Woman stranded in Kenya sues

[ruckmarch]

Or should that read.....the Govt is selective at whom they help at times of need.

This comes off the back of the lady stranded in Kenya, the way the consulate handled the matter and the length her lawyers had to go just to prove that it's her in the passport. It seems to be me that in light of some current cases involving " people that aren't WHITE ", there is always some kind of "we don't care" attitude from the Govt and a section of the society?????

Am sure we all remember the case of the lady in Mexico, who despite having some unexplained 76k in her account from shady deals her boss was into, was still helped with no doubt in getting back to Canada.

In the case of Omar Khadr, conflicting reports have it that he threw a bomb, another said he was just found in a corner crying. Which one to believe? We weren't there to make that judgement. Let's not forget that he is a born Canadian.

I have overheard some discussions in the mess amongst some morons, saying "he should go back to where he came from", only for me to say to them but he was born in Toronto  : I doubt they would have said the same had he been white?

There has to be a one treatment for all Canadians, no matter what they look like

 

[Eye In The Sky]

I can't say I agree with your post.  Perhaps there is the "appearance" of what you are saying, presented mainly by the MSM which Joe and Jane Taxpayer are spoon fed to believe is some kind of truth.

Once you leave the borders of Canada, there is no magic button the Federal Government can push to just make things happen the way these people want to have happen.

And I agree with your last statement.  So you would be for getting rid of any/all *special interest groups* then, some of which receive $ from our tax dollars that not all Canadians benefit from?

I am suggesting (strongly) here that your suggestion that the Canadian Government is racist is insulting and incorrect.

As for people's personal believes, they are entitled to them, are they not? 

 

[GAP]

Brenda Martin's con job was about political embarrassment and the present government covered it off to take the heat off from the PR job it was.....nothing more.

There are hundreds, if not thousands of "Canadians" black/white/native/whatever constantly getting into all kinds of mischief all over the world. We are NOT our brothers keeper....not one of those people asked the Canadian Government for help in doing their crimes/etc., so why should the Canadian Government rush to the rescue?

Are there mistakes made. By this and every other government! Might I remind you of Chretien by the bedside of Kader in Afghanistan.....how embarrassing later to find out he's a banker/supplier for AQ/friend of Osama ....

There are plenty of white people out there crying foul/fowl over "Government Inaction".....strange...it's about the same number of people who say they are innocent.... So enough about the race garbage, cuz that's exactly what those comments were.

 

[ruckmarch]

The great thing about an open forum, is that opinions are welcomed. My post came off the back of this article

http://www.calgarysun.com/news/columnists/ricky_leong/2009/08/18/10493591-sun.html

The Govt might not be racist, but am sure we've all been in the midst of certain nitwits, that just spout verbal diarrhoea when there is a case to do with someone that doesn't look like them.

 

[Roy Harding]

There have been, no doubt, some extremely disappointing actions (or non-actions) by the Government (ALL governments, not just the current one) over the years.  I suspect that there is much more to these stories than ever gets published - I imagine DFAIT's hands are tied regarding what information gets released just as much as the CF's is.

I really don't think there's a "racist" policy in any Government department.  But it's certainly a handy "hook" for the MSM to hand a story on.

 

[Staff Weenie]

Funny, I thought this woman was arrested by the Kenyan authorities in that her appearance at the airport did not resemble her passport photo. Having seen said photo on TV, and her current appearance, I agree with the decision made at the time. The photo is extremely poor quality, and she is wearing a head scarf that has pushed the skin on her face forward, somewhat distorting her features in comparrison to her current appearance. I would also argue that it is the responsibility of every passport holder to ensure that their photo is a good likeness of themselves, and should something change in your appearance - get it re-done! Kenya has a Canadian High Commission in Nairobi, and she could easily have had the passport re-done there.

So, the Kenyan govt held her, and the Canadian govt was notified - in essence 'we've got somebody here who looks like their trying to use a fake passport to get into your country'. What measure do we have to correctly and truly identify the person - DNA testing - and it was done. The real world isn't CSI, and you can't get an answer in 60 min. I'd like to know how many people per week try to get into Canada on fake or stolen passports. And, if I'm correct, airlines get fined heavily when they fail to screen passengers correctly at the gate.

