War In Iraq Debate

[Enzo]

TM - " what is not generally known it appears is that the largest proven oil reserves in the world is in an area just north of Iraq, the are is Known As the Caspian Basin. "

"I realise that the concept of a compound, complex sentence, is perhaps beyond the ken of more simple folk, I will try to restrain myself in the future."


TM, I‘m sorry dude, but you are becoming your own worst enemy. Before you critique others you should preview your posts to correct your many grammatical errors. I raise this point to counter your condescending tone. Your demeanor affects the points upon which you are trying to base your arguments. As a certain politician recently highlighted, expressing one‘s views in anything other than an educated manner can reflect poorly upon that person.

Cheers...

 

[SFontaine]

(Apology in advance if some of this crap has already been shot down, I just skimmed through the post)

Iraq‘s WMD‘s were supplied by the US, France and Germany, there is no doubt in that.

Really?
http://projects.sipri.se/armstrade/IRQ_IMPRTS_73-02.pdf

http://newsmax.com/archives/articles/2003/3/17/123424.shtml


Try to learn the facts before spouting off left wing crap.

Somalia and Kosovo go to prove that with a responsible leader the US still can enforce peace and provide aid around the world.

Yup President George HW Bush went into Somalia to help the Somalis and then all the efforts and sucesses of the missions were effed over by the Clinton Adminstration and their cowardice.

The US is about oil not about humanitarian etc.

Right. WW1 and 2 was for oil, Korea was for oil, Vietnam was for oil, Desert Storm was for oil, Somalia and Kosovo were for oil and Afghanistan.. Yup you guessed it. Oil.

All this and most a large percent of americans say "Oh leave him alone he hasn‘t done anything to us."

The reason the US cared about the plight of the Iraqi people and the threat Saddam Hussein posed AFTER 9/11 was because the US now genuinely fears that there are people out there who can do damage and people out there who kill civilians without due cause.
The way everything was percevied changed after 9/11

It is a shame to see people acting like a lynch mob, a very American trait by the way. I always thought Canadians were more inclined to follow the rule of law, it however appears that "Rambo" mentality rears it‘s stupid head all to often

That doesn‘t even make any sense
1) How are the defenders of the Iraq war being a lynch mob? We‘re just shutting down some of the uninformed BS that some of your little friends are spouting.

2) How are lynch mobs an American trait? I can tell you right now that during the Canadian-American Olympic Games a friend of mine said "I don‘t really like team Canada to be honest" and had to run from a group of roughly 10-15 people intent on hurting him.

Yeah very American trait.

 

[pissedpat]

Originally posted by SFontaine:
[qb] (Apology in advance if some of this crap has already been shot down, I just skimmed through the post)

Iraq‘s WMD‘s were supplied by the US, France and Germany, there is no doubt in that.

Really?
http://projects.sipri.se/armstrade/IRQ_IMPRTS_73-02.pdf

http://newsmax.com/archives/articles/2003/3/17/123424.shtml


Try to learn the facts before spouting off left wing crap.
[/qb]

Not quite sure what you were getting at with this first comments and the listing of web sites so I clicked them. Now how does a report titled "conventional arms sales" relate to weapons of mass destruction? The second article is even less useful, it fails entirely to mention WMDs. Near the end it justifies the giving of tacticle information to Iraq because the author claims that Ayatollah Khomeini was "the greatest fear in the gulf" the report then goes on to boast about how America gave Iran conventional weapons to beat Saddam. How kind. Never mentioned the chemicals that america gave to Saddam to support his WMD plans though. The best part of your post has to be that the first report disproves the second report. The basis of the second article is that no american items are in use in the Iraqi military but the sales report in the first documents helecopter sales. I laughed when I got to the bottom of the page and saw the link for boycotting France.

 

[SFontaine]

The second article explains all the weapons givin to Iraq by other countries, and America is not there. They‘d mentioned weapon supplies if the US had.

And do you have any concrete evidence the United States gave Saddam any such weapons anyway?

 

[Sh0rtbUs]

Do you have evidence that the US didnt?

We the public dont know all the little details to situations such as these, and for good reason. its the countries duty to vote in someone they feel would handle such information with discretion and to the benefit of the country. The American people have voted in Bush and now they must deal with the fact that they arent going to be given every little snippit of info to satisfy them.

This is why Im baffled that these Anti-War activists actually feel they have a valid stand. The amount of information they base their position on is quite small.

Theres always more to a situation such as Iraq, and just because Bush doesnt come out with Documents from the Pentagon and read em over CNN, doesnt mean they dont have a reason to go to war.

People need to start trusting their leaders to do the right thing, after all..they did vote him in.

just my 2 cents.

