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Why the sarcasm Re: JTF2?

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LawnDart

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I was following with some interest the thread on JTF2 which was locked recently when it degenerated into nonsense.

I've noticed a common theme among many contributor's with respect to that particular CF Unit.

I'm not trying to bait anyone here, but I am curious. Why the derisive and sarcastic tone in the various posts re: JTF2?

My view on it is as follows. I left the regs in 1996. Had I remained in, I would have tried out for JTF2. The guys in the units I served with in the early to mid 90's when JTF2 was being established generally held them in pretty high esteem. And most of the really good soldiers I remember from that time tried selection eventually. Not everybody made it of course, and there's no shame there. It was designed to be tough. At the same time, there were a few guys I knew who weren't willing to spend the time away from home or get posted to the Ottawa area because of demands made by their family. Again, nothing wrong with that. I'd never criticise anyone who puts their family first.
Other than that though, the only guys I remember who had absolutely no interest in, or regard for JTF2 were the out of shape types in QM or Transport Platoon who had totally lost interest in soldiering.

That's why I'm perplexed by the sarcasm on these posts. I assume people who participate in these forums are still fairly interested in the profession of arms, so why the disparaging tone with regard to JTF2?

Has general opinion among those in Battalions changed that much over the last 9 years? If so why? Is it just "tall poppy syndrome", or something else?

It seems to me that in a peace bound army like Canada's, JTF2 would be a pretty good go. They're about the only unit that offers a decent possibility of real action. They offer the most interesting and varied training available in the forces today, and to someone stuck in Shilo or Gagetown, I would think Ottawa would appear a pretty good place to live.

I'm interested in getting a serious opinion on the matter.
 
I love the JTF

I hate that every person and their dog is 'going to try out' and become a secret squirrel.

I see a lot of people who have NO CHANCE of making it, let alone going for tryouts
open their mouth all to often.  Thats why shake my head at the whole things.


I know 2 JTF guys.. great guys..  Its all the wannabes that drive me crazy.
 
I agree completely, we as a board must not forget that JTF-2 members are also human beings with feelings, and we should not be unfairly singleing them out as objects of ridicule. Allow me to extend my apologies to the JTF-2 members on the board who I may have offended.

I vote Lawndart for Army.ca harrasment counsellor.
 
Its not JTF members, IMHO, that are the taget of the cinisism here...its the regularly apearing "poser clows" we get that have created the sort of attitude you are describing.  Alot of guys here will remember the one user who came here with the user name " spec ops", he posted the instruction manual to a video game and tried to pass it a his " words of wisdom".....lets just say that it didnt hold for very long !  This happens on a fairly regular basis here and thus every single JTF thread i have seen on this board has degenerated into a circus.
 
Lawndart, alot of the disdain shown towards JTF-2 reminds me of life in the battalion where certain "soldiers" held the same attitude towards the Airborne Regiment. Simply put, I think alot of the people who showed such an attitude were simply jealous that they couldn't, didn't possess the parts to attempt anything remotely physically or mentally challenging.
 
aesop081 said:
Its not JTF members, IMHO, that are the taget of the cinisism here...its the regularly apearing "poser clows" we get that have created the sort of attitude you are describing.   Alot of guys here will remember the one user who came here with the user name " spec ops", he posted the instruction manual to a video game and tried to pass it a his " words of wisdom".....lets just say that it didnt hold for very long !   This happens on a fairly regular basis here and thus every single JTF thread i have seen on this board has degenerated into a circus.

Well said, AESOP.

LawnDart:

Part of the problem is government policy and the information vacuum that surrounds JTF2.  Even within the CF, very little is said and known about the unit, it's exploits and accomplishments and that, IMO, is a shame.

Clearly, in thier short history, they have evolved into a world class SOF unit with a reputation that nobody knows about.  People fear what they don't understand.  That leads to sarcasm.

Secondly, if more were officially known about thier exploits, many of the wannabe's would probably think twice about "wanting to show how it's done".  Doubtless this would save the JTF2 recruiters some time and effort spent weeding these folks out.

Keeping in mind the government's polciy regarding JTF2 and secrecy, I'm all for a sensible, UNCLASSIFIED, discussion of the unit without the rampant Walter Mitty fantasizing, wild speculation and outright disinformation that usually finds it's way onto any JTF2 thread.

Now, if you'll excuse me I have to slip on my ski mask and go to the gym.  ;D  (Sorry... I couldn't resist...)
 
My offical position on the JTF2

is that....

'I cannot confirm or deny that one or more of them have donated to
my breast cancer thread/60k Ruck.  But if you want to be cool like them, then
you should donate too'


Sorry.  I REALLY had to do that!
 
Folks, it's not really as much of a vacuum as some people are making it out to be. 