As well, before making any sort of allegation that the Govt of Canada moves slower on visible minorities you would need to establish the number of 'WASPs' in similar situations, and whether they have experienced delays in getting a response from Ottawa.

 

[The Bread Guy]

There have been, no doubt, some extremely disappointing actions (or non-actions) by the Government (ALL governments, not just the current one) over the years.  I suspect that there is much more to these stories than ever gets published - I imagine DFAIT's hands are tied regarding what information gets released just as much as the CF's is.

I really don't think there's a "racist" policy in any Government department.  But it's certainly a handy "hook" for the MSM to hand a story on.

Bang on - it's thing to say mistakes may have been made in individual circumstances, and something WAY different to say the policies behind those actions are racist.

What I'd like to hear from anyone with more experience in immigration/citizenship is this:  one MSM report I heard alleged that the fingerprints the woman in question provided as part of the process of becoming a Canadian citizen some time ago were not available when she offered to be fingerprinted during the passport seizure issue.  How long are such records kept typically?

 

[GAP]

apparently the fingerprint files are not kept past a short period of time according to one of the reports mentioned. That is why they could not be used as official copies, as was the suggestion by her lawyer that they just go to her house and take copies of her fingerprints there....how do they know whether those are her fingerprints or not?

What does not seem to be mentioned anywhere is the chicanery that goes on regarding people posing as legitimate Canadians with stolen/loaned/borrowed passports coming into this country and promptly going underground..

Was there not one report that the Khadr women had lost their passports 10 times?. I have to wonder how many times Khadr women came into Canada as apparently Canadian Border Security/Immigration does not keep records of who came in and when....

 

[ruckmarch]

Funny, I thought this woman was arrested by the Kenyan authorities in that her appearance at the airport did not resemble her passport photo. Having seen said photo on TV, and her current appearance, I agree with the decision made at the time. The photo is extremely poor quality, and she is wearing a head scarf that has pushed the skin on her face forward, somewhat distorting her features in comparrison to her current appearance. I would also argue that it is the responsibility of every passport holder to ensure that their photo is a good likeness of themselves, and should something change in your appearance - get it re-done! Kenya has a Canadian High Commission in Nairobi, and she could easily have had the passport re-done there.

So, the Kenyan govt held her, and the Canadian govt was notified - in essence 'we've got somebody here who looks like their trying to use a fake passport to get into your country'. What measure do we have to correctly and truly identify the person - DNA testing - and it was done. The real world isn't CSI, and you can't get an answer in 60 min. I'd like to know how many people per week try to get into Canada on fake or stolen passports. And, if I'm correct, airlines get fined heavily when they fail to screen passengers correctly at the gate.

As well, before making any sort of allegation that the Govt of Canada moves slower on visible minorities you would need to establish the number of 'WASPs' in similar situations, and whether they have experienced delays in getting a response from Ottawa.

Did you not hear the part whee the consulate told the Kenyan authorities to arrest her because they think she is trying to pull a fast one?

Where were Brenda Martin supporters in this instance?

 

[ruckmarch]

Bang on - it's thing to say mistakes may have been made in individual circumstances, and something WAY different to say the policies behind those actions are racist.

Funny how the mistakes always happen when the case in question involves someone from a visible minority eh?

Nazi war criminals are allowed to hide here for crying out loud, until they are found out, and even then they get to stay a while. I bet you there are still a few in the Kitchener/Waterloo ( AKA Berlin ) area roaming around.

 

[The Bread Guy]

Funny how the mistakes always happen when the case in question involves someone from a visible minority eh?

1)  Not always:
http://www.travelwatchlist.ca/stories
http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/article/650794

2)  There's been situations where Canada has helped out visible minority Canadian citizens:
http://forums.army.ca/forums/index.php?action=printpage;topic=47725.0

In light of these examples, I take it you've checked out the policies and picked out the racist elements, then?  Anything more to share with us to open our eyes or convince us? 

 

[Staff Weenie]

Ruckmarch, other than trying to assert that our Govt is a racially motivated entity that only serves its white citizens, do you have a point to make?

