WARNINGS / Solutions (?) Ceasation of Class C

[George Wallace]

Reservists face some serious Pay Issues when they Deploy.

1.  Numerous Reservists face the problem of having thousands of dollars recovered from their pay, sometimes years later, due to the problems with the change overs from one Pay System to another.

2.  Numerous Reservists face problems with having to renew their Class C documentation on a three month basis in order to keep being paid while they recover from injuries incurred while on Tour.

3.  Numerous Reservists face Taxation problems, after doing a TAV, and the correct deductions not being made/allotted.

These are all issues that Reservists should be aware of.  This topic is a means to point out the issues, and post some of the solutions, such as properly documenting the problems, and having the Chain of Command address them.  In some cases, members may have to use the CF Ombudsman to find resolution.

 

[Staff Weenie]

George, as usual you raise good points. I just went on Cl C once again - and once again it was a mess. They couldn't stop my Cl B in time, so I owe 11 days of pay back - no idea when they'll claw it back. Then, they took over 1.5 months to actually pay me my Cl C. This is pretty much the same thing that happened to me last time I went Cl C. Claims are just as much of a mess.

I cannot fathom how the system can be so perpetually screwed up - I'm led to believe that several hundred Cl C troops from each Roto experience this crap.

Pay is not the same complex math that puts the space shuttle into orbit.....

We need a better way of doing business - now!

 

[Teeps74]

This one is near and dear to my heart, as I felt this trap close on my throat last year... Only the patience, and sound guidance of our wonderful clerks (I love you guys) that I had direct contact with kept me from driving to Ottawa.

Early identification of problems is key. We have to know our pay scales before we expect pay in the account, and if you are not getting your pay statement as you are legally supposed to, you need to request it from your CoC (of course, if nothing enters the account, it is easy to spot the problem, which was my situation).

Common problems that occur with us, is failure to cease CL A or B contracts prior to start of CL C contracts (over pay). Failure of the clown in Ottawa to actually hit enter on the CL C start. Failure for us to properly account for all the paper work we need to account for prior to start of contract (CL C contract itself, statement of understanding, keep copies of these for your own records), if problem is tail end of roto (I got hit with this as well), leave passes, travel documents all count for correcting some idiot in Ottawa that will insist that you were in Mirage on the 2nd of May vise in MSG... No matter how unimportant a piece of paper appears, it can be very important to correcting our pay later.

Patience is also key. When my savings were depleted because of lack of pay for a month and half (the bills did not stop), it is not the fault of the guy or gal that is dealing with our case. Those in the clerk trade have their work cut out for them, and they do a damned good job doing it, trust them when it comes to stuff like this... Stay on top of it by all means, but trust them, and do not blame the poor guy/gal in front of you for what some dork in Ottawa did to you (no, I still do not know his/her name, nor do I want to know).

Never take for granted when someone suggests a contract extension while on CL C would not be a problem. Sign the contract and SOU for the extension, and things will get much easier for you on the other end.

Just my own quick, bitter thoughts on the subject... Blood boiling now, so gonna get some PT in me.

 

[Colin Parkinson]

George, as usual you raise good points. I just went on Cl C once again - and once again it was a mess. They couldn't stop my Cl B in time, so I owe 11 days of pay back - no idea when they'll claw it back. Then, they took over 1.5 months to actually pay me my Cl C. This is pretty much the same thing that happened to me last time I went Cl C. Claims are just as much of a mess.

I cannot fathom how the system can be so perpetually screwed up - I'm led to believe that several hundred Cl C troops from each Roto experience this crap.

Pay is not the same complex math that puts the space shuttle into orbit.....

We need a better way of doing business - now!

Rule of thumb, Finance will always deduct overpayment from your cheque in December.

I have had our compensation lie to me to cover their butts, if they retract money insist on a new T4, generating a corrected T4, requires a report to the AG office, which is why they don't like to do it.

 

[dapaterson]

I have in an archive an email from G1 staff in a CBG, where their solution to a member's problem was "Tell him to tell Revenue Canada that DND screwed up."

While members do have a responsibility to watch their own pay, the staff also have a role to play in being proactive.  The case above was particularly galling, as the unit had "solved" the problem of overpayments by setting the member's RPSR pay account to manual while they were being paid class C by CCPS - meaning the member never saw the money, but was having it attributed as income all the same.  (Today, an interface between CCPS and RPSR prevents this, but other issues arise instead)

Let me restate what I've already said before:  Rattle chains and insist on your chain of command raising the issue with their higher formations.  Document the facts in a clear manner, and push them up the chain of command, requesting an explanation of what measures are being taken to correct the situation in the future for others.

 

[PuckChaser]

Just transitioned from CL C to CL B (extention of prev CFTPO number), and I ended up missing 5 days pay from the beginning of the month. My clerks said they need to call Ottawa to try and get access to my pay, as for some reason I'm listed as being part of Valcartier. Having just come back from tour, I can't imagine how someone would be expected to remain calm if they were living paycheque to paycheque.

Always remember to check your direct deposit very soon after pay day to sort this stuff out. As dapaterson said, rattling chains will help, especially with Pay Issues. You are your own best advocate, since no one else sees your pay statements.

