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2025 U.S. - Venezuela conflict

Apparently, killing shipwrecked Kriegsmarine or IJN sailors is used as an example of a war crime in the US military’s LOAC manual.
Why is that relevant?

If the point of an attack is to sink a boatload of drugs, the attack may continue until the boatload of drugs is sunk. The best information to emerge after the initial spate of bullshit indicates that "killing shipwrecked sailors" was not the purpose of a subsequent salvo. If information emerges that definitively proves an attack was ordered specifically to kill shipwrecked sailors, then critics will have something. Mere "I know what they really were thinking" won't do.

If boatloads of drugs may legitimately be destroyed out of hand, it doesn't matter where the drugs are going. People who don't want boatloads of drugs to be destroyed out of hand are going to have to figure out ways to free up the necessary policing, court, and detention capabilities. Either create more or make some triage decisions to cut back some other uses of all of those.
 
There is a reason that Hegseth said today he isn’t releasing the video of that double-tap on the boat back in September…and it isn’t the bs “ national security” reason he gave. And I predict that unfortunately for him and this administration that video will eventually see the light of day and there will be consequences.
 
If the point of an attack is to sink a boatload of drugs, the attack may continue until the boatload of drugs is sunk.
Sadly, the "West" no longer has the stomach for that sort of practical thinking.

During a "Force Protection" exercise I was once told that a small boat that had been "shooting" at us was no longer a valid target because they had altered slightly away from the ship... Like, the only difference was they had gone from shooting, to not shooting and driving away slightly... Only an out of touch society can justify that sort of silliness.
 
Sadly, the "West" no longer has the stomach for that sort of practical thinking.

During a "Force Protection" exercise I was once told that a small boat that had been "shooting" at us was no longer a valid target because they had altered slightly away from the ship... Like, the only difference was they had gone from shooting, to not shooting and driving away slightly... Only an out of touch society can justify that sort of silliness.

Preach Jennifer Lopez GIF by NBC


My brother! ❤️
 
Sadly, the "West" no longer has the stomach for that sort of practical thinking.

During a "Force Protection" exercise I was once told that a small boat that had been "shooting" at us was no longer a valid target because they had altered slightly away from the ship... Like, the only difference was they had gone from shooting, to not shooting and driving away slightly... Only an out of touch society can justify that sort of silliness.
I think I might have already shared this dit somewhere else on this site. Not sure if it's true, but it's a story told by a US observer who was stationed at one of the "safer" German run bases in northern Afghanistan. They had what appeared on camera to be a group of Taliban fighters setting up a mortar position within range of the base. The US observer asked if they were going to engage them, to which the Germans replied "We can't, they haven't actually fired at us."...Ok... so then the Taliban launched a mortar at the base, and everyone takes cover. After the dust cleared, the US observer then asks "NOW will you shoot at them?", to which the Germans replied, "No, look at the camera feed. They are dismantling their mortar, which means they are no longer a threat and not engageable."
 
Sadly, the "West" no longer has the stomach for that sort of practical thinking.

During a "Force Protection" exercise I was once told that a small boat that had been "shooting" at us was no longer a valid target because they had altered slightly away from the ship... Like, the only difference was they had gone from shooting, to not shooting and driving away slightly... Only an out of touch society can justify that sort of silliness.

Sadly it takes awhile, and quite a few casualties, for liberal democracies to properly acclimatize to killing bad guys ...
 
Sadly, the "West" no longer has the stomach for that sort of practical thinking.

During a "Force Protection" exercise I was once told that a small boat that had been "shooting" at us was no longer a valid target because they had altered slightly away from the ship... Like, the only difference was they had gone from shooting, to not shooting and driving away slightly... Only an out of touch society can justify that sort of silliness.

Not sure you would want to allow them time to re-load or re-position to continue to try and kill you...

This is a leadership problem.
 
Sadly, the "West" no longer has the stomach for that sort of practical thinking.

During a "Force Protection" exercise I was once told that a small boat that had been "shooting" at us was no longer a valid target because they had altered slightly away from the ship... Like, the only difference was they had gone from shooting, to not shooting and driving away slightly... Only an out of touch society can justify that sort of silliness.
And don't think the bad guys don't play on Western stupidity. We have too many soft headed individuals in positions of power.
 
Leadership.

Recall Uncle Rick and his speech?

We don't have leaders like that anymore, and the government ensures it.

I think it goes back further than that. The longer I live the more I think the 60s needs to be expunged from all records.
 
We used to have no problem. How did we de-acclimatize to this ?
Several reasons and I think it goes as far back as the Vietnam war. The 7/24 news cycle. The prosecution of soldiers while the perpetrators of mass murder are given a free pass due to "culture".

Thank the progressive elements - the ones that never have to deal with the real world.
 