Brenda Martin was not a case of mistaken identity. She was arrested, tried, and convicted according to Mexican law. She was found guilty of having funds from a pyramid scheme, run by her employer, in her bank account. She received the full due process under Mexican law. As I am neither a lawyer nor judge, I cannot say whether the conviction was valid based upon the evidence, nor whether an appeal would have met with success. Her family was able to swing enough media attention to get her brough home to serve her sentence, and as she had already been incarcerated for over 1/3 of the sentence, she was immediately paroled.

Yes, Brenda Martin was a white person, but this was not a case of a person being unable to clearly prove their identity. This was a criminal matter.

Nazi war criminals did end up in Canada, and in virtually every other major country in the world. Ferreting them out has taken decades and millions of dollars. Do you think it's easy to clearly prove identity in a court of law in Canada, 64 years later, when most records were destroyed either when we bombed cities to charcoal, or by the soldiers themselves to hide their identities. Burden of proof rests upon the Crown in criminal court, not the individual. At this point in time, getting a solid ID is extremely difficult - that doesn't mean we should give up. That said, I'd be more worried about the recent war criminals from Central and South America, or Africa, or Asia, or Eastern Europe who have slipped into our midst.

Ms Mohamud spent 8 days in a Kenyan jail, and about 78 days in a hotel awaiting confirmation of her identity by Govt officials. Yes, her case should have been handled promptly, and an investigation is apparently on the way. This was a case where there was doubt as to the individual's claim, due to the poor qaulity of their passport photo, in a country where people do often try to sneak into Canada. The burden of proof in this case was met by DNA testing. This in no way implies any racism.

Canada's past has clear incidents of institutional racism - re our Aboriginal peoples, our Japanese, Ukrainians, Jews, etc etc - but successive federal govts have emplaced policies to eliminate such actions (see the Charter of Rights and Freedoms). Asserting that our current Govt and the Public Service that runs the beaurocracy is racist based on only two cases or dubious merit is nothing but inflamatory.

 

[armyvern]

Funny how the mistakes always happen when the case in question involves someone from a visible minority eh?

Nazi war criminals are allowed to hide here for crying out loud, until they are found out, and even then they get to stay a while. I bet you there are still a few in the Kitchener/Waterloo ( AKA Berlin ) area roaming around.

Nah, it's just the "racial overtone" stories that make for better copy-selling and thus garner more than their fair share of MSM attention. It's always good fiscal sense to infer a "racist" government is sitting - if you happen to work in the MSM these days.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

I think my hat is getting too tight.

 

[Yrys]

the Govt is selective at whom they help at times of need.

Let's  not be hypocrites here...

Every human beeing is selectif at ''whom they help at times of need''.
We won't react the same way toward a terrorist bleeding from his own bomb
vs an infant who was victim of it, or somebody who is in need of food at home
vs in a country that has famine.

And the monolitic mythic gov doesn't exist. It 's compose of a lots of people,
with a lots of background, values, agenda, etc...

 

[ruckmarch]

Ruckmarch, other than trying to assert that our Govt is a racially motivated entity that only serves its white citizens, do you have a point to make?

Brenda Martin was not a case of mistaken identity. She was arrested, tried, and convicted according to Mexican law. She was found guilty of having funds from a pyramid scheme, run by her employer, in her bank account. She received the full due process under Mexican law. As I am neither a lawyer nor judge, I cannot say whether the conviction was valid based upon the evidence, nor whether an appeal would have met with success. Her family was able to swing enough media attention to get her brough home to serve her sentence, and as she had already been incarcerated for over 1/3 of the sentence, she was immediately paroled.

Yes, Brenda Martin was a white person, but this was not a case of a person being unable to clearly prove their identity. This was a criminal matter.

Nazi war criminals did end up in Canada, and in virtually every other major country in the world. Ferreting them out has taken decades and millions of dollars. Do you think it's easy to clearly prove identity in a court of law in Canada, 64 years later, when most records were destroyed either when we bombed cities to charcoal, or by the soldiers themselves to hide their identities. Burden of proof rests upon the Crown in criminal court, not the individual. At this point in time, getting a solid ID is extremely difficult - that doesn't mean we should give up. That said, I'd be more worried about the recent war criminals from Central and South America, or Africa, or Asia, or Eastern Europe who have slipped into our midst.

