenght in the air force forum.   The reasoning behind the restriction on laser eye surgery has been discussed there with some good ideas on this being proposed.   Suggest you take a read as a few pilots put their $0.02 in that thread.

 

[dearryan]

aesop081,

I just might have a read. This info was word for word from a "PA" at the recruiting center. I thought Combat Diver sounded like a new one!
But i most certainaly will read the other forum.

R

 

[aesop081]

aesop081,

I just might have a read. This info was word for word from a "PA" at the recruiting center. I thought Combat Diver sounded like a new one!
But i most certainaly will read the other forum.

R

Combat diver is a specialty course offered to 043 combat engineers only.

The vision requirements for aircrew is something that generates alot of myths, to which medical personel are not immune.  Laser eye surgery is a relatively new issue for the CF to deal with and as time goes on, i have no doubt that the policy will evolve.

 

[jr352]

Not sure if this is the best place to post this question, but here goes...

Anyone know current policy on laser corrective surgery for OT to SAR tech?

I'm aware that for "other aircrew" it is acceptable. But I'm also told that for Clearance Diver and such  MOC's it is exclusive. SAR tech entails diving duties also, but I can't seem to find anything that specifically restricts entry into this ( SAR) trade due to laser correction.

I'm a V-3 and considering OT to this trade if surgery can get me to meet the Med Cat (SAR tech is V-2).

Thanks

 

[dearryan]

jr352,

  It is also my goal to do SAR tech! A physician at the recruiting center has put in a call to the cheif warrant of that trade for me inquiring about this....he should get back to me soon. I will pass the info on.

Later

R

 

[old medic]

VISION CATEGORY AND ACUITY

Army.ca currently has over 20 threads regarding vision categories, refractions and minimum categories.
Usually, these take the form of "I have ____ vision. Can I still be a infanteer/pilot/diver"?
or  "I have _____ vision, what is my category? Can I still be a _______"?

Here is a short guide to help you answer your own questions on vision categories without starting
another new thread.

If you currently wear prescribed eyewear, you will need to bring both your glasses and a copy of
your most recent eyewear prescription to the testing.

An visual acuity test is a part of every recruiting medical. The result of this exam is expressed by
a vision category. The vision category is only one part of the medical category. It is expressed
as being V1, V2, V3, V4 or V5.  The V stands for Vision.  V1 is for good acuity, while a rating of
V5 would be very poor.  To be enrolled, you must be V4 or above, as the V5 category does not
meet the common enrolment standard.

There is also a CV category for  Colour Vision. If your interested in colour vision, try this forum:
http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/37585.0.html

To see what each military occupation requires for vision (and other categories), check here:
http://www.forces.gc.ca/health-sante/pd/cfp-pfc-154/pdf/AN-Eapp1-eng.pdf

There are actually two acuity tests. A test for distance acuity that everyone must complete,
and a test for near vision that only Pilots, Tac Hel Obs and SAR techs must complete in addition
to distance testing.

The near vision testing for those three occupations is only conducted by  ophthalmologists,
ophthalmic technicians, or optometrists.  Near vision is determined using "TIMES ROMAN" type
and is assessed at reading distance (30-50 cm) and at 100 cm. The 100 cm distance is important
in the aircraft cockpit and similar environments and for users of CRT displays.

For further details on vision testing for air crew trades, see this document (March 2008):
http://forums.army.ca/forums/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=69305.0;attach=25147

The distance vision testing that everyone must take can be conducted at the CFRC or any
Medical Inspection Room. It can be done two ways.  Using a projector that displays slides,
or using a standard eye chart on the wall.


The results of the distance acuity test will fit into one of these categories from the Medical
Standards Manual:

GRADE	BETTER EYE Uncorrected	OTHER EYE Uncorrected	BETTER EYE Corrected	OTHER EYE Corrected
V1	6/6	up to 6/9	N/A	N/A
V2	up to 6/18	up to 6/18
		OR	6/6	6/9
	up to 6/12	up to 6/30
V3	up to 6/60	up to 6/60	6/6	6/9
V4	Worse than 6/60	Worse than 6/60	6/9	6/60

V5	This grading is assigned to those whose visual acuity is worse than the V4 grading or when the refractive error exceeds plus or minus 7.00 dioptres (+/- 7.00 D) spherical equivalent in the better eye regardless of the uncorrected distant vision. ​

NOTE 1: Those who do not meet the V1 standard of uncorrected visual acuity must have
a (current) refractive error measured.

NOTE 2: The spherical equivalent is equal to: (cylinder/2) + sphere.