 

[Colin Parkinson]

Just transitioned from CL C to CL B (extention of prev CFTPO number), and I ended up missing 5 days pay from the beginning of the month. My clerks said they need to call Ottawa to try and get access to my pay, as for some reason I'm listed as being part of Valcartier. Having just come back from tour, I can't imagine how someone would be expected to remain calm if they were living paycheque to paycheque.

Always remember to check your direct deposit very soon after pay day to sort this stuff out. As dapaterson said, rattling chains will help, especially with Pay Issues. You are your own best advocate, since no one else sees your pay statements.

We were comparing pay stubs and one guy realized they were taking BC taxes and Quebec taxes (explains why he was always broke) the pay office freaked out when he told he compared statements with us, told him it was illegal  :
Never did they apologize about screwing 1year of his life up. He did get a hefty cheque when it was sorted out. Scary part is the person responsible is now the manger of that pay section.

 

[Love793]

We were comparing pay stubs and one guy realized they were taking BC taxes and Quebec taxes (explains why he was always broke) the pay office freaked out when he told he compared statements with us, told him it was illegal  :
Never did they apologize about screwing 1year of his life up. He did get a hefty cheque when it was sorted out. Scary part is the person responsible is now the manger of that pay section.

Unless the guy looked at your paystub with out your consent (or vise-versa), there's no issue. Sounds like the clerk was trying a little CYA.

 

[CountDC]

Common problems that occur with us, is failure to cease CL A or B contracts prior to start of CL C contracts (over pay). Failure of the clown in Ottawa to actually hit enter on the CL C start. Failure for us to properly account for all the paper work we need to account for prior to start of contract (CL C contract itself, statement of understanding, keep copies of these for your own records), if problem is tail end of roto (I got hit with this as well), leave passes, travel documents all count for correcting some idiot in Ottawa that will insist that you were in Mirage on the 2nd of May vise in MSG... No matter how unimportant a piece of paper appears, it can be very important to correcting our pay later.

Patience is also key. When my savings were depleted because of lack of pay for a month and half (the bills did not stop), it is not the fault of the guy or gal that is dealing with our case. Those in the clerk trade have their work cut out for them, and they do a damned good job doing it, trust them when it comes to stuff like this... Stay on top of it by all means, but trust them, and do not blame the poor guy/gal in front of you for what some dork in Ottawa did to you (no, I still do not know his/her name, nor do I want to know).

Failure to Cease Cl B contracts is a fault of your home unit. The Clown in Ottawa should not press the start key until your unit clerk has done their part and stopped your Cl B.  He/She also should not be starting it until confirmation has been received that you have actually started your employment. That being said - a clerk some where was not taking very good care of you if you went a month and a half with out pay - there is a thing where the clerk gets a local payment done up - either a DFT to your account or a cheque that they take to your bank and deposit on your behalf (I have done both to take care of mbrs overseas) - my guess would be that this should have been someone in Ottawa as by this time they would be the unit responsible for your pay. Note that this is not a required action but is an option that clerks have available and should use as a be nice to the customer.

The idiot in Ottawa that insists you were in Mirage can only go on the offical info they are given - if no departure message or email is sent then as far as they know that is where you were. Having worked in FSS I know that the clerks (yes it is clerks you are calling the nice names) are not allowed to action anything with out official correspondence.  Even though I knew someone was no longer in theatre (standing at my desk) I still could not action the cease of entitlements until I received my departure email from theatre. Leave passes and travel docs do not cover it as they may not actually reflect the date member departed theatre and entitlements were to cease.

For 23 years I have heard Ottawa always blamed for members pay problems and guess what - not one of them were because of Ottawa - everyone were because of members home unit or unit they were attached to. Just much easier to blame Ottawa than admit that they made a mistake and correct it. Yes us clerks have our work cut out for us and I like to think most of us do a good job at it so yes trust us - but remember we do have off days and make mistakes so temper that trust by keeping an eye on your pay and asking questions when something does not look right.  Do not accept the simple answer of someone else to blame - get them to explain/show you what went wrong in detail.  If the clerk can not explain it then be very wary - especially if the answer is a simple "I don't know but it will be fixed" (I have heard this and the customer excepted it). Even as a clerk I keep a close eye on my pay and have had to go see my pay clerk as there were mistakes made on it.  Even we can screw up each others pay be sure we can do it to you.

Basic: watch your pay, ask the questions(as someone else said rattle the chains but in a nice way) and do not automatically blame Ottawa.

Oh yeah - yelling and threatening the clerk will not help your cause - odds are we will think nice thoughts back at you and put your problem in the "to do when I bleeping feel like it" basket.

 

[geo]

It's your pay and you have to keep an eye open - make sure that things are working (or not)
It's the clerk's job to process the paperwork properly and in a timely basis.
It's the supervisor's job to make sure he provides his clerk with the proper paperwork on a timely basis....

Everyone has his role in making things work..... and if things go bust.... maybe, just maybe, all of us contributed our share of the fiasco.

Over the years, I have made it one of my principle responsibilities to ensure that the people working for me are being looked after.  I look after them and they look after me.... and it works!