Ms Mohamud spent 8 days in a Kenyan jail, and about 78 days in a hotel awaiting confirmation of her identity by Govt officials. Yes, her case should have been handled promptly, and an investigation is apparently on the way. This was a case where there was doubt as to the individual's claim, due to the poor qaulity of their passport photo, in a country where people do often try to sneak into Canada. The burden of proof in this case was met by DNA testing. This in no way implies any racism.

Canada's past has clear incidents of institutional racism - re our Aboriginal peoples, our Japanese, Ukrainians, Jews, etc etc - but successive federal govts have emplaced policies to eliminate such actions (see the Charter of Rights and Freedoms). Asserting that our current Govt and the Public Service that runs the beaurocracy is racist based on only two cases or dubious merit is nothing but inflamatory.

Mr Longpost.....I am a tax paying Canadian just like the next person, and am entitled to my opinions, even if they don't concur with yours!

My thread came off the back of stories in the news, it doesn't mean I believe all of what is written. If you want to live in a bubble and pretend all is well and honky dory, then good for you.

There have been talk radio shows over the past few days where people have phoned in and voiced their take on the whole issue. Just to show you that there are people out there that think otherwise, here i a link

http://www.thepost.ca/ArticleDisplay.aspx?e=1704071

http://www.thelinkpaper.ca/index.php?subaction=showfull&id=1250538064&archive=&start_from=&ucat=2&cat=2

 

[Fishbone Jones]

And we all know the saying that 'Opinions are like assholes............' Not saying you're wrong or right. However, I know that if I wanted to make an informed decision on which side of an issue I was on, the last place I would go for information would be the press or the media, both who have been shown, time and again, to be absolutely mercenary and down right deceitful in their quest to make and define the news, not just report it, as they're supposed to do.

 

[observor 69]

Diplomat's tour of duty in Nairobi 'is over'
TheStar.com

Liliane Khadour is back in Ottawa after password bungle that stranded Toronto woman in Kenya

August 19, 2009
John Goddard
Staff Reporter


The Canadian diplomat who officially disowned Suaad Hagi Mohamud as an "imposter" has been recalled from Kenya.

Liliane Khadour has "concluded" her posting, a consular official at the Canadian High Commission said yesterday from the capital, Nairobi.

"Her tour of duty is over," he said, explaining that Foreign Affairs employees rotate posts every two or three years, and Khadour had been in Nairobi for two. "I am not very sure where she went."

Khadour is now in Ottawa.

Although she owns a condominium apartment there with her partner, Jason Joyce, the two are staying at a downtown hotel. Both had been working at the commission in Nairobi as first secretaries.

When reached by cellphone yesterday, Joyce hung up almost immediately. Neither answered the phone in their hotel room or returned messages.

The Canada Border Services Agency has opened an internal investigation into the handling of Mohamud's case.

The Somali-born Canadian citizen, an employee of an Etobicoke courier company, had been visiting her mother in Nairobi when she ran into trouble.

On May 21, a Kenyan employee of KLM airlines challenged Mohamud's passport photo at the Nairobi departure gate as she was trying to board a flight home to Toronto and her 12-year-old son, she has said.

Canadian consular officials interviewed her at the airport on May 22 and sided against her. On May 25, Mohamud appealed to the high commission to take her fingerprints.

And on May 28, Khadour sent a letter to Kenyan authorities that sealed Mohamud's fate.

"Please be advised that we have carried out conclusive investigations including an interview," Khadour wrote, signing herself vice-consul, first secretary (consular).

"And (we) have confirmed that the person brought to the Canadian High Commission on suspicion of being an imposter is not the rightful holder of the aforementioned passport.

"The Canadian High Commission is releasing the passport to your office for the purposes of prosecution," Khadour wrote to Michael Ojwang, director of Kenyan immigration services.

The letter alleged Mohamud was carrying a passport not her own and was in Kenya illegally.

These are serious charges that could have led to a Kenyan prison sentence or deportation to her native Somalia.

Mohamud was arrested and held for eight days in a women's prison before friends were able to post her bail.

But, it turns out, there was no conclusive Canadian investigation. Mohamud was no imposter.

And although it took her three months and a DNA test to prove her identity to Canadian consular officials and two federal departments, Mohamud was in fact the rightful holder of the Canadian passport she was carrying.