 

[pissedpat]

Originally posted by SFontaine:
[qb] The second article explains all the weapons givin to Iraq by other countries, and America is not there. They‘d mentioned weapon supplies if the US had.

And do you have any concrete evidence the United States gave Saddam any such weapons anyway? [/qb]

Ummmm, would you count the first article as concrete evidence? It clearly states that a number of american choppers were sent and used by the Iraqi military. Perhapse they didn‘t mention that because they were biased? As for chemical weapons, even the right wing flag flying Bush loving media groups have aknowledged that it gave the essential chemicals to Iraq.

Originally posted by Infanteer:
[qb] http://www.fas.org/nuke/guide/iraq/cw/program.htm

I see that Iraq produced its own stocks. Originally it imported the chemicals, but big deal, I could go to Costco and get most of those things. Unless your going to offer positive proof that a Western country trucked in mustard gas, I still say your out to lunch.
[/qb]

Hmmmm, try as I might but I couldn‘t find: methyl phosphonyl chloride, phosphorous pentasulphide, ethylene oxide and di-isopropylamine listed anywhere on the costco web site, are these items that you have to go to the costo and pick up your self? :dontpanic:

 

[Sh0rtbUs]

could anybody here provide a source listing the chemicals sold to Iraq and what date? i believe it was 1984, but im not sure. i‘ve searched everywhere and am unsuccessful.

 

[Infanteer]

Check www.fas.org

Good site to start with for all matters military.

 

[Sh0rtbUs]

thanx.

 

[Sgt.Fitzpatrick]

I think so Hussien was  I the need of a good ass kicking and he killed to many women and children.Hussien is the devil and the Hittler of are time.

:gunner:  DIE!                :evil:

 

[Nox]

About 100,000 Iraqi civilians - half of them women and children - have died in Iraq since the invasion, mostly as a result of airstrikes by US forces, according to the first reliable study of the death toll from Iraqi and US public health experts. At Saddams most ruthless time in power he was alleged to have gased over 10,000 kurds in the kurd attempt of a rebellion. Saddam is going on trial for his crimes but his crime is 1/10 of bush's in term of death toll. Should Bush be brought to account for his crimes against humanity?

When will the killing end?

 

[tabernac]

HEY HEY, look who decided to show up...

 

[Sh0rtbUs]

The killing will end when the insurgents decide so..

 

[Bograt]

About 100,000 Iraqi civilians - half of them women and children - have died in Iraq since the invasion, mostly as a result of airstrikes by US forces, according to the first reliable study of the death toll from Iraqi and US public health experts. At Saddams most ruthless time in power he was alleged to have gased over 10,000 kurds in the kurd attempt of a rebellion. Saddam is going on trial for his crimes but his crime is 1/10 of bush's in term of death toll. Should Bush be brought to account for his crimes against humanity?

When will the killing end?

sniff sniff. Do you smell that? Did someone just fart?

 

[Whiskey_Dan]

Politics shouldn't get involved in war, thats a dangerous thing to do. You dont see senators with children on the ground in Iraq.
Let soldiers fight soldiers, they're just doing their job, what they were told to do. It is war, and civilians will die, they're trying to bring peace to the country.

 

[Dogboy]

or when the invaders leave

its a two sided coin remember.

would you just sit at home if a foreign power came in changed our government ruin our economy and put someone they like in power.
ya I'm sher you'd just lay down and say nothing.
not that all the insergens are good guys but you've got to admirer they guts tho

 

[Big Foot]

No matter how you look at it, innocent civilians are being killed and theres almost nothing that can be done to prevent it. What a shame...

 

[48Highlander]

or when the invaders leave

its a two sided coin remember.

would you just sit at home if a foreign power came in changed our government ruin our economy and put someone they like in power.
ya I'm sher you'd just lay down and say nothing.
not that all the insergens are good guys but you've got to admirer they guts tho

If the Americans had invaded, captured Jean Chretien, disbanded parliament, implemented a proper democracy, and helped properly re-arm our military....I don't think you'd see too many of us complaining  ;D

 

[Northern Touch]

About 100,000 Iraqi civilians - half of them women and children - have died in Iraq since the invasion, mostly as a result of airstrikes by US forces, according to the first reliable study of the death toll from Iraqi and US public health experts. At Saddams most ruthless time in power he was alleged to have gased over 10,000 kurds in the kurd attempt of a rebellion. Saddam is going on trial for his crimes but his crime is 1/10 of bush's in term of death toll. Should Bush be brought to account for his crimes against humanity?

When will the killing end?

Where do you get this "reliable" study from?

 

[tabernac]

"If the Americans had invaded, captured Jean Chretien, disbanded parliament, implemented a proper democracy, and helped properly re-arm our military....I don't think you'd see too many of us complaining."

Well said ;D