Canada moves to 2% GDP end of FY25/26 - PMMC

[Czech_pivo]

Nah, that extra 0.4% was just from HMCS Calgary's unanticipated docking work period costs.

Sorry to hear that occurred. Hope that the crew is safe and the ship is able to sail once again soon.

 

[Czech_pivo]

I saw on Noah Gairn's substack will put everything at 62 billion. Who knows though. We probably won't for a few weeks.

So nothing at all mentioned about actual net new systems or capabilities?

 

[PrairieFella]

So nothing at all mentioned about actual net new systems or capabilities?

That will come in time. The ink isn't even dry on the PMs speech haha. Just because the taps are opened doesn't mean we can ignore our procurement laws and policies.

 

[Seyek]

Technical briefing math says we only need to spend around 9 billion more this year to get to 2%…the math will be interesting to see.

Did they say what our GDP was or how they counted it?

IMF has our nominal gdp at 2.333 trillion. So 45 to 50 billion as 2% wouldn’t be too far off the mark.

That's in USD for the IMF number. That's about $3.19 trillion CAD, which aligns with this StatsCan page at about $3.15 trillion.

2% of that is about $63 billion, which would require a lot more than an extra $9 billion for this year or there's a whole whack of spending I'm not tracking.

EDIT: I get wanting troops for a photo op - standard stuff, cool. Am I the only one wondering if it was really necessary to keep them there to be a background for the press conference? It's not like they're being kept at attention or anything, just feels like keeping dozens of troops standing in place to be a background image for your press conference feels unnecessary.

EDIT 2: In the current press conference when asked about NATO 3.5% he stated that they would be discussing it, and our own needs will require above 2% spending in the coming years. For the 1.5% in non-defence specific spending he stated he feels confident we're already near or at that level. Really emphasizingng a defence industrial policy and investing in things like AI, quantum computing, etc.

 

[MacNav63]

Here's the link to the news release if it hasn't already been posted: Canada’s new government is rebuilding, rearming, and reinvesting in the Canadian Armed Forces - Canada.ca

 

[NearingZenith]

Uhm given the type of work - I am pretty sure you will find the dockyards you need for the River's to be built would be the same needed to layup the CPF's and rip out their rotting bits.

Aren’t the Halifax-class already undergoing regular Docking Work Periods at Irving, Seaspan, and Davies alongside new ship construction at those yards? This would augment/properly fund those DWP to try to rebaseline them to add ~10 years of service life rather just addressing immediate maintenance needs as current DWP seem to be stuck doing.

 

[Underway]

Sorry to hear that occurred. Hope that the crew is safe and the ship is able to sail once again soon.

No, no! Lol. The crew is fine. The costs were unanticipated (more stuff broken then originally thought)... the DWP was planned. Lol. Also a joke about costs (sort of... they used the whole budget).

 

[Underway]

Aren’t the Halifax-class already undergoing regular Docking Work Periods at Irving, Seaspan, and Davies alongside new ship construction at those yards? This would augment/properly fund those DWP to try to rebaseline them to add ~10 years of service life rather just addressing immediate maintenance needs as current DWP seem to be stuck doing.

On the west coast the yard is different that does DWP's. On the east cost its the same yard but a completely different part of the yard for new build.

 

[Czech_pivo]

That will come in time. The ink isn't even dry on the PMs speech haha. Just because the taps are opened doesn't mean we can ignore our procurement laws and policies.

I understand. I look at what's covered under this magical 9$ billion and what I see is this:

1) Almost 1/3 of the spending is to address the fact that we've had a decades+ long shortfall (that has had lip service paid to it in the past, a number of times), of not being a at 'mandated' level of 71,500 FT and 30k R/PT individuals. There have been timelines and money in the past on how this will be addressed. So for me, this should NOT be counted as new money or new capability as its a 'dream', a 'aspiration' that may or may not be achieved. Trump passes away in the night 3 months from now and will this 2.6$ billion be still spent at bringing up manpower back to 71,500?

2) 844$m on repairing and maintaining the CAF. That's just money to help keep the lights on and to keep old, clapped out equipment from being old, broken, non-functioning equipment. I don't see the use of the word(s) 'enhancing' or 'improving' or 'replacing' in the sentence about the 844$m.

3) 1$B geared towards CDN suppliers under the premise of ONSAF. This is obtuse and doesn't explain at all what this is encompass.

4) The remaining 4.1$B, this COULD have some meat and potatoes in it, remains to be seen. The entire pot of 4.1$B could vanish into our joining the Euro's in participating in their development of the next 6th generation fighter.

 

[Halifax Tar]

If there isn’t the capacity to build more surface combatants in Canada in the near-term and we don’t want to buy ships from abroad, then they could probably spend a few billion dollars to give the Halifax-class another mid-life refit so that some can actually last to ~2040 when the last River-class destroyer arrives. This refit could primarily focus on hull and machinery with a lesser focus on combat systems. Yes just buying warships from say South Korea is a more efficient use of money and probably faster, but a Halifax-class refit done in Canadian shipyards, by Canadian workers, using Canadian steel, and non-American/non-ITAR equipment is a much easier sell to Canadians and addresses a real and practical need.