In fact, there is lots of good stuff (including videos) that is publicly available on DND's internet JTF 2 website: http://www.dcds.forces.gc.ca/units/jtf2/default_e.asp

p.s.  No quotes from on-line SF games manuals here...  ;D

Cheers,
Duey
 
I was gonna post someting stupid, but instead I'll say this: nobody is making fun of JTF and I don't know anybody who's jealous. Envious maybe, but not jealous. What people ARE making fun of is all the dumbasses jtfsniperninjacommandos who make dumbass statements about shit they know nothing of, or ask stupid questions.

It's kind of a running gag ;)
 
rw4th said:
jtfsniperninjacommandos

How in God's name (with apologies to Trinity) did THAT make it through the spell checker???

Seriously, though, Duey is partially right.  There is good info about JTF 2 available on the site he provided, but nobody is actively blowing thier horn.  Even the official stuff Duey references contains praise which is, at best, cryptic.

I considered starting a thread called "Stories from the files of JTF2" but I envisioned it spiralling into anecdotes starting with "I know a friend of a friend of a cousin I got drunk with...."  Besides, until someone officially lifts the veil of secrecy surrounding the unit, anything posted would likely be:

a. a security violation if the poster was a serving or former CF member;
b. of questionable veracity if the poster was someone else... unless that "someone" was the subject of JTF2's...  ahem... "attentions". :threat:
 
Its not JTF members, IMHO, that are the taget of the cinisism here...its the regularly apearing "poser clowns"

Exactly.

I remember that one clown comming here making comments like 'deeds not words' and saying he can't get into the nuts and bolts of his work. Basically insinuating he was  some kind of special operations yet with enough smoke and mirrors that he could deny it as he never actually came out and said anything.
Hammer head.

I've seen a guy from the JTF reading this site. JTF are the brunt of jokes among soldiers just like the infantry, armored, artillery,  supply techs, CS and CCS,  reg force and reserves are.

From my point of view, the jokes are more to raz the guys who live eat breath and shit this jtf stuff.
 
TCBF said:
Two words: "Penis Envy".

Tom

Your undiminished ability to wordsmith continues to impress. ;)

Really, I hope we don't have to endure any threads from those who want to win thier second VC this week in the newly announced "Special Operations Group".
 
Haggis said:
Your undiminished ability to wordsmith continues to impress. ;)

Really, I hope we don't have to endure any threads from those who want to win thier second VC this week in the newly announced "Special Operations Group".

Wait for it  ::)
 
Even within the CF, very little is said and known about the unit, it's exploits and accomplishments and that, IMO, is a shame.

Less is more, I don't think we need any details as to what they're doing. Sure it would do wonders for the CF in general to be able to showcase their exploits and accomplishments, but at the same time I don't think we need to see what they're up to. After all, they wouldn't be all that Special if their work was broadcast on the news everyday.

As far as weeding out individuals for recruiters, either the Coopers test takes care of that, or the first few hours at the hill so I don't think there's too much of a problem in that department.
 
Quote,
Two words: "Penis Envy".
Tom

.....tell them not to be envious, it took a lot of practice to have one this good....... ;D
 
I think the sarcasm comes from the way they try to keep a low profile.  Their desire to be non-descript only makes them stand out.
 
I know some jealousy is involved, but I think the majority of it comes from the fact that the typical poster is beign flamed/ridiculed for his assinine postings rather than the unit being targeted.  I know I couldn't pass the SOAC and am not motivated enough to get in good enough shape to try out (at 35 its time to pu tme out to pasture...) but I have the utmost respect for those who have.

I have a few friends/acquatainces at the Hill.  They don't need to come here and post defence for they are as one rather cornily said (and stole the US SF term) "we are the Silent Professionals".  They don't need to brag or spout off - "either do the SOAC or don't and if you haven't then..."   I suspect they meant "the majority of you guys are uselss" or worse, but as we were having a beer at my parents cottage I think they defered to not insult us (me and a buddy) with my parents around...

I tend not to post in the JTF threads since they degenerate into either some young children asking questions no one can answer - or some wannabe poser claiming to be a trout farmer and posting a bunch of crap.








 
The answers to the inital question can all be found here -- very fitting.  Enjoy.

http://www.professorthompson.com/trollprofile.html
 
KevinB said:
I know some jealousy is involved, but I think the majority of it comes from the fact that the typical poster is beign flamed/ridiculed for his assinine postings rather than the unit being targeted.  I know I couldn't pass the SOAC and am not motivated enough to get in good enough shape to try out (at 35 its time to pu tme out to pasture...) but I have the utmost respect for those who have.

I have a few friends/acquatainces at the Hill.

I guess being over 50 really puts one 'Over the Hill'.  ;D


Strike said:
The answers to the inital question can all be found here -- very fitting.   Enjoy.

http://www.professorthompson.com/trollprofile.html

As Tom said:   "No. 7."  
 
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