And don't think the bad guys don't play on Western stupidity. We have too many soft headed individuals in positions of power.

I keep coming back to Alnsky's rule 4.

They make us live up to our rules.

We need a notwithstanding clause to allow for justifiable illiberalism.

Otherwise we will be herded to our own graves.
 
I keep coming back to Alnsky's rule 4.

They make us live up to our rules.

We need a notwithstanding clause to allow for justifiable illiberalism.

Otherwise we will be herded to our own graves.
Just checking, are you still talking about the U.S. military bombing of drug boats that aren’t heading to the U.S. in the first place and wouldn’t have remotely close to the range to do so if they wanted to?
 
Just checking, are you still talking about the U.S. military bombing of drug boats that aren’t heading to the U.S. in the first place and wouldn’t have remotely close to the range to do so if they wanted to?

I am suggesting that our enemies are playing off the board. They are not playimg by the rules while constantly reminding us that we created all these rules and that we have established commitment to the rule of law as a test of character.

From their standpoint we messed up their economies by enforcing our laws that deprived them of slave labour and the ability to burn their dead brother's wives. Tradition.

Or as Napier of Sind reportedly said:

"Be it so. This burning of widows is your custom; prepare the funeral pile. But my nation has also a custom. When men burn women alive we hang them, and confiscate all their property. My carpenters shall therefore erect gibbets on which to hang all concerned when the widow is consumed. Let us all act according to national customs."

....

"Napier opposed slavery. According to the memoir on Napier by William, the Sindh cultivator was bonded and oppressed, and the numerous Hindus were plundered people and their faith was condemned by Balochis alike. They were eager for peace and protection.[22] Napier removed the Amirs from power, dismantled their private assembly of armed men, proclaimed that taxes previously collected by the Amirs from the peasants be paid to the English instead, and that slavery was abolished throughout the land.[23] This was vehemently opposed by Balochi masters, but welcomed by slave-girls of the harems.[23]

"Napier found that the Sindh was divided into land parcels called kardarats, under a headman called kardar, who were under an Arabian cadi.[24] The cadi had powers to summarily fine and imprison, and in practice exercised powers of life, death and torture. The kardar collected land taxes and customs, frequently fining and torturing the villagers to a level of fear that they were slaves of the chief to whose estate their village belonged. Napier continued the old system of kardars, but made them official collectors giving them government salaries, allowing villagers to file complaints against any kardar.[24]

"While stationed at Karachi, Napier found that the land was owned by the state, Amirs were collecting land taxes with "shocking cruelty – mutilations and tortures", with land tax rates between half and two-thirds.[25] The due collectors enjoyed hereditary tenures in a feudal jagir system where the husbandman was a mere slave. These oppressive practices had led many Sindh farmers to abandon their farms and move to the desert. Napier challenged this oppression.[25]

"Napier opposed the slavery custom where, according to William's memoir, young girls would be dragged from "their homes for the harems of the great". His efforts to respect the rights of women and children required him to battle numerous Amirs who previously exercised "unmitigated cruelty and debauchery"."


....

Just a reminder that the last holdouts on African chattel slavery were the Arabs.

"In 1981, Mauritania became the last country in the world to officially abolish slavery, when a presidential decree abolished the practice. However, no criminal laws were passed to enforce the ban. In 2007, under international pressure, the government passed a law allowing slaveholders to be prosecuted."

Oman - 1970
Aden - 1967
Arab Emirates - 1963
Yemen - 1962
Saudi Arabia - 1962

Qatar - 1952
Kuwait - 1949


Tanganyika - 1922
Turkey - banned black slavery in 1850 and white slavery in 1908 but it persisted until outlawed by the fall of the Caliphate and the installation of Ataturk in 1924
Iraq/Mesopotamia - 1924
Jordan - 1929
Iran/Persia - 1929
Syria - 1931


Sudan - Continuing
Libya - Continuing
Nigeria - 1860 to 1937 and continuing
Morocco - 1922 to 1999
Ghana - 1874 to 1998
Egypt - from 1877 to the 1930s
Algeria - 1848 to the 1910s
Zanzibar - 1873 to 1909
Kenya - 1907
Madagascar - 1896 and onwards
Uganda - from British occupation pre 1894
Tunisia - 1846

And all done under the impetus of the colonial Christian powers, in particular Britain.

The Anglo-Saxons piled on the agony by rewriting the gold standard and enforcing their laws on Chinese society.

Humiliation.

That is what we are up against.

A world full of people who disagreed with our culture.
 
Not sure you would want to allow them time to re-load or re-position to continue to try and kill you...

This is a leadership problem.
Also a higher HQ problem with all the lawyers that are feeding their opinions to the Comd.
 
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