The Halifax class are well used and tired. Most need more than a mid life refit and need new hulls and machinery.

Nah, that extra 0.4% was just from HMCS Calgary's unanticipated docking work period costs.

Wait until you see what we are going to do and spend to keep FRE alive.

 

[Brad Sallows]

Especially as they have a proper union, they are entirely justified to fight changes they view as infringing upon their livelihoods if that is viewed as jeopardizing it. The Govt has to respect their organizations and unlike the CAF, they can't just mindlessly dictate due to the presence of the union.

What you're describing are management rights. Maybe public sector unions have gotten a little weird because of the political power they enjoy, but they aren't entitled indefinitely to whatever has been conceded by weak politicians. Governments occasionally reorganize and realign agencies under ministries. Being more proximate to the CAF on a line diagram isn't a cause for grievance. The government can mindlessly dictate; if employees don't like it, they can move on.

 

[FSTO]

The Halifax class are well used and tired. Most need more than a mid life refit and need new hulls and machinery.



Wait until you see what we are going to do and spend to keep FRE alive.

Just think how much money we'd have saved if we started the RCD replacement program 10 years earlier.

 

[ytz]

Should be going on right now. Apparently friend of the forum Noah Gairn is in there as media, we should get some good rundowns from him tonight.

Better Noah than he who shall not be named.

 

[ytz]

That will come in time. The ink isn't even dry on the PMs speech haha. Just because the taps are opened doesn't mean we can ignore our procurement laws and policies.

There will also have to be new authorities to go with this. And there's mention in the media of joining the Defence Investment Bank the Brits are leading. Given Carney's history...

 

[PPCLI Guy]

Just think how much money we'd have saved if we started the RCD replacement program 10 years earlier.

They are zipperheads, and from the second rate Bde, but do we need to disband the Royal Canadian Dragoons?

 

[PrairieFella]

They are zipperheads, and from the second rate Bde, but do we need to disband the Royal Canadian Dragoons?

CaNaDa'S sEnIoR rEgImEnT

 

[Lumber]

What you're describing are management rights. Maybe public sector unions have gotten a little weird because of the political power they enjoy, but they aren't entitled indefinitely to whatever has been conceded by weak politicians. Governments occasionally reorganize and realign agencies under ministries. Being more proximate to the CAF on a line diagram isn't a cause for grievance. The government can mindlessly dictate; if employees don't like it, they can move on.

Union's role should be to ensure the rights of workers are respected, and that workers are treated fairly and justly. That's it. If, for example, a company decides it wants to adopt technology or reorganization to market he company more effective, and that change result in people losing their jobs, it's not the union's role to lobby against that change. The only thing the union should be doing is ensuring that whatever lay-off framework/agreements are due to the employees by law/regulation/contract are actually and accurately adhered to. That's it.

 

[KTown Cowboy]

DM/CDS Message: Government Announces Major Increase in Defence Spending | Message from the DM/CDS: Government Announces Major Increase in Defence Spending​

Today, Prime Minister Mark Carney announced that the Government is reinvesting to rebuild and rearm the Canadian Armed Forces (CAF), making the largest generational investment in Canada's military spending.

We will make foundational investments, expand and enhance existing and emerging military capabilities, strengthen Canada's relationship with the defence industry, and diversify our defence partnerships. This is an investment in the defence of Canada and Canadians that is essential to maintaining the country's prosperity and ability to lead on the world stage.

Today's announcement supports much of the strategic vision outlined in the Our North, Strong and Free policy and the North American Aerospace Defense Command modernization initiative. We now have more funding to move these projects forward more quickly and provide the CAF with the necessary equipment.

This funding will also help strengthen Canada's economy by creating jobs and strengthening defence supply chains. We will also build a strategic relationship with the Canadian defence industry that will benefit the Canadian economy. We will continue to lay a strong foundation for the future, strengthening Canada's self-reliance and moving forward at the same pace as our allies and adversaries.

We are confident that through this plan, we are providing the CAF with the foundation to be agile, multi-purpose, and combat-ready armed forces, prepared to protect Canada's sovereignty, defend North America, and contribute to the security of allies and partners today and tomorrow.

Thank you all for your continued dedication to protecting Canada.

 

[PrairieFella]

So @dapaterson, anything you're allowed to tell us about any plans to spend the moolah?

 

[The Bread Guy]

Here's the link to the news release if it hasn't already been posted: Canada’s new government is rebuilding, rearming, and reinvesting in the Canadian Armed Forces - Canada.ca

And here's the PM's statement from the info-machine for more tea leaves to read:

Canada’s new government is rebuilding, rearming, and reinvesting in the Canadian Armed Forces

Today, the Prime Minister, Mark Carney, announced that Canada’s new government is rebuilding, rearming, and reinvesting in the Canadian Armed Forces.

www.pm.gc.ca

Its nice to see CBC spelles "armoured" correctly. Unlike stupid Globe and Mail....

Someone should send the "words that have u's in them these days" memo to DND

Complete list of Honorary Colonels - Canada.ca

Complete list of civilians that have been selected as Honorary colonels.

www.canada.ca

And to be fair to the Globe & Mail, in another time, long, long ago, the Canadian Press style guide would call for U.S. instead of British spelling of such words. Not anymore, but still ...