NOTE 3: An ophthalmologist must examine (fundoscopy) those whose refractive error
exceeds plus or minus 7.00 dioptres (+/- 7.00 D) spherical equivalent in either
eye to rule out any complications.

Testing procedure from CFP-154:

3. The procedure for testing visual acuity is as follows:
    a. vision for each eye is tested separately, with the other eye occluded (covered); and
    b. candidates must not be allowed to squeeze their eyelids or to posture their head as an aid to vision.

4. The visual acuity for each eye is recorded as a fraction, using the number 6 as the numerator, and, for the
denominator, the number of the lowest (smallest letters) line on the chart which can be read without error.
Thus, if the lowest line which the subject can read bears the number 9, visual acuity for that eye is 6/9. The
grading of distant visual acuity is presented in Appendix 1.

5. When uncorrected vision is below acceptable standards, the possibility of correction to normal shall be
tested with the candidate's own spectacles. If correction to acceptable standards is not possible by these
means, the candidate shall be referred for the opinion of a qualified ophthalmologist.

Some Explanation

Acuity is represented as a fraction, with the distance at which you are standing being the numerator (top part of fraction).
Not all eye charts are the same. Standard Snellen charts have you stand a distance of 20 feet back and express the fraction
as 20/x. Metric charts (like the CF charts) have you stand a distance of 6 meters back. (6.09 meters is actually
20 feet) and express the fraction as 6/x. Note that there are charts that specify a test distance of only 4 meters (4/x).
Likewise there are Snellen charts that specify a testing distance of 10 feet. Examiners should be familiar with the
chart they are using.

The bottom number of the fraction represents the distance that the average eye can see the letters on a certain line
of the eye chart. For example, the line marked 6/30 should be visable to the average eye at a distance of 30 meters.

Here is how the fractions equate:

METRIC	SNELLEN
6/3	20/10
6/4.5	20/15
6/6	20/20
6/7.5	20/25
6/9	20/30
6/12	20/40
6/15	20/50
6/30	20/100
6/60	20/200

REFRACTION vs. CATEGORY

Occasionally a thread pops up with someone asking something similar to "I have a -1.25 refraction,
what vision category will I have"?

Answer: We can't really tell you with any great accuracy. The two things are only loosely related. This is why we
ask for a refraction along with your acuity. The reverse is also true.  We can't take your acuity score
and accurately predict your refraction.

The refraction is only useful regarding correction of the lens. It does not tell us enough about your
visual acuity. for example, you might need a -xx.x lens correction, but numerous other eye problems
(opaqueness, retina) can have a big bearing on your acuity.

You might be able to use the chart below as a rough guide. Be warned it works best for myopia
(nearsightedness) because hyperopic (farsighted) people can focus and compensate for a certain
amount of their prescription.

Fraction	Estimated Prescription
6/3​	N/A​
6/4.5​	N/A​
6/6​	N/A to -0.25​
6/9​	-0.50​
6/12​	-0.75​
6/15​	-1.00 to -1.25​
6/30​	-1.75 to -2.00​
6/60​	-2.00 to -2.50​

TERMS:

Accommodation    - Process where the eye increases optical power to maintain a clear focus on an object
Astigmatism        - The cornea or the lens of the eye is not perfectly spherical.
Axis                    - The direction of a Cylinder correction in a refraction. Expressed in degrees from 1 to 180.
Cornea                - The transparent front part of the eye that covers the iris, pupil, and anterior chamber
Cycloplegia (Cycloplegic) - Paralysis of the ciliary muscle in the eye, affecting the ability to focus.
Cylinder              - The secondary correction of the lens in a refraction. See Axis above.
Diopter                - A unit of measurement of the optical power of a lense.
dv                      - Distance Vision
Hyperopia (Hyperopic) - farsighted. Usually a convex lense with a positive diopter.
Myopia (Myopic)        - nearsighted. Usuallly a concave lense with a negative diopter.
nv                            - Near Vision
OD (oculus dexter)      - the right eye
OS (oculus sinister)    - the left eye
OU                            - both eyes
PL or Plano                - No refractive error
Refractive Error (Refraction) usually expressed in Diopters
Retina                      - Back of the eye containing the photoreceptor cells (rods and cones) which convert light into nervous signals.
Sphere                    - The spherical error in a refraction. The Main part of a lens correction. Expressed in + or - diopters.
Visual acuity            - The ability to see and discriminate a certain size target at a specified distance.


SUGGESTED READING:
http://www.yorku.ca/eye/toc.htm


Please PM me with errors or corrections.

<edit: Updated to reflect standard changes effective 24 June 2005>

 

[x-grunt]

Excellent info. Thanks for the effort in putting this together.