Last Friday, after conclusive DNA results, the Kenyans dropped all charges against the 31-year-old single mother and the next day she returned to her son, Mohamed Hussein, and a hero's welcome at Pearson International Airport.

Since then, she has been undergoing tests for a persistent cough and weight loss, symptoms that have nagged her since her eight-day stay in Nairobi's Langata Women's Prison in June.

Chest x-rays have ruled out any serious lung illness such as tuberculosis or pneumonia, her lawyer Raoul Boulakia has said.

"She's extremely relieved to be in Canada and to be with her son," he said yesterday.

Legal proceedings have begun in federal court to obtain Mohamud's disputed passport and case file, Boulakia said, adding the case is expected to be heard next month.

Asked whether his client plans to sue, Boulakia said:

"I'd like to see her get compensation. She deserves it ... but I'd rather see her not go to court."

With files from The Canadian Press

http://www.thestar.com/printArticle/682818

 

[The Bread Guy]

Diplomat's tour of duty in Nairobi 'is over'
TheStar.com

Liliane Khadour is back in Ottawa after password bungle that stranded Toronto woman in Kenya....

I take it the headline writer meant "passport" - I guess SpellCheck didn't catch it, right?

 

[observor 69]

And more on the same theme, wich is not racist but pure incompetence:

The already-forgotten case of William Sampson, the born-in-Nova Scotia, Vancouver-raised Canadian who was tortured, and ordered beheaded, during 31 months of solitary confinement in Saudi Arabia, is particularly instructive.

Mr. Sampson, who then held joint British/Canadian citizenship, was working for a Saudi development bank in Riyadh in December of 2000 when he, and three other foreigners, were arrested and charged in two car bombings, one of which killed a British engineer. Mr. Sampson confessed, under torture, to being a British spy, but once the British government refuted that notion, the allegation morphed into an accusation that he and the others were bootleggers involved in a turf war.

He later fought back against his treatment and launched a so-called dirty protest, whereby he refused to bathe and wiped his feces on the Koran. He refused to speak to Canadian consular officials or his lawyers.

But by then, it appears, Canadian officials had fallen for the bootlegger allegation hook, line and sinker - one of them actually repeated it to Mr. Sampson's father, Jim, telling him that his son was akin to a Hell's Angel.

After his release - it is unclear why it happened, but Canadian news organizations were campaigning on his behalf, Mr. Sampson's lawyer had pleaded for clemency, and there were rumours there may have been a quiet deal among the United States, Britain and Saudi Arabia that saw five Saudis released from Guantanamo Bay - Mr. Sampson was scathingly critical of the blind eye Canadian officials had determinedly turned to his plight and to those few voices who were, back in Canada, trying to help him.

"I was fighting alone, in solitary confinement, against the behaviour of your officials," he later told the Commons foreign affairs committee.

Mr. Sampson appeared before the committee only two days after Maher Arar, who was tortured in his native Syria, and by then, Iranian-Canadian photojournalist Zahra Kazemi was also dead - found in her Iranian prison cell on July 11 of 2003, with all the telltale marks of torture on her body, though Iranian officials first claimed she had suffered a stroke.

"It would appear there is now a track record with the Department of Foreign Affairs," Mr. Sampson told the committee, "that requires immediate investigation and an immediate interrogation of all officers involved in the case."

Some of the Canadian officials who, according to Mr. Sampson, hadn't lifted a finger to help him, basically attempted to take credit for his release, claiming they'd known he was being tortured, but had remained quiet out of fear publicity could see his treatment worsen.

No wonder his dad, in a film later made about his son's ordeal, snarled in it about "the scum that work for the Canadian Foreign Affairs Department, the lowest scum on Earth."

Bill Sampson eventually renounced his Canadian citizenship.

And here we are again, with Ms. Mohamud's case, her release coming only after the Canadian media gave her plight extensive attention. Her lawyer hasn't been given the file yet, and said this week he fears there's already a "whisper campaign" from federal officials leaking stories about her to the media. The lady herself has kept those notorious lips shut, and shown remarkable dignity.

As with Mr. Sampson, that resilience undoubtedly served her well while she was in prison and in limbo, but has won her no friends in official Ottawa.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/its-time-to-shine-a-light-on-those-who-turn-a-blind-eye/